I’ve been lurking here while I worked on designing a layout for my basement. I finally got something that’s close to being a finished design, and was hoping that I could get some feedback.
N Scale. Approx. 22’x18’. Single level; single main line. Hope to run
some long trains, 50+ cars, w/ large diesels and cars. 1970s to present.
Continuous running is a must. I put in the diamond so I could
Turnouts are #5 in the yard, and #7 and #10 everywhere else. Tighetest curve is
no less than 20" radius.
Hi, Regardless of how I tried to download the image of your “New Design”, I was unable to get an image. Why don’t you Post an image, so that we can see what your layout looks like. Do you know how to Post images? All digital photos must be placed in a Host ie. Photobucket.com It’s free. Establish an album, such as My Model Railroad Album Insert images to this album Below each photo will be several options. Click on the IMG option, and momentarily, the word “Copied” will appear. Go to the Trains.com/forums Thread, where you want to Post your text and photo. Type in any text,and then either click on Paste on the Edit Tool Bar, or click on ctrlV. The lengthy code for you photo will appear below your text. Scroll down to Post and click on it, and your text and photo will soon appear on the Trains.com/forum of your choice. Bob Hahn
First off welcome to coming off of the lurking side.
Second let’s get to critiquing, I am a little blunt so please don’t take anything personally it is just my opinion.
There are to many switch backs to switch industies. One on a layout is a challenge, more becomes a pain in a hurry. I counted at least 5.
I am leery of the track going around in the back left corner of the water tank or whatever that is. Because it is hard to reach all your derailments will happen there.
What is the idea of the track looping on the peninsula? It looks like the one track is just a loop.
I am confused on the tracks going everywhere at the start of the peninsula? You said that the diamond was for continuous run, I would think that the layout being a single track loop is the continuous run.
I don’t like the switch lead being stub ended you will have more options if it connects to the main.
Can you show more detail of the Yard ladder? It might be an idea to add a a few tracks with a larger switch number to have an arrival/departure tracks and the rest of the yard be #5s.
I don’t know what your standard train length is, I know it is 50 cars but is that 40’ or 89’ auto racks?
What is the purpose of the two small yard in the towns at near both sides of the yard?
Why is the peninsula 4 tracks wide?
Also it looks like that is the only place that has a siding outside of the yard.
Chris, I appreciate your comments & questions. I’ve tried to reply to everything, so hope you have some more input. None of your original thoughts were too blunt or offensive. I encourage anyone else to tear apart my design so I can make it better. - Darryl
There are to many switch backs to switch industies. One on a layout is a challenge, more becomes a pain in a hurry. I counted at least 5.
I think I know what you mean. My operating plan is to run trains out both ends of the yard. By doing so, and also using the run around abilities of the sidings on the peninsula and the industry trackage on the far left, most of the switchbacks can be eliminated. And, I know that the little peninsula to the far right will be a little tedious to switch out the 4 industries, so I’ve thought about taking that out all together.
I am leery of the track going around in the back left corner of the water tank or whatever that is. Because it is hard to reach all your derailments will happen there.
Difficult to reach, so everything goes wrong here, sort of like Murphy’s law, huh? It’s a 3ft. diam. sump pump hole (that is covered) w/ two pvc pipes that run up through the ceiling. There’s enough room to get back there and pick up any derailed cars, might be a little tricky to actually rerail them while back there. Was thinking of using that as a “secondary” route, so i will double think it’s pros/cons and maybe scrap it.
What is the idea of the track looping on the peninsula? It looks like the one track is just a loop.
Yes, there is an oval inside the peninsula. It is for a coal fired power plant. Was trying to utilize the space; it will hold a 40 car train. Think I over did it?
I am confused on the tracks going everywhere at the start of the peninsula? You said that the diamond w
Eliminate the tracks around the sump pump, the why connection the crossing, they do not appear to add anything to the layout other than multiple reverse loops and or reversing sections. You could then connect your yard lead to the main which will give you more useful track in the yard. The tracks on the peninsula look like the are designed to work a flood loader at a strip mine which might make for an interesting model.
I’ve been following this thread a bit and find one thing very remarkable. In one of the previous post adding a staging yard later is mentioned, but this issue was never addressed again. IMHO building this yard later will become a pretty nasty job, It would be wise to build it first, at least before tracks above it are built. And grades handling 50 car trains will be rather long, so thorough planning is needed.
In general I miss an overall view about operation and somehow lack of information. I might be wrong but you were asked about train-length, you only replied in terms of cars, while length in feet was asked. It makes a hell of a difference if we are talking about 50 35-feet long hoppers or 50 89-feet long modern auto-racks.
The very same applies to building a yard. It must be clear what it purpose is before I can comment on it.
Your layout is big enough to host quite a crew, so more and more specific information is needed here as well. Generally speaking if you have two trains running over the mainline doing laps and changing direction it would be great to have more then two passing sidings, three at least. Passing sidings long enough to hold your whole train.
Having said all this, i would present a schematic and a list of train-destinations. Like main-east, main -west, local east, west-turn, etc; or name various industrial zones. The result will more railroady, you will know where your cars are coming from and where they are heading to. Beside switching industries no longer rather randomly, building or rebuilding trains will become part of the fun.
Chris, I willl probably take your (and J.Rob’s) advise and remove the track by the sump. WIll likely look to re-design & simplify the small right side peninsula.
Your proposal for the peninsula is interesting. Is the loop supposed to be a main train & siding?
For the yard lead, I see what you’re saying. But, i’m not a 100% sold. I think it will look a little odd having tho main and yard so far from the yard body, and second, the lead/drill track is for the yard snake to switch cars, I don’t forsee how or why something else would be out there and need to reach the main. I’ll got to think this one over a bit more.
Here’s the north yard ladder. There’s another set of crossovers from the main to lead about 14" north of here.
As for train lengths (includes locos & caboose): the local about 6 feet, thru trains about 12.5 feet and the 50 car monster is about 23 feet. In the yard, the longest and shortest tracks about 5 & 10ft.
The two 4 track yards you asked about. The one off to the lower right, will disappear when I redo that peninsula. I thought that little yard would simply make switching over there a tad easier. Also thought it could be a small interchange yard. The other one, just to the nw of the main yard, is a part of an Army base. Those tracks are for drive-on loading of vehicles onto flatcars.
Finally, you suggested removing one siding and adding another, not sure I understand where and why.
As for the proposed later building of a staging yard, truth is it won’t be above or below. I’m hoping to add it off to the lower right corner.
Operations. Not sure what you want to know. Most sessions will probably be just me for a few hours building a train or two and running around in circles and servicing a few industries. I forsee running a local, about 6ft long, to service a few industries each day. Then there will be manifest freights, maybe 13ft, that are classified in the yard and run around in a few circles before reaching the yard, again. And, finally, I want to run the occassional hot shot intermodal or unit grain train, maybe 23ft, just becuase it’s N scale and I can.
The yard is multi-purpose: classification and staging. I figure it will be about 1/2 full of cars. I’ll run trains out one end and back in at the other.
As for more sidings, I’m not sure. It’s got to be so long that it’s tough. Where? I’ve thought about putting one on the far left, but there’s the one in the peninsula. They’d be almost right next to each other. Maybe along the bottom? Also, I really don’t know if it’s necessary. If there are numerous operators I imagine that they’d be busy in the yard and servicing industries so much that the number of main line meets could be managed.
I have already put some thought into trains, routes, destinations, and even started working on a timetable & sys.spec.instructions. I did run into a dilemma with this. One idea was for the yard to be in the “center”, with trains going out the top to “A” and coming back in at the bottom as if the train was now arriving from “B”. This way the yard is always the same place. The alternate concept is for the yard to be at either ends of the schematic. Imagine the top half ot the yard (and/or some of the tracks) as “Chicago” and the bottom of the y
OK, i understand you are the sole operator and you intend to run one mainline train at a time. You do not need any passing siding for this purpose. Just a few short runarounds for switching purposes are needed. However, your layout is big enough to have 3 or 4 passing sidings, though maybe not as long as would like. You’ll have to take a design decision here, or add a couple of “medium length” sidings so you can have more then one main line train running at the very same time if a crew is visiting you, or keep the number of those biggies down to one at a time. Since the space for your yard is about 20 feet long I would be content with 7 to 10 feet long trains, but I am not you. (between 1/3 and 1/2 the length of the allotted space)
I would separate classification and sorting from storage and staging. You will find out very fast a rather complete and well designed classification yard will consist of loads tracks. The far side along the wall is a prime space for industrial development. One thoroughfare track, an arrival and departure track, a 6 track classification bowl, a runaround for the switcher, add industrial tracks to the back and your yard is already 10 or more tracks wide; not yet counting engine service, RIP tracks etc.
The last part of your posting is telling it all. Here you can clearly see why a schematic is needed. Your destinations Chicago and St Louis should be in staging; your classification yard somewhere between those two, near a junction perhaps. The staging yard can be build double ended, so trains leaving from Chicago arrive later in St Louis and are ready to leave from Chicago again. This however is not what you described before, with stub-staging at the lower right corner, trains come in from, lets say Chicago, terminate in your Classification yard and pick up cars from there before going back to Chicago again.
"I have already put some thoughts into trains, routes and dest
