Hi. I’m a noob and am at the “dreaming and planning” stage of my first layout. I have some questions.
First, here’s the layout that I want to build. It’s a 2’x3’ N scale plan that I got from www.thortrains.net :
I wanted something with switching action for operations and switching puzzles plus an oval in it somewhere for when I just want to kick back and watch the train. It’s going to sit on an old office table. The base will be made from 3/8" fomecore board. Do you think this would be too difficult for a first effort? Are there too many turnouts?
Second, I’m planning on a modern-day logging theme in the Pacific Northwest. I’ve picked up a Life-Like SW9/1200 loco, two Micro Trains (I think that’s the brand) skeleton log cars and a 40’ tanker (I don’t plan on any rolling stock longer than 40’- this outfit buys old used stuff). The deal is these log cars have fixed 3-log loads. One, that’s not very realistic since all of the old-growth forests are protected now. Two, hauling loaded cars away from a sawmill isn’t logical either. Do they make logging cars without loads glued to them? If not, is it easy to remove the loads without breaking the cars?
Third question: I’ve gone and bought all of the track that the plan calls for and just realized that the turnouts don’t come with any switch mechanisms. I’m thinking in terms of ground throws for the turnouts nearest me and electrical mechanisms for the ones further away (so I don’t go knocking things over by reaching across the layout to flip levers). What do you recommend for this code of track?
I don,t feel that 3/8 base is stiff enough but since it will be sitting on a table,it probably isn’t an issue to you.However,I would add a one inch foam glued to it so that I could have some soil to work with.You may later wi***o create ditches,rivers,culverts,etc,or any dug-in feature to your layout which may be impossible if your track is sitting on the base board.Just my idea…
Since you don’t say which brand of turnouts you have,I can’t tell you much on these.As far as having too much…well if you can handle the first one,the others are all the same and aren’t more difficult…just more work though…but you will find out that your skills improve from one to the next and so your installation time will shorten accordingly.Just don’t ru***he first one…My two cents now…I wouldn’t power the turnouts on a layout of this depth and would save for other goodies…but it’s only my opinion.
Ah, my image was shrunk so that you can’t read the text underneath. They’re Atlas 2750s and 2751s. The rest is all Atlas sectional track too - code 100, I think.
Good avice on the foam. I haven’t decided on scenery tet but was thinking that if I made low spots such as gulleys that I’d just cut away a section of the fomecore. The foam sounds like a better idea.
I think the fomecore should be sturdy enough given plenty of cross-braces underneath, or else I can add another layer on the surface to double the thickness. Laminating the layers that way should improve things. I have plenty since I could only find it in a 20-sheet pack at an art supply store. It’s 32"x40" so there’ll be lots of scrap pieces to play with as well.
No, difficulty for beginners comes from other things besides quantity of turnouts. This is all flat track with no grades, there are no reversing loops to cause electrical problems. It is a tiny layout. I don’t see any 'beginner" issues with this layout.
I do however have one serious issue with this track layout. See the big curve around the outside on the right? It comes down and basically ends in a dead end track. This means the main line is the inner track. There is no way for a second train to sit and wait for the first one to make a loop and then take its turn.
The only thing I can think of is that it is set up to be point to point (from the two tracks in the lower left, around 1.5 times to the two tracks in the center of the loops on the upper left. But, if so, neither of the end-point yards has a run around track.
I think the issue might be that an unloaded n-scale log buggy might not weigh enough to track well.
You didn’t mention what code of track you had purchased. I have found that usually it is the elbow that is the biggest scenery knocker. I don’t see that as being a big issue on this small of a layout. If you want to keep the manual turnouts the scenery could be designed around this issue by keeping tall breakable things away from the “action” areas.
I just noticed that myself earlier today when looking at the track plan. That outside loop is really just an overgrown curved passing siding, isn’t it? And requiring some switching action to get back on the mainline at that? If I let the trains just run on the oval they’d be running on the inside loop.
One thing to think about is this…Will you get board with this layout soon? I decided to build a medium sized layout as my first. I’ve learned a few things as I’ve gone along but nothing so far has been too much of a problem. Go ahead and challenge yourself…maybe design your own track plan. You won’t regret it…however, 6 months down the road you may find yourself already tearing up this small layout to pursue the one you should have built. Just a thought.
It may be worth noting that not every layout published on the web is a good layout. And just because CAD lets one draw a configuration, it does not mean that it is practical.
It’s hard to tell from the small size drawing, but if the crossovers are constructed of #4 turnouts, they may prove troublesome when pushing cars through them.
Many people who have built pure switching puzzles find they quickly grow tiresome. It can be much more interesting to base a layout, even a small one, on real-life railroading concepts such as interchange with another railroad. http://www.modelrail.us/id33.html
Is 2’X3’ the exact size your layout must be? If not, casting a broader net might turn up some more-thoughtfully designed layouts that would have the potential for more long-term interest. 3’X4’ to 3’X6’ areas can be quite interesting in N scale, for example.
Unreinforced 3/8" foamcore does not seem like a good choice for a layout base. Too easy to dent and ding, too easy to bend. It might be a better choice to stay with the traditional materials with which others have found success.
Thanks for the very good advice. It seems that I’m approaching this in the wrong direction: choosing a track plan that I like the looks of and then deciding what to model based on the track plan, rather than choosing what I wi***o model then designing the track plan to fit.
I’m limited in layout size due to the amount of room I have available and the table I plan to put it on (leaving room for the power pack, etc.). It’ll go in my spare bedroom that I’m currently using as a computer room/office/library. I want to be able to run trains while I’m doing things on the computer, if I wi***o.
I chose a fomecore base for a couple of reasons: one, I don’t drive, so trips to the lumberyard are out of the question. Two, I wa inspired by the construction technique of Peek’s Pike, a micro-layout shown here:
I plan to have a brace down the middle as well as more cross braces than are shown there. Since I don’t plan to have a lot of mountains made of plaster, and if I keep the scenery lightweight enough, it should be OK. I don’t really have much of a choice and it’ll be interesting to see how it works out.
I’m thinking of scrapping the idea of a logging-based railroad and going for general haulage to some small industries. In any case it’s thinking-cap and drawing-board time for me!
Foamcore may not be your best choice, but if that’s what you are limited to, make the best of it. Laminate several sheets together. Foamcore does have a “grain” to it; it cuts easier in one direction than the other. Determine which way the grain is on your foamcore and laminate them in cross layers with the grain running in different directions, similar to how plywood is constructed.
I just looked through the article on Peek’s Pike. Farther down in the article, there is another picture of the underside of the layout. It looks to me that the design was changed, as there are now wooden supports under the foamcore. The earlier pictures had shown all foamcore. Maybe after initial construction, it was determined that the foamcore wasn’t strong enough by itself and needed wood bracing. That should be a clue to you to proceed carefully.
My personal preference is 2" pink or blue insulation sheets, but since you don’t drive, you may have difficulty in buying it. 2" foam is strudy enough for what you want to do. It usually comes in 4’ x 8’ sheets but I have heard of modelers buying 2’ x 8’ sheets which would be better suited to your purpose. (You could also easily hand-carry it home from the store!)
In terms of your layout plan, as others have pointed out, that loop of track on the right side only serves the small yard at the bottom of the layout. Since your foamcore is 30" x 40", why not make that the overall layout size? It’s only 6" larger in both directions, but it gives you a lot more room to expand the trackplan. You may even be able to find another trackplan in the larger size that appeals to you even more.
Just a few thoughts and comments. The main thing is to have fun. Keep the forum posted on your progress.
I have collected quite a few small “N” Scale layout plans while doing my research. You can find and download these at the link below. They are in RTS (Atlas) format. If you download them you can print the materials list form the Atlas software.
He built that particular one to take on the road to shows and clubs so he built it a bit sturdier to withstand travelling.
Someone else also advised using an inch or so of foam so it can be cut to form gulleys, ditches, and so on in the landscape. I’m already keeping my eye out for some.
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In terms of your layout plan, as others have pointed out, that loop of track on the right side only serves the small yard at the bottom of the layout. Since your foamcore is 30" x 40", why not make that the overall layout size? It’s only 6" larger in both
I was advised to add some foam to the surface of my layout for carving hillocks and ditches and so forth. I’ve been on the lookout for some dense pink or blue foam.
Well, tonight when I got home I found that a sheet of 2" x 18" x 5’ white styrofoam had blown into my yard almost at my front steps sometime during the day. It wasn’t what I wanted, but hey, I can’t beat the price (free) and the fact that it basically delivered itself to my doorstep. So there’s that taken care of. It should do.
I’ve decided to go ahead and set up the track plan that I’d found:
Not fasten it down or anything, just hook it up on my tabletop, then run a train on it for a few weeks and see what I think. I plan to add a few paper structures that I found here
just to help me visualize what industries those spurs and sidings will serve and get an idea of how much room I’ll need for structures. Gotta get a printer.
I was also thinking of continuing the bottom left spur to the edge of the layout for a mainline interchange. Since this is meant to be a logging RR I intend to run at lower speeds (20MPH probably) using an SW1200 and shorter (mostly 40’) older cars, but maybe a few newer 55 footers- I haven’t decided yet. To be more realistic I probably should have gone with code 55 track instead of code 80 since most logging railroads run on old crappy track, but I got what the plan called for in my ignorance at the time. (This is all N scale.)
I have a question though: I’ve decided to go with Caboose Industries ground throws for the turnouts but I’m not sure which ones to use. The turnoutsare 6 Atlas part number 2751s (#4 right-hand) and 3 #2750s (#4 left-hand). code 80 track. Of the ground throws listed here which part number(s) should I get?
It’ll only take up an old office desk? My first layout layout took up the better part of an old 20 foot motor home! If you build that small layout, you’ll probably get bored with it rather quickly. Get a 20 X 40 shed and fill it up!. You’ll have so much action, you won’t know what to do with yourself. Have fun!
Well, I figure if I start small I’ll get a layout completed a lot sooner, then at least I can be running trains while I’m thinking about my next project. If I include enough switching and industry and give my little pike a purpose for existing, I shouldn’t get that bored that easily. [;)]
So there’s that taken care of. It should do.