In the process of building an 4’ by 8’ HO layout, I’ve managed to work myself into a conundrum. That being how to provide a runaround track for the current sole industry I’ve planned for it. The industry, a flour mill. A known local still rail-served flour mill has such an arrangement, though the engine return track appeared rather overgrown when I did a quick photorecon of the site.
I came up with two possiblities on how to impliment said plan (still using demo Anyrail hence the red flex)
However, reality is a different kettle of fish…
That loco-less grouping of grain wagons is what I’d like to be able have in that spot with a loco attached, though it might be somewhat of a challenge as my shortest is about 11cm long.
There’s probably a simple solution that I’ve not seen, beyond not bothering with a runaround in the first but I feel that it’s probably a good idea to have one. After all the prototype uses them for a reason.
From a practical standpoint, you don’t need a runaround on the spur itself. In real life, an engine could run around the cars on the double-track between crossovers and then shove them in. This happened (and still happens) on the real railroad all the time. Most industrial tracks do not have their own runaround built-in, although some that are very long or very far from a siding (or double-track crossovers) might incorporate such a runaround. Since any spur built on an HO 4X8 is going be be pretty short (compared to the real thing you’ve looked at), I think that argues against having the runaround on the siding itself.
I’m don’t know what you plan for the tracks connected by the 3-way turnouts, but that is pretty complex and a simpler arrangement might work as well.
It’s a minor nit (that doesn’t matter on the model), but industries which load or unload bulk commodities like flour need room both in front of and behind the loading spot for cars to roll as they are loaded (or unloaded). Where you have sited the flour mill would not be practical in real life, but that would not bother a lot of people.
Going by what I think you want to do, nice long sidings in front of a big industry, that flour mill would go better on a long shelf layout - are you limited onto to the one sheet (which I guess is 2.4 x 1.2m), or can you run also a connection to a shelf?
Otherwise, can you sort of get away with just a few freight cars (or wagons - I sense you are not North American?) on that siding and give youself some space as suggested.
Besides, as mentioned the cars would more likely be shoved into that sort of siding (if single ended), and positioned by capstan, by trackmobile, or by some guy with a fancy lever as needed.
Second, with that layout, I would remove the runaround on the spur, as the mainline runaround will suffice. If you can change the layout, like the shelf suggestion, or another way of extending that spur outside of the mainline, then maybe need that runaround, but as is now, not needed, it will take up too much space on this layout. I’d remove it and just go with the one on the mainline.
Thanks all, that section of my layout, I’d basically pencilled as ‘Here be dragons’ for a while as I’d contemplated what to do there. I initially thought along the lines of goods yard, engine shop or grain silo, till I decided on a flour mill.
Going to off-board shelf sections is currently not possible, so I’m stuck on the 2.44m x 1.22 sheet. Though I’ve allowed for some future expansion, hence the 3-way crossover group and I’ve a basic fiddle yard module that I plan to attach to the left-hand side.
I’d have thought the livery on my rolling stock would be enough of a clue that I’m not North American but Australian, though thanks to the powers of internet shopping and blogs I’m aware that there’s a few NA & UK collectors of such rollingstock & operators of Australian-based layouts.
Well, that’s one thing off the to-do list, still many more to go.
–rod.h
What if you reversed the positioning of the flour mill/siding, so that the mill is closer to the inside of the oval, and the end of the (single line) siding is on more of a tangent to the triple line at the top of your original diagrams. Could give you more usable space in the middle of the oval.
I grew up in the Lifelike/Tyco/AHM era of Model Railroading in the '70s/80s, where colorful and fantasy liveries were the rule of the day. I couldn’t really make out the livery on those freight wagons in your images, but they didn’t look all that different from some of those liveries. It was the use of the phrase ‘wagons’ which gave any your non-North American (I spend a lot of time on the RMWeb forum…)
I though of doing that, but it didn’t feel right in that position with the truck bays facing the main. At least I’ve now got more of an idea on were to place the decoupler magnets, even if the two I’ve installed have shown there’s something wrong with a number of currently installed couplers.
Also as seen in that photo, the runaound’s been turned into a plain siding, don’t know why I want it there or if it will stay, as it’s made that location electrically interesting.
Ah, Lifelike, somehow I’ve ended up with one of their low nose GP-38-2 in Australian National colours, it doesn’t run very well.
I’d suggest moving your flour mill spur more to the left and use the run a round track space for spur to another industry.
I have something similar to what you are trying to do. On the left is Miller Milling Co and on the right New World Pasta. These are two for real comanies with this actual set up in the town where I live. I played around with the track to suit my situation. Miller pipes the flour to New World and also ships the refined four by rail and truck transport. Remember there are times we can’t actually replicate real life, just the illusion of it.
Just my opinion, but if you move the building 3 cars farther down (to the last silver car, next to the first yellow one), it’d be more realistic. No need for a turnout on the siding itself, one spur is for loading and the other spur for car storage. Here is the long story:
So, when the railroad delivers 3 cars, it shoves them all the way to the end of the track so the first car may be loaded. When that car is loaded, the 3 cars are pulled so the next car can be loaded…etc. When the 3rd car is loaded (all the cars are still in the clear on that spur, since the building is moved down), those cars can be put on the storage spur, or exchanged for the empties that were left there (if any were left there by the next local). When the next local comes to town, it can pick up/drop off cars on the storage spur while leaving the industry track alone (let a dedicated plant switcher move cars on and off the ‘active’ loading track so flour plant employees won’t be surprised by cars moving while being loaded…as well as provide another job for you to do). The second track will be a sort of a yard track just for the flour industry so it never runs out of cars to load. All the cars will be switched from the ‘main line’ end so no engine escape track would be needed…all moves would be ‘trailing point’ moves and any runaround moves would be on the main line.
Moving cars at the industry one by one, as they are loaded, seems to be rarely modeled (we just shove a string of cars to the end of the track, then pull them all out at once and trade them for the empties in our local train…how does the product get into each of the cars if they aren’t spotted one-by-one at the loading chute?).
Having just as much room before the building is just as important as having room after it so the loaded cars can have somewhere out of the way to sit without interfering with other switching. You may only be able to spot 3 cars (which is the practical capacity of the siding) at the indu
Hmm, going to watch the prototype do things is somewhat of a challenge, no ones quite sure when a grain train’s going to turn up at that location, as the main commuter operator is quite hostile towards freight trains and anything else non-EMU. Also our freight operators prefer to minimise shunting and run block trains and the smallest grain consist I’ve seen evidence for is six grain hopper wagons long.
Though I do see the relevance in moving wagons around like that, its just more incentive for me to go dcc. Flat out on that F class is 1/3 throttle on the Y.
Finally had some time to work on the layout. No scenery or structures are attached to the board, so that makes re-arrangement of them a breeze. Track and trackbed, on the other hand is mostly fasten down in places I’m happy with.
So, that’s the mill at the third wagon spot, its’ siding’s been moved more towards the camera and generally straightened. The other siding is still a length of flex + off-cut it seems shorter than when both siding was over more. The mill complex orientated in this way is growing on me as I could put grain unloading at a different point to flour loading and regardless of how it’s placed, it’s a decent scenery blocker.
Though I’ve probably not shifted things left to the extent of his suggestion, as I like the look that the Peco ST-238 curve gives. Any other just felt wrong when the siding length decreased, as the entry curve increased. That quick mockup with that box has me contemplating something going there, I’ve a 50’ goods shed model that may suit the space.
Yet more cad doodling, has produced a location for storage of the local shunter (F212, that 0-6-0), though it’s probably in an operationally troublesome position. That’s roughly where it must be, going by the other parts of my nebulous scenery plan.
RT, I see what you mean, if the full consist gets dropped of in there and the shunter or rail tractor’s in its waiting place off the siding, it can’t get out to work.
John, well I do have a spare track leading to a corner, single track the Walthers diesel fuelling kit and go from there.
I’ve not really thought about those six wheel beasties, as I’ve their bigger bogied C and ZLP cousins and in the period I’m modeling VicRail was phasing them out, though making an SEM Z van kit into the four wheeler or the ZZ bogie version would be an interesting challenge.
if the Z vans are all condmned by your period perhaps you could use a Z van body as a workers humpy or store shed some where.
Never heard of a ZZ van sounds interesting will have to do a google search on one of those
regards John
later addition
Ah so thats what a ZZ looks like just a Z on bogies, I would think for your layout one would look well and truly worse for wear a real weathering challange to say the least.
And probably has SWO slapped on the sides with a paint brush
Salvadge Written Off or whatever VR would have put on it before it got broken up and burned.
Here in the US (at least the code times I’ve seen it) the switcher just sits on the track, usually coupled to the string of cars. No dedicated shed for protection, if/when it needs serviced, they ship it to a contractor or main railroads’ closest maintenance shop (usually dead in another trains’ consist because it’s some distance away…which could add an interesting operations to simulate).
Looks good! That industry does a great job of blocking the view…nice job on a smallish layout!
I believe that’s what they do here at locations that still have a dedicated shunter of which there’s not too many left. I’m aware of just one and it just doesn’t interest me -coiled steel- I’d run it as mixed freight or as through traffic.
Still I’ve things to do, tidy my wiring, arrange the silo complex, think of a second industry for the green siding, play with the CV settings of my locos, what and where other scenery and if I want to really put loco fueling there.
And most of those items are available as kits from local makers. I was surprised to find a mob in Maine with a small selection of appropriate items but model railroading is an international hobby.
I mean I saw this and went “I can use that”.
