Between Grand Island NE and Central City, NE, on UP’s Overland Route. They have installed several of these. I can only see the signs from the road. What are these? What do they look like? Also it looks like these are being installed at crossovers, then less then 1000 ft down the road there is another set of crossovers with these “movable point frogs”. Why would they do install two crossovers so close together? It also looks like along the line from Columbus to Grand Island the main might become triple tracked, or have lots of sidings. There has been alot of dirt work done, lots of ties and “panel track switches” laying along the right of way. Anyone know for sure what’s going on? When I go to Grand Island on Friday I’m going to take my camera to try to get some pictures of what’s going on.
Crossovers in two-main-track territory are often arranged in pairs to enable movement from either track to either track in either direction. Paired crossovers are accordingly called “universal crossovers” (abbreviated UXO). UXOs are especially advantageous for track maintenance purposes; maintainers can take the section of main track out-of-service between two UXOs and trains can still enter and exit from the two-track section on either end.
RWM
Moveable point frogs are exactly what they say they are, the nose of the frog is moveable, when the switch is lined the nose or point of the frog is also lined, creating a continuous running surface.
The crossovers are "universal crossovers, a pair of left and right hand crossovers, allowing a train in either direction to crossover from one track to the other.
The Columbus Sub is double track, not triple track and they aren’t adding any sidings.
Dave H.
Dave has it right, concerning movable-point frogs, universal crossovers, and the Columbus Sub.
If I’m not mistaken, this stretch of railroad is likely being converted from double track to two-main-track CTC, hence the need for universal crossovers where none were necessary before. (The trackwork may also explain why the perishable train seems to drop off the edge of the earth for a while when it gets past Grand Island!)
If these are, as I suspect, #30 switches (good for crossing over at 50-60 mph), being built between tracks spaced more wisely apart, that would offer a good explanation for why the frogs seem relatively far apart. That one control point could stretch out over as much as a half mile.
I Googled “movable point frogs” and came up with a cool photo album someone posted on a photo sharing website:
http://community.webshots.com/album/72325432GnnUBi
Very nifty and complex pieces of machinery! Obviously must perform well in allowing higher speeds. Jamie
Alias “swing nosed frogs” (From Henry Boot, Inc who re-introduced them to the US) …and they have their own peculiar issues, especially with the metalurgy and the supporting structure.
By the way, I believe I have seen that photo album before and the photographer received permission to take those shots from a workcrew that was there. What are the electronic devices that are between the rails at the frog and at the points? Look to be some type of sensors. And how does the frog actually “move”–does the rail actually flex somehow? I don’t see a gap/seam where the moving piece of rail would be isolated from the fixed rail. Jamie
The “electronic devices” are switch heater air ducts. The blower and heating element assembly are the big galvanized assembly to the outside of the track.
The movable point at the frog is moved by a throw rod actuated by a switch machine, just like the points of the switch.
RWM
Ah thanks for the info! I mistook the air ducts coming from the heater to be bundles of electric cables. Thanks! Jamie
I thought that’s what they might be, just wasn’t sure. Thanks for the info. I knew the UP was going CTC along this line, but I didn’t know it took that much work to install. Like I said before, I’ll try to get some pics of all the work tomarrow when I go to Grand Island.
Pic # 2frog #3 ,I dont see how this works…Looks like a derailment waiting to happen…Can someone explain the mechanics…
The point that makes up the frog moves from one closure rail to the other, just like the point in the switchpoints. If you look closely you can see the notch where it fits into the other closure rail.
#24 movable point frog turnouts require three switch machines – one for the points, one for the frog, and one halfway up the points, because the points are so long. That’s why there are three signs out there, one at each switch machine, reminding the trainman that when taken in handthrow, he or she needs to throw all three, not just one – or else the train derails.
RWM
Yeah, it’s sort of hard to believe. The frog consists of two converging rails, one straight and one bent. To shift the frog you have to bend the straight rail and straighten the bent rail-- which (once it’s straightened) becomes the rail in use.
Amtrak’s 80-mph x-overs on the NEC have three switch machines on each set of points and two on each frog-- so twenty switch machines at each two-crossover interlocking. But NJT’s 80-mph x-overs only have two machines on their points and one on their frogs.
Well,
I looked at the pics again and I dont believe Im seeing the whole frog…I still dont get how it works so I’ll just take ya’lls word for it…I was a trackman for the MKT some 30 yrs ago but I dont see how this thing works…
Not only that–there’s a specific order in which things have to be done, and it isn’t as easy as 1-2-3. After taking the switches off-line, you throw the lever for the points halfway, Then go to the mid-point lever and throw it all the way, then go back and finish the job on the point throw. Then you attend to the frog.
Then, because this is a crossover and rules prohibit movement through it until it’s entirely lined, you walk to the other end and repeat the procedure with the other switch.
Danny, the close point rail is already in position and it lines up intuitively, would you agree? In other words, as we currently see it, it works. To diverge, the close point snuggles left from our vantage point. Notice that the far point is slightly crooked, and has an odd angle facet facing inboard, facing the other rail. It must also swing left from our point of view, but it’s angle will result in further travel, which will bring that odd face in perfect alignment. It looks odd askew as it does, but if you image both rails swinging to our left, their flange faces will rotate to the point where it makes as fine a meet as the current view with the single point rail tight to the right.
Here’s a couple pics of the work being done. I forgot to grab my camera, so I had to use my phone. Sorry for the crappy quality.
As you can see they have stuff piled clear up to the road, maybe 20’ from the edge of the road.
“As you can see they have stuff piled clear up to the road, maybe 20’ from the edge of the road.”
You got it backward bubba - betcha the road is encroaching/ by license on UP R/W - Especially if its the 400’ wide 1862 grant R/W on the transcon. The CNW stuff is a mix of various grant R/W’s and can be anywhere from 200’ (typical) and 400’ wide witha few 100 foot fee pieces thrown in after umpteen line changes.
I have always assumed a western road, like the UP, got to the present right of way boundary from the original 400 feet because it sold what it deemed unneeded width very early after construction. Staying with the UP example, you see towns on the plains today with structures (and railroad customers, think grain elevators) that seem uncomfortably close to the right of way. I’ve wondered if the railroads wish they had some of that property back when it comes time to tripple track, for example.
However, the sense of Mudchicken’s comment is that it is in fact the other way around; the railroad allowed an easement on their property for one purpose or another. Is that the more common case?
Movable Point Frogs, Northeast Corridor, Kingston RI
