I read a diagram where you have a loop of track in HO scale and the switch points create a short when thrown for the siding. You would need to put a gap past the frog on the mainline on one rail to stop the short.
Is it better to have a switch that has a insulated frog or a powered one protected by gaps?
One vote for all-metal ‘live’ frogs and insulated gaps where needed.
Several of my most-used pieces of powered rolling stock have very short power pickup wheel bases and the coasting characteristics of a concrete block. They are guaranteed to stall on commercial plastic-frog turnouts.
I build all of my own specialwork, soldered up from raw rail. I have never figured out how to build a turnout with a non-powered frog, or closure rails with the same polarity as the adjacent stock rails. With live frogs (which I need, since my points don’t pass power to the closure rails) I don’t have to worry about it anyway.
For multi-train control in DC, or signal detection in DCC, you have to isolate track sections anyway. Insulated joints are no problem.
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
This subject is actually more complicated than most people think.
That is because different manufactures have different variations of “live frog” and “power routing”.
You can have a live frog that is power routing but you can also have a dead frog that is power routing.
You can also have “all live” meaning both routes are always powered, with or without a live frog.
Each manufacturer designs their turnouts differently and you can’t assume they all work the same way. Wiring and gaps will differ with each manufacturer.
I second it!
Although they require additional wiring and gaps (no big deal), live frogs will prevent locomotives - especially those with short wheelbases - from stalling due to lack of power.
THAT particular diagram is for ‘Power routing’ turmout/switches - such as Shinohara - which are designed for DC block wiring.
The frog changes polarity with the point rails. and can ‘short’ . A. is to use an insulated rail joiner on that turnout’s inner frog rail.
What a ‘Power routing’ switch CAN do, that a 'DCC friendly cannot, is acivate a section of track when thrown.
Walthers code 83 switches (and all Atlas) have points and frogs that do not change polarity, therefor do not require insulators for basic wiring. These turnouts now call themselves "DCC or “Beginner friendly”.
Like old Lionel 3 rail trainsets, ‘polarity’ was not a problem. The 3rd rail was hot - no matter the direction. We could have had 'head-on collisions - except in those years who could afford two trains?
An all metal frog properly insulated and gap with power routing to the insulated section is IMO the best way to go. How you accomplish that and with what mfg’s turnouts differ, but the goal should be to have power supplied to all parts of the turnout.
Interestly enough, a few months ago I got into a similar debate. I has people swearing that a dead frog was the best way to go because it avoided a possible short circuit bewteen the frog and the wing rails with metal wheelsets. The possibility goes away with a properly insulated turnout/frog.
Also, remember there is a difference between a powered frog and a power routing turnout. These are two different animals.
Thanks everyone for good replies. The switch I am considering is the Walthers DCC Friendly turnouts in code 83. I THINK that one is a metal frog but not sure because none are availible to be examined right now in person.
Kinda hard to make switches decisions for the new yard when most of the candidates have yet to be produced in the factory. I might learn to hand lay the damn things and get the yard built if I had the moxie and courage to do it. OF course that might mean Walthers would lose out on a dozen or more potential orders… but who’s counting pre-orders these days huh?
Depending on the number of turnouts you need you might consider the fasttracks jigs. The more turnouts you need to build, the more you spread the cost of the jig out over. They build up a nice turnout whose frog is totally isolated.
jktrains
Hand-laying turnouts is not much more difficult than doing a really good job of laying flex track. The hardest part is gathering up the courage to try!
I posted a quick and dirty description of my construction method on another thread. You might want to look for it.
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - on flex with hand-laid specialwork)
The Walthers DCC friendly switches have insulated frogs–the frogs are NOT live. They are, however, metal.
Ed