I have a newbie question regarding the best way to model mountains on a layout. A lot of the books and videos describe the lattice-weave cardboard method while others, especially Woodland Scenics espouses the crumpled and stacked balls of newspapers. Which method is better and why?
Welcome to the forums.
It amounts to what works for you. None is better or worse, it is mostly a matter of what seems to be intuitive for the modeller and what they actually try once or twice, and then settle on. I did the stacked extruded foam and kind of enjoyed the process. I would need more patience to to it again, but I know now that it can be made to look very convincing.
For my current layout, I used aluminum window screen with plastic grocery bags stuffed with crumpled newspaper behind it to keep it from sagging once I applied the heavy wet ground goop I was using as my terrain. I used a hot glue gun to glue the edges of the screen to the bench and to my spline roadbed.
That worked well, and I will probably use it again if I decide not to use the extruded foam. In fact, the current layout has a bit of both because I wanted light flat spots for an urban setting.
It is easy to make small dioramas to practice on and see how it goes. One method will pop for you and you will be on your way.
-Crandell
Hi,
I personally prefer the lattice-weave cardboard method but will also use other methods like the crushed newsprint when it seems to be a better solution. Really I’d like to keep the crumpled paper in the layout to a minimum. Seems a bit flammable. Of course, sometimes you can pull the paper out after the plaster has set.
The carved foam methods are also effective.
Have fun,
Hi, Jim. It was my understanding for a ground goop that once it dried and hardened, one was meant to remove the stuffing, and even to move them on to the next site being terrained.
-Crandell
Crandell,
I agree…get the stuff out of there and reuse it. I think some folks leave it in but they may have their reasons like the type of benchwork or something.
Thanks for the quick replies. I can see how it could be both a matter of what works for you plus what you intend to do with the terrain. Supporting a building might need more heft than just a few trees, for example. Of course, the weave method would permit hidden access to the underside through the fascia boards that might be more onscured using layers of foam or crumpled newspapers. I also worry whether the newspapers might promote mold especially if they absorb much water from the plaster cloth covering.
Also the plaster shell (hydrocal) is very strong after it hardens and even a hollow shell will support a lot of weight, especially if the shell is thick.
Here you can see both methods or maybe three. Much of the paper could be removed from the back after the plaster hardened.
Mold could be a problem, but I would worry about it only in an enclosed space, or a space poorly ventilated, that was not also de-humidified…which I use for two months of the year as a rule. The paper in my case, remember, is inside plastic shopping bags, so that little trouble is precluded.
I also latched onto the fact that a domed, or convex terrain with either goop or shell would be much more capable of supporting itself and withstanding some hard knocks and penetration, just as an arch is. So far, so good!
-Crandell
I have used both the cardboard lattice and the plaster cloth over newspaper methods. Both worked but I liked the newspaper system better. I also put the newspaper in plastic grocery bags so that the paper does not get wet. With just a couple of exceptions I left the paper in. I have not used screen since about 1960, and I have never used the stacked foam.
Bob Grech has been posting many pictures the past month of his latest Western Pacific rendition that can give you a good idea of rock-solid benchwork to cardboard lattice covered with plaster cloth to finished scenery…
8-23-2009 – Bob Grech’s Western Pacific Redux
9-05-209 – First Section of Scenery Complete
9-27-2009 – Scenery Continues On My Western Pacific
I am a fan of foam, carved and painted. It can be stacked to any height and gotten free from construction sites. For ground goop, add some Lysol to deal with mold. I add a couple of pics. We have discussed foam scenery at leangth and will be glad to again if foam scenery interests you. I think carving foam makes less mess and takes less talent. It may take more time.
Welcome. There are many methods of making mountains, all viable. I like the cardboard strip lattice, plaster cloth, and a mix of Sculptamold/Structolite-Gypsolite mix, per Dave Frary’s book Modeling the Pennsy Middle Division. In my opinion, cardboard lattice is inexpensive, easily obtainable, easy to work with, no mess, strong, light, and easy to make adjustments. DJ.
Welcome. If you have an area where you are going to plant trees, foam is a good choice as you can just poke a hole in it and push in the tree. This can be done even if you have a layer of goop of some sort over the foam. Some folks use a dab of glue to hold the trees in, others just seem to poke them in and leave it at that.
There is a nice article in the March MR using foam to create background hills in a narrow space.
The diarama idea is good or just do a hill or two with each method. Nothing says you can’t take them out if you don’t like them.
Good luck,
One twist to the cardboard lattice method is what I call the a la Howard Zane method, using red rosin paper and white glue. You cut the red rosin paper to the shape you need tack it in place with a hot glue gun same goes for making the cardboard lattice, once you have it tacked in place paint it with straight white glue. You can apply ground cover immediately or wait till it’s dry and then just go back and either put a fresh coat of white glue on it or spritz it with a spray bottle of water and the glue softens up enough for the ground cover to adhere. It’s as just strong as any other hard-shell method used except a whole lot cheaper.I never tried this before so I made a mock up mountain on a module and after the glue dried a few days later I actually bounced a tennis ball of of it, not something I would suggest trying but it convinced me how strong it was.
A roll of red rosin paper cost about $10.00 and a gallon of white glue is also under $10.00 and it will yield you a heck of a lot of mountains.
try great stuff i used it to make my hills mountins ect. then i took a hack saw blade (with out the handel to carve away the areas i didnt want then i covered it all with plaster cast cloth from woodland scenics i dont think ill ever try the latis stile again
Do you mean the expanding foam in a can stuff? Did you you build up any kind of support to hold it, or just spray it around. I’ve been thinking of trying door screen material, with some wood supports and covering it with Great Stuff. Got any pics?
Tom
yes i did mean the stuff in the can. no support frame is needed but you will need to do it in layers and each layer need atleast 2 hrs to set befor you put another layer on top of it if you dont it will not exspand the way you would like to once its all dry you can shape it by cutting it with a knife or hacksaw blade . DONT GET IT ON YOUR HANDS IT DOSNT COME OFF well it will in 2 or 3 days so where gloves