Is there a really reliable DCC system?

Model Railroader Electronics and DCC
1

I’d like to find out what your experience is with the DCC equipment (not decoders) from Digitrax, Lenz, NCE and MRC. I currently have equipment manufactured by one of the above and have had it for probably 10 years.

My experience with this manufacturer has been as follows:

a) The first command station went back once for repair and some time after that went back again when it was replaced by the manufacturer.

b) The first basic throttle went back once for repair.

c) The top of the line throttle that I bought to replace the basic one went back once to get the number face plate aligned properly so it did make the buttons stick.

d) I sold the original command station when I finally got fed up with its inability read back any decoder AND because I got fed up listening to the power supply buzzing.

e) I bought this manufacturer’s basic DCC command station and am controlling it with the hot dog throttle.

f) This command station recently came back from in-warranty repair because it would randomly assign different status numbers to my locomotives, 7 in total. I still does exactly the same thing that I sent it in for, after the manufacturer supposedly replaced all the command station internals! Nothing else is connected to it other than the layout.

I have a small layout, located in a spare bedroom. The layout can easily go 2-3 months without being run at all. Then there will be 1-2 days of activity and then I am on to working on something else. In other words, there is very little wear and tear, and the equipment is not abused. The bedroom is heated and air conditioned, and even if I dropped something, there is deep carpet with an equally deep padding layer.

I am getting to the point of considering selling it all whe

2

I have had Digitrax now for almost 8 years. The system comprises several throttles, booster and command station. It gets fairly regular use with the 2 boys running trains almost every day. I have had one self induced problem when I had to send the Zephyr in for repair. (I ran a loco into an unprotected program track and burned out the program track electronics). It was taken care of very quickly and at what I felt was a modest cost. I subsequently changed my layout to build in a dead protected area when the program track is active. The only other thing that has ever gone back was my DT400 throttle that I just sent in to be upgraded to the new radio throttle. So in my experience, Digitrax has been very reliable. The local hobby shop has a 4000 sq ft Digitrax layout that runs with about 5 boosters and dozens of throttles. The throttles do take a hammering as kids get to use them for opperations one Sunday a month and the floor is concrete. I know that they get their share of broken throttles as a result. The command stations and boosters hold up just fine.

3

Out of curiosity, what is a “Hot Dog throttle”? I have not heard that term before to describe a throttle.

4

Sounds like you have an MRC system, as I have never heard of any of those complaints with any of the other manufactures you mentioned. That being said I thought MRC could hold it’s own against any of the major players in the game but soon realized it had way too many limitations to be worth the money. I have since switched to NCE and have not yet had a single issue with it. I know an awful lot of people who have NCE and love it and know of one guy in particular who has one of the largest layouts in the country and is now switching over from Digitrax to NCE.

You can have problems with any system you buy but it’s how the company treats you and supports the product which matters most to me. I’m sold on NCE.

5

The term comes from my days on the skiing circuit. A “hot dog” is someone who is especailly competent and showy. I used that term to refer to my DT 400 throttle, the top of the line Digitrax, at least until the DT 402.

6

In fact I am referring to my Digitrax system. I feel I have experienced way too many failures for the little use the sytem gets. I doubt any one of my locos has more than 3-hours run time on them. I prefer to build prototype models, I guess. Some day I may get around to finishing the layout. As of now, it is simply a test bed to ensure the locos run properly and pull my models without problems.

7

I knew you were discussing a DT400 because no one else produces what could be termed a “hot dog throttle” in comparison with their other models…at least that I know of. Lucky guess…I guess.

Anyway, I ordered a Digitrax SEB, with the single accompanying DT400, back in March of 2006. About seven months later I ordered a companion DT400 so that my brother or a nephew could run the trains with me. Now, three and a half years later, everything works as well as the day I received them, and I have no problems whatsoever.

I acknowledge your bitter frustration and disillusionment; it can’t have done much good for your hobby enjoyment. Personally, I wouldn’t blame you for trying NCE or even MRC or Lenz. If Digitrax won’t help you, help yourself.

-Crandell

8

Several things stand out. Power supply buzzing? That right there indicates some sort of problem. Are you using that same power supply with the new command station?

Second, what do you mean by randomly assigning new status numbers? Are you properly dispatching locos when you are finished running them? If you don’t do this, the same loco can be selected multiple times in the command station and they will all fight one another as you try to adjust the speed and direction. (not 100% technically accurate but in essence this is what happens).

I’m on my second Zephyr, but not because it failed. I lost it, my DT400, and all my model railroad equipment (long story, I covered it before) so last year I started over again. I did not hesitate to buy Digitrax again. Both Zephyrs never had an issue. My DT400 worked great on my klayout as well as that of a friend’s. His Super Chief has been chugging along for several years now with no failures. Just recently did a few of his DT400 buttons start stickign, but the easy fix for that is to take it apart and twirl a knife in the holes from the inside to clear away the excess label.

Name a system - you will ALWAYS find someone who has had problems. It’s liek any other piece of electronic equipment - I build my own computers and I ONLY use Western Digital hard drives. Because I’ve only ever had ONE fail in 10 years of building my own computers. Other peopel tell me I’m crazy and they only use Seagate because they had 5 WD drives fail within the first month.

I plan to have signalling and dispatcher operations on my layout controlled via JMRI. For this reason I would not even consider another brand of DCC system, NONE of them comes close to doing what Digitrax does with Loconet. I find it interesting the club I used to belong to finally went DCC with NCE equipment - yet they then ran a Loconet bus aroudn the layout and are using Digitrax compone

9

I have a Lenz System 100, and an add-on Lenz 90 throtte unit. Lenz does not provide a power supply. I used an old train transformer to power the system, until it became overloaded. Then I switched to an NCE 5-amp supply.

I have had no problems whatsoever with any of this equipment. I’ve been running for 4 years now. I run the layout most days, at least a little bit. I’ve never had it do anything weird to my engines. I also never lose control of a locomotive. With the Lenz control bus architecture, I can start an engine, unplug the throttle and move to a different jack elsewhere on the layout, and resume without missing a beat. I don’t need to manually “re-acquire” the engine - it just happens automatically.

I greatly prefer the Lenz 100 throttle, by the way, to the point where I almost never use the Lenz 90 throttle. If I had it to do again, I’d buy another Lenz 100 throttle unit despite the higher cost. This has nothing to do with reliability, though, simply a preference for one throttle over the other.

10

I have an NCE wireless system that I run sporadically like you described. Always works fine for me. I have had it for 4 years.

Enjoy

Paul

11

I used a non DCC command system called Dynatrol for many years. It was good, it was limited, but it worked. In 1999 Dynatrol was fading away, but made dual decoders that worked for Dynatrol and the new DCC standard. The decoders were manufactured by NCE so I bought some and installed them for the day I would be leaving Dynatrol and going DCC. Finally, year 2000 I made the switch to NCE and have been using NCE ever since. Today, my system is the NCE command station, 4 boosters, and RB02 wireless.

There was a learning curve in the beginning, NCE was fairly new at doing a retail business, but, I had few problems, and the ones I had were solved quickly by NCE. I also learned that the owner or his employees were a phone call away. Later, a good solid NCE Yahoo forum started and is going to day and is a major source of help for any questions.

The only time I ever had to send a component back was for an upgrade. I have continued to add components, bought one new command station because of a major upgrade, put the old command station a an extra booster on my workbench for testing and other work.

Like any other company, especially electronics oriented, there have been a few snafus, and every company has those, I don’t care what loyalists of other brands say, none are perfect. But, NCE has not let me down, provided support when needed, and I am happy. I am testing the new wireless upgrade and find I can stand outside the house and start a train in the basement with it.

I would suggest you research, talk to people, then make a move, but remember again, no one or no thing is perfect.

Bob

12

While you probably did not mean for it to, when I read this, especially in the context of the rest of this post, it sounds like you are complaining about a fault in the command station. I think it should be pointed out that the DB150(which I assume you are talking about here, if I am wrong, please correct me) was never designed to read back decoders, so this issue was not a fault, but merely a feature that the DB150 did not have but you decided you wanted.

I’m with Randy here, the power suppply should not be buzzing. What power supply were you using and did you mention the fact that it was buzzing to Digitrax? If there is something wrong with the power supply, it could very well play havoc with the rest of the system.

13

Digitrax works the same way and though I have not operated on them, my understanding is that NCE, MRC, and CVP’s EasyDCC also work the same way.

14

I think that one of the only walk around systems that does not permit this is the NCE PowerCab, and that is only in the very base model where the throttle is the command station. As soon as you add the Smartbooster the throttle can be unplugged and moved in this way.

15

Actually, Digitrax equipment has that kind of history.

I’ve had my Super Chief (DCS100, DT400’s, UP5’s, PM42, DS54’s, DS64’s, MS100, PR3) for about the same time as you, except in a basement instead of a heated, air-conditioned, and carpeted bedroom, and I’ve had no problems with any of that equipment whatsoever. Zero, zip. zilch, nada. It all works perfectly and has been as solid as a rock.

My opinion, since you asked, is that maybe you don’t really “understand how to use this stuff” as well as you believe.

For example, it’s fairly common knowledge that the overlays used on DT400’s sometimes cause the buttons to stick, and that the cure (as already mentioned in this thread) is simply to open it up and twirl a #11 Exacto in the holes to remove the offending bits. No postage, no waiting, instant gratification!

And you sold the command station because the (separate) power supply was buzzing? Why not just repair/replace the power supply? As was also noted previously in this thread, a buzzing power supply is certainly not normal. If it were me, I’d immediately address the obvious power supply issue, before suspecting any of the devices powered by it.

Also, I have to ask: What does “assign different status numbers to my locomotives” mean? I know you can status-edit to change between 14 and 28/128 speed steps, but as long as I’ve been using/reading about DCC I’ve never heard your terminology used before. But it sounds suspiciously like you’re referring to locos that haven’t been dispatched still being under the command station’s control, which is something tha

16

If the current system is a Zephyr with a DT400 throttle then you actually have the potential for 5 different control throttles on the system at once. (2 on the DT400, the Z throttle, and the 2 jump throttle connections of the Z). Even if you don’t have anything connected to the jump throttle, you can still inadvertently have locos assigned to the jump throttles. The potential most certainly exists to have throttles fighting over the same loco.

17

Add me to the list of very satisfied Digitrax user.

At my local club we are using a Super Chief 8amps radio system since 1999 and it has been working flawlessly since.

Same thing with my own Zephyr that has been ticking like a Swiss watch since 2002. Even after a trip to the floor, my mistake of course.

I also own 4 Digitrax throttles, one UT1, one UT4 radio, one DT100 radio, one DT400 radio. Never had a problem with either and never had a button stick.

18

Not one problem with my MRC Prodigy Advance system in ten years.

19

Are you positive the Prodigy Advance or any MRC DCC systems have been on the market for 10 years?

20

“Simon” said:

“I ran a loco into an unprotected program track…burned out the program track electronics”. Huh? I am very new at this DCC stuff; and, in my hands right now, have the simple switch needed to separate the “program track” from the rest of my emerging layout. Exactly, and simply (I’m a dummy[D)]), how and why does one need an isolated, separate “program track”? The Digitrax info recommends, but does not clarify why. Currently, I only have one loco that I would like to “program” with its own ‘address’. So, Simon: How do the program track electronics get ‘burned out’?

Thanks,

“G-Flash”