I saw. Semi truck hauling liquified CO2 yesterday. It was owned by POET Energ, a big player in the ethanol industry. That made me curious be there’s a big fight going on over a proposed CO2 pipeline in our area. So I went down the rabbit hole to learn about liquified CO2.
The pipeline would go from ethanol plants on the plains to a home in the North Dakota oil fields. Hmmm… If it can move by truck, is any of it moving by train? Every ethanol plant has a rail siding, as do a lot of big energy operations. Could liqu CO2 move profitably by rail?
I remember in 1967 when I was working at Etna, PA seeing a number of Linde insulate cars that were carrying Liquid Oxygen to the Pittsburgh steel mills for their ‘basic oxygen furnaces’. The cars appeared to be ‘box cars’ but the box was the insulation around the tank holding the Liquit Oxygen - there was vent on the cars to keep the tanks from getting over pressured.
Well, new CO2 pipelines seem to be about as popular as new oil and gas pipelines. If nothing else, maybe the ethanol plants can propose sending the CO2 by rail until people start screaming that it would be safer by pipeline. [:-,]
Not sure what they’re producing in Cedar Rapids, but it sure stinks when the wind is coming from the wrong direction. Their website lists a whole range of products- ethanol is just one. We’re good friends with a couple who used to live here and he worked for them as a chemical engineer, but he quit and they moved to South Carolina.
Thanks for the link. In a weird way, I found that very interesting. It’s kinda like when you find yourself going down some rabbit hole on Wikipedia and learning a lot about WWI Mediterranean Sea battles.
One of the CO2 pipeline projects in ND goes to the oil fields for enhanced recovery. While you would think it is cheap, the seller will charge as much as the buyer will pay.
One side effect of shipping CO2 is that at times the safety valve will let the gas escape creating a small white plume at the top. When this happens many times some unknowing bystander along the line will see this plume and think it is something bad happening. So they call the operations/dispatcher’s center, who in turn contacts the train crew to have them stop and check the train. Sometimes stopping can be averted if the person has taken the time to get a car number which the crew can then check on their hazardous print out to see that is in fact CO2 and it isn’t going to hurt anyone.
That happens when any liquified gasses are shipped - CO2, O2, N, etc. Since they all develop pressures that must be vented to prevent a pressure caused explosion.
Watched many of these cars on trains on the P&W Sub out of Pittsburgh during my stint of working Operator position during the Summer of 1967 -
We have two almost true, but misleading, posts above.
Jim’s story is correct. His language is not. Carbon Dioxide tank cars have a ‘pressure regulating valve’ in addtion the their safety valve. Pressure regulating valves, which are rare, start to discharge at a pressure well below the start to discharge pressure of the safety valve. I havent been a Bureau of Explosives Inspector for decades by my memory is that cars were Specifiction 105A500W, the 500 being tank test pressure. That implies a safety valve start to discharge pressure of 375 pounds. I do not recall what the pressure regulating valve start to discharge pressure was/is, but was below 375 pounds.
Balt’s statement that discharges of ALL liquefied gasses are routine in transportation is false. The name of the game is to keep the juice in the can. It is true that a few cryogenic commodities, and his list is of crogenic commodities, have pressure regulating valves. These are low pressure, 60 or 100 pound tank test pressure, cars. They have safety valves that start to discharge at 75% of tank test pressure, and they have pressure regulating valves that start to discharge at a lower pressure, I think it is 25 pounds.
I lived this for 13 years as a Bureau of Explosives Inspector, Manager Field operations, and Superintendent Hazardous Material Control for Southern Pacific. If you want to check me out see 49 CFR, parts 100 through 199. Tank car part is 174 IIRC. If you are not already familiar with how the Hazardous Material Regulations are structured, you have many hours of unhappy reading ahead of you!
Liquified gases can, for a variety of reasons, generate pressures in their containers that require venting of said over pressure conditions. Yes, the name of the game is to get as much of the product as possible from origin to destination.&nbs
