I’m writing to you from across the pond in England, regards to you all.
My father got into O-gauge hi-rail on a trip to the states ten years ago and brought back a Railking C&O Berkshire which as somehow snowballed into a 30’ x 20’ layout!
He purchased a Lionmaster Challenger (Odessy system) 2 years ago but we had troubles running it with our setup, 2 MTH Z-4000s; baulky starts, sudden stops and generally tempermantal behaviour. A dealer suggested that we might try a lionel transformer or, even better, TMCC since that had been noted to calm the running of this beast.
Duly said we invested in TMCC ( i was interested to see what Command Control could bring to our setup) and after some headaches we finally got it setup and… the Challenger runs beautifully 90% of the time! Victory!
With a nice warm glow of accomplishment I set about testing out our other Lionel motive power to see what revelations TMCC could bring and… was thoroughly disappointed.[V]
In conventional modes with the Z-4000 getting smooth, slowly - and realistic - accelerating starts was a doddle with the Lionel engines. On TMCC however winding round the big red dial results in locos leaping away at a scale 20-30mph and stopping equally abruptly when decelerating into this speed range.
I’ve tried resetting defaults, stall speeds but to no avail, I can’t get these locos to go slower under TMCC but they will in conventional.
It’s a bit frustrating.
All I want to know gents is - is this normal? And if not could you chaps shed light on any solutions?
The original TMCC CAB-1 can only send “relative” (i.e. increment/decrement) speed step commands because it was designed and released prior to the original Command Base. It was originally designed to control PowerMasters. The TMCC Command base was released the following year. Odyssey equipped loco’s do not respond well to TMCC relative speed commands. You can shut down Odyssey in the loco but then you lose the extended speed steps and cruise control.
BTW, the newer Legacy base and controller allow access to the Odyssey under TMCC. This is not so much a function of the newer command base as it is the new CAB-2. The new Cab -2 can issue original CAB-1 mode +/- speed steps, TMCC absolute 32 speed steps, or Legacy absolute 200 steps. The Odyssey equipped loco’s internal speed curves will handle TMCC mode without any problems (aka no OdyLurch or runaways). The original Command Base can generate absolute speed commands but the CAB-1 can’t format the commands. This is also why there are only 10 addresses available for TR’s while the programming structure actually supports 15. If you use a computer to interface to the Command base you can access these additional commands/features.
Have you tried contacting the Lionel club in the U.K. ? I remember there were some problems re 50hz vs 60 hz operations but can’t remember what they were. Wish I could provide some better info.
I think some folks are confusing what you are saying. If I read your post correctly, the Challenger with Odessy is running fine. It’s the other TMCC locos that are acting finicky. Correct? First we need some info on which locos with TMCC are giving you problems. Which ones are they? Have you lubricated the gears in them?
Also, you gotta go easy with the “big red knob”. Since you don’t get a visual readout of how fast the twisting of the knob is doing, giving it a big twist probably will launch the loco like a rocket. I’m just guessing here as I use an MTH DCS to control all my locos and for me it’s much more precise. Try twisting the knob slower and see what happens.
TMCC does use the 60 hz sine wave base frequency as part of the system. What exactly are you using for power? You need to make sure that the power supply is feeding 110 volts, 60 hz sine wave to your transfomer and the TMCC components for TMCC to work properly.
I take it you are using a step-down transformer to get 120V from our 230V.
As you have found with your Challenger, some TMCC items work fine on 50Hz. Others don’t, this is down to the circuit boards in the locos/cars etc. To get these to work correctly you need 60Hz power.
See this post on the Lionel Collectors Club (UK) Forum.
Are you using a compatible power supply for the Lionel TMCC unit? It needs 120 volts AC at 60 hertz to work correctly. A step down transformer will only take the voltage down, will not touch the hertz or cycles frequency. I had a stereo system problem when I was in the U.S. Army stationed in Germany and my problem was the hertz or frequency and not the voltage factor. In Germany they use 50 hertz and not 60 hertz AC.
To get the correct hertz you may need to go to a 12 volt battery powered invertor for U.S. recreational vehicles that will step up the power to 120 volts AC at 60 hertz. A camping supply place can probally help you.