Looking For Website(s) to Provide Info For Conversion Of Older Brass Steam To Modern DCC

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

Well, anything will work actually.

Here is the deal… I have quite a few older engines in brass from a late, great uncle. (60’s vinatge mostly) A few of the engines are not worth putting on the rails again. They are destined for the glass shelves I am afraid. But quite a few of them, are quite beautiful and I would love to return them to their full glory, plus some. Tenshodo and Olympia are the most common of the builders. I have about 12 to 15 units I would love to convert, varying from a Big Boy, to a Santa Fe 4-8-4 to Hudsons and even a PRR K-4 I think.

So, any info that I could get pointed into, I would love to read about. Web sites, write ups, even folks willing to email with me. I will be converting them to DCC and I am going to go with sound decoders. I am not worried about which decoders yet, that will come later. I want to start learning about things like, which motors are good to replace the originals, and tricks and tips for the conversion, thing to look out for, etc. I am sure there is alot to learn to do these right…

Basically, ths is my first step in doing my homework and research [:)] Thanks for the tips. Maybe I will post some pics later in the weekend of the “old fleet”

2

Big John–

Buddy, take it from me, THERE IS NO OLD BRASS THAT IS NOT WORTH GETTING BACK INTO RUNNING SHAPE!! Say that as a Mantra for about four weeks, okay?

That is, of course, unless the drivers have threatened to turn into dust, or the gear-boxes look impossible, but even then, impossible gear-boxes and old dead motors can be replaced from NWSL, and old drivers can be replaced from Greenway Products: www.greenwayproducts.com and if I can do it to a 1952 Austin 2-8-2, you can do it too, my friend.

Now, for the brass you want to resuscitate–remember, brass is extremely forgiving and easy to work with. For DCC, all you have to do is insulate the motor from the frame, and you can do that with standard silicone caulk. If you HAVE to replace the original open-frame motor (and you’d be surprised at how many open-frame motors still are a ‘can-do’ with a little tweaking), then I’d check with NWSL (Northwest Shortline, sorry I don’t have their e-mail right off hand) and see what replacement motors are available for whatever locomotives that you have. Amazing, how NWSL seems to have just the ‘right’ can motor for your loco, no matter how old or obscure. After that, installing a Decoder is pretty easy, from what I understand.

Now remember, that I am strictly DC, but my large roster is about 90% brass, and some of it probably predates your father, if not yourself, but there isn’t a single locomotive in my cabinet that just sits there. It all runs, and I make sure that it runs well. And a lot of it is DCC ready if I ever choose to go that route, due to remotoring.

I’m sure that you’ll get some responses that are far more specific than mine on converting your brass, but I just wanted to post this to tell you again that brass is EASY and FORGIVING to work with. It’s like Swiss watches, though–it does need a bit more tweaknig tha

3

Here Tom, allow me:

http://www.nwsl.com/ (Contact info is at the bottom of their home page)

[:D]

4

Thanks for the reply Tom. Actually, your post was helpful, if anything, put me at ease a little. Its funny, for a living I do custom work on 4x4s. I dont even think twice about ripping out the factory suspension to build a new one, or cutting off the back half of some jeep frame just so I can put a bigger axle in it. Drop a Chevy 350 into a jeep? Sure, no problem. Re-motor some silly old train choo-choo… excuse me while I have a smoke and freak out a little.

I think biggest reason I am nervous is that are more or less family treasures. They belonged to my Mom’s uncle, William Hunter, who she adored. He had a small 2 bedroom house in Philly where he had a small 4x8 and from my understanding, a gigantic collection. In 1971, he finally got his house with a basement. But sadly, within 8 months of moveing into his dream home, cancer took him. My mom said one of the saddest sights she saw, was the people taking out the 8 sheets of 4x8 lumber and a pile of 2x4’s he had purchased. He never even got a chance to cut it. When my mom comes over to vist and sees my garage layout, its not uncommon for her to get a tear or two. I swear I can see a 9 year old girl being amazed by the trains again.

Well, I know with the old vetrans brass means alot more then it does today, in speaking of value. On his death bed, he knew what would become of his collection, it would get sold off. But, his one request was, “Dont sell my engines, unless you really, really need the money.” Well, 1974 my mom and my dad moved out to Arizona and they took with them best engines he had. I guess he had close to 200 of them. But, most were kits he had put together and were in ok to fair shape. The U-Haul trailer was only so big, and they brougth what they could. 3 large boxes, 2 filled with his brass engi

5

Bingo, thanks Ken. [:D]

6

I can’t add any to your request on converting brass locos to DCC, but I agree with twhite brass is very forgiving and easy to work on. You sound a lot more technically proficient than I am and I have resurrected a couple of broken down locos, if a fumble bum like me can do it you should be flying through it. Please post some pics of the fleet it sounds pretty interesting.

7

MOST brass had good detail but were so so to poor runners.

NWSL provides Motors, Gear boxes, and brass Wheels for do-it-yourselfers, or those wanting their 'Crown Jewels to perform bette’r.

Latter Day brass such as OVERLAND has great drives - with prices to match - but older brass , which was inexpensive back then. can greatly benefit by the upgrade.

ANY old brass I woul expect to need remotoring and regegearing to match up with todays better mechanisms. Problem is when the amount of money invested shackles your interst in running, and one becomes a (ugh) ‘Collector’.

8

Canazar, check out Mark Schutzer’s website: http://markschutzer.com/index.htm

One thing you do have to do is isolate the motor from the frame.

Andre

9

Hi There Canzar;

Boy are you ever lucky! Not only do you get some great brass but you also get to carry on in your dad’s footsteps. I have converted a few old (60’s) brass to DCC. I have found the easiest way to isolate the motors is with double sided foam tape because the motors are usually sitting on a narrow brass channel. Not enough surface for the silicone to really get a bite & insulate. Whereas the foam tape will lay across both frame rails & wrap around the sides giving a lot of contact area for the motor. Hope I made this understandable.

Good luck & post some pics.

Tom

10

Sorry Don, but I have to disagree here. I have never handled a brass engine that couldn’t be made to run extremely well except early, early Tenshodo. Oftentimes just adjusting the mechanism and brush pressure would do it.

This is very true. With advancements in motors and gearing setups starting in the 1970’s most brass became exquisit runners right out of the box.

Here again I have to disagree. I have taken many brass engines, spent a couple of hours tweaking the mechanism until it will roll across a piece of glass with just the weight of the frame on it, and then tweaking the motor until its draw has dropped by more than half, and have had these locos perform better than even a Kato diesel, using a plain transistorized throttle from MRC. The only time I replaced the gears/or motor in a brass engine was if even after tweaking, it sounded like a sewing machine. Then I replaced both. When DCC came along I started checking stall currents and startup currents and if after tweaking, they were greater than a standard decoder the motor got replaced. I used to go as far as taking the commumtator out of the motor frame and balancing it. When the motor was reassembled, I remagnetized the m

11

Tom,

Thanks for posting that idea of double-sided foam tape, you just taught an old dog a new trick, LOL! I’ve got a couple of old narrow-frame brass locos that are going to need new motors pretty soon, and I’ve been wondering if the silicone will be enough.

Thanks again.

Tom [:)]

12

Tom;

When I remotor a loco, for me or anyone else, I use a hot glue based caulk. It is white, and at times hard to find. When set its flexible and any type of paint used on the loco doesn’t affect it at all. Just insert the caulk into the gun, heat it and when its ready to come out of the glue gun, lay a layer on the frame and press the motor in place. When it cools in 30-60 seconds, the motor is solidly mounted, as well as insulated from the frame. Advantages are ease of use, strenght, flexible, durable ie. doesn’t deterioate over years, unaffected by paint, one pack will last for YEARS. Cons are, its white and needs painting, can be hard to locate in stores, sometimes the “curing” time may not give enough time for proper position adjustment.