Can anyone tell me about Mantua Classics engines, either the blue box era or the ornate red box era? Are these reasonably decent engines for the price? Are they closer to old Mantua engines, the ones that had mostly if not all metal parts, or had Tyco-ness crept into the manufacturing process, resulting in the use of cheap plastics? Or did they fall someplace on the spectrum between old metal Mantua and cheap plastic Tyco?
Thanks in advance.
I bought a 4-6-2 a few years ago under that label. Metal boiler, plastic tender. Very much in the Mantua tradition. Runs smoothly and a decent puller. I added a few details and ended up repainting the boiler. The connector between the tender and the loco created problems at some point - I ended up hardwiring it. Not sure if this was a common problem or not. I don’t run it very often - since then, I bought some Bachman engines that are better detailed.
Simon
I’d never heard of Mantua Classics, but do have an all-metal Tyco 0-6-0T, with its original Tyco box. I got it in the early-to-mid '50s, but seldom use it nowadays.
Wayne
I bought a Mantua Classics mikado a few years ago. I did not run it much, but I remember that it ran fine.
Since I bought it, I have added three Oriental Powerhouse and two Sunset Brass USRA mikados. I sold the Mantua Classics model a few years ago.
I had no problems with it. It sure ran better than a tender-driven Tyco.
Maybe this helps.
-Kevin
I have a Mantua 2-6-6-2 tank locomotive I like just fine. For the era it was made it is a good buy, well enough detailed and a solid performer. The old style left side rea driver/ right side front driver power pick up is not as reliable as more modern all driver plus tender pickup though.
Mine picks up power just fine and has no operational issues. Mine has a tender, is yours the tank version maybe?
Mine also does not say “Mantua Classics” on the box, just Mantua.
The only problem with mine was zinc-pest on the lead truck. It was easy to make a new one from 0.030" sheet brass.
-Kevin
Mine stalls on unpowered frogs on Atlas Code 83 curved and wye turnouts. Powering the frogs fixes that.
Mine is the tank version.
Mine is in a red Mantua box as far as I recall, not sure what age it is.
It sounds to me like you have subtle vertical elevation changes on your rail. Carefully and correctly laying the track prevents this issue.
Are you using the right tools?
-Kevin
Mantuas are easily upgraded can motor and/or DCC.
First off, in any given year starting in 1957 until 1970, there was no diffeence between the TYCO product and the Mantua product. They came out of the same factory with the same parts.
The difference was RTR vs kit - but Mantua later droped the Mantua name and sold all the products under the TYCO name.
THEN THEY SOLD THE COMPANY to Consolidated Foods, the kits went away, and the product went down hill. And the TYCO brand name was used on all kinds of hobby/toy products.
In 1977 the original owners, the Tyler family, bought the model train portion company and tooling back and reintroduced the original products (with some eventual upgrades) again under the Mantua name - that is were the Mantua Classics come in.
So “cheap TYCO” only applies to stuff made from 1970 to 1977…
In 2001 it was sold to Model Power and in 2014 Model Power and all the Mantua assets were sold to Model Rectifier Corp and in 2018 they sold the Mantua assets to LIONEL.
LIONEL has released a number of items with very little changes to the product - 64 years afters its original introduction…
Plastic - yes, long before originally selling the company, some parts of the locos changed from metal to plastic - cabs, pilots, tender shells, etc. This did not really change the overall “quality” of the product.
At various times new products were developed that actually used much of the existing tooling with just a few changes or different parts, so there are lot of variations in 64 years.
They can be made to run very well, but as offered, even today from LIONEL, detail is crude and basic.
Back in the day they were popular starting points for kit bashing and super detailing.
As a young modeler in the late 60’s, I built a number of the kits, and inherited several my father had built.
Not a product I have any interest in today, but as a young man doing train repairs in a local hobby shop, and as a young modeler in t
Shock Control,
Sheldon has given you the best answer amongst all you have received. There is quite a story behind the Mantua locos including metal, plastic, details, motors, gear boxes, dates, company owners, and branding like Classics, Mark II, & Presidents. If you are really interested, all the stories are on the Internet in places like HOSeeker’s documentation section. There are several company history sites too. Google for that stuff and you will find the answers you need - The Mantua Classics are interesting.
Steve G.
But I am asking specifically about the Mantua Classics line that came in the ornate red box. These are much later models, long after Tyco had gone its own way, and I’m wondering how similar to or different from the old Mantual engines.
Did you read what I posted?
The Mantua Classics in the red boxes are just like the original 60’s versions with the following up grades:
Can motors, improved wiring.
Some small detail improvements, ususally not really correct.
Wider selection of loco types created mostly by mixing and matching existing parts.
Some new tooling, using the same design theory as the original designs.
A Mantua Classics Pacific or Mikado is basically the same frame, drivers, boilers as were used in the 60’s.
The Pacific boiler was put on the Mikado drive to create a light Mikado. The original Mikado also remained and was partly based on the DT&I 800 Class heavy Mikados.
These are just a few examples.
In terms of quality and out of the box performance, the red box Classics are in many ways the
I have a Mantua Classics 2-6-6-2T. The original Mantua model for this one came around in the early 80’s or so and had a plastic shell from the beginning, so this one also has a plastic body since they simply re-used the old tooling. Any models that were only made from metal continued to be made from metal. The can motor and flywheel combined with Mantua’s quality gearing make it a smooth and quiet runner.
The last I heard for the Mantua line is that Lionel bought it for improving their own HO products, but apparently has no plans to actually bring any of the classic models back out.
[quote user=“ATLANTIC CENTRAL”]
Did you read what I posted?
The Mantua Classics in the red boxes are just like the original 60’s versions with the following up grades:
Can motors, improved wiring.
Some small detail improvements, ususally not really correct.
Wider selection of loco types created mostly by mixing and matching existing parts.
Some new tooling, using the same design theory as the original designs.
A Mantua Classics Pacific or Mikado is basically the same frame, drivers, boilers as were used in the 60’s.
The Pacific boiler was put on the Mikado drive to create a light Mikado. The original Mikado also remained and was partly based on the DT&I 800 Class heavy Mikados.
These are just a few examples.
In terms of quality and out of the box performance, the red box Classics are in many ways the highest quality the line ever achieved.
But please loose the idea that TYCO is all junk. The original owners created and switched over to the TYCO name, with no change in quality, 13 years before Consolidated Foods bought it and used it to market cheap toys. So a 1965 “TYCO” loco is EXACTLY the same as any pre 1970 product in a Mantua box, and is the same or very similar to post 1977 products in Mantua boxes.
NO major redesign was ever done to these products. Most parts interchange no matter when they were made.
Specific Consolidated Foods TYCO items like the tender drive “Chattanooga Choo Choo” do not share ANY parts or design with the products orginally made by the original company and those products remained property of Consolidated Foods when the original product line was sold back to the Tyler family.
BUT, old or new, each individual loco had good points and bad points, some shared lots of parts with other models, some only shared a few parts.
If you have a SPECIFIC question about a specific model (Pacific, Mikado, 10 wheeler, big 6
Yes, I realize that the early Tyco lines were essentially RTR versions of Mantua kits.
However, very early on, Tyco began to cut corners in subtle ways with their rolling stock.
My impetus for asking this question is that I have picked up some Mantua Classics rolling stock over the years, and they are not of the same quality as the postwar era Mantua rolling stock. I did not know the degree to which the Mantua Classics locomotives followed this pattern. But you have answered my question in great detail. Many thanks!
Funny you should mention that. Those Atlas metal frog turnouts have bumpy frogs. A machinists file is a good tool to use to fix that. Buying Peco turnouts instead is a lot less work. No more Atlas for me, these new Walthers turnouts are much better made.
I would be interested to understand what you see as “not the same quality”? These were never highly detailed or highly accurate models, and personally, I don’t see the introduction of plastic parts as a decline in quality.
While I am very familiar with these products because of my exposure to the hobby and industry for my whole life since childhood, I do not have any examples on my layout. Even at a young age I was not interested in the “toy” nature of these products, quality or not, having truck mounted couplers, poor rolling qualities even back in the day, and crude clunky detail.
Especially the rolling stock, they are what they are, “train set” trains, entry level for
My Mantua Classic 2-6-6-2 locomotive dates from 2008 according to the included parts diagram sheet.
Yes, now that the topic switched to freight cars, I am also curious.
Mantua freight cars were never really good models, so I am interested in what was considered to be a decline.
I think I have one “Mantua Heavy” stashed somewhere. I seem to remember taking it out of the box, not being real impressed, and putting it away for “later”.
-Kevin