I was wondering if anyone had both of their latest offerings in HO. What are the pros and cons? I’m specifically looking at the BLI Mohawk Hybrid vs MTH Mohawk PS3.0.
I’m not really interested in advance consisting, or speed curves - so limited support of DCC by MTH is not an issue to me - I just need advanced address and momentum, don’t care about smoke. For now it looks like advantages of BLI Mohawk are proper tender spacing, QSI DCC, Scullin drivers. What I like about MTH is great sound, Canon motor, proper firebox color - negatives are unrealistic tender spacing and I hear some units had gear issues. Otherwise it looks like detail level is about on part between BLI Hybrid and MTH diecast.
Anyone knows if on MTH you can preset master volume - so next time it starts up it doesn’t start at max setting?
I have a BLI 2-8-2 Heavy Mikado and just got a MTH NYC Mohawk. I am having trouble with the Mohawk, it wont work in DCC mode, works great in regular DC though. Have an email in to MTH but havent heard back from them yet.
The BLI engine, no problems what so ever.
If I dont hear from MTH soon I will be selling the mohawk and getting another BLI to replace it.
The sound on the MTH is better than the BLI, MTH has a nice smoke unit, BLI does not, (the paragon2 series is supposed to have a comparable smoke unit) While I like the better sound and smoke features of the MTH, they are not much good if I cant run the engine on DCC.
I have 7 BLI steamers and will never pay for an MTH loco. MTH started the whole messy lawsuit action about sound decoders that did nothing for us modelers except drive up the cost. Then they have the audacity to develop their own power system and limit DCC accessibility in the loco. A smoking loco is really just a gimmick in my book. I remember the oily smell that lingers in the room for days from the old Lionel days. You wonder what the oily smoke is doing to your scenery and lungs.
I know MTH name always brings heated debate here. And I appreciate everyone’s input, but I don’t want this topic to sidetrack, so really I just want to hear reviews from owners of locos from either company. One thing that I’ve can’t tell from online reviews is if QSI sound/speaker combo in BLI Mohawk Hybrid is comparable to MTH, because otherwise, I know for a fact that MTH has better sound quality than average BLI engine.
I have a BLI Mohawk. My first one only ran at one speed (~30 sMPH) so I had to send it back to BLI for repair. (BLI opted to completely replace it.) I sent the 2nd one back to BLI because the drivers were binding slightly. They shimmed drivers 3 & 4 and that took care of the problem. Overall, I’ve been VERY pleased with the detailing of the BLI Mohawk and it runs well.
A friend of mine bought an MTH Mohawk and brought it over to run on my layout. Although the MTH version is a nice model, I personally think BLI’s Hybrid looks much better. Granted, MTH may have the better sound of the two. However, I’ll take a better looking/detailed locomotive over a better sounding locomotive anytime - even if the smoke box is the wrong color.
Buddy, I never have owned a MTH engine. My LHS will not carry any MTH any more. I don’t think it is quality, he just does not like to deal with them.
Do you like to tinker with your engines Buddy? If so you will love BLI and PCM! BLI quality control is lacking, or I just get the bad ones? I have 4 BLI’s and 2 PCM’s. Only two have not been back to BLI and only 1 has not been repaired. I can field strip my M1 A as fast as a M-16 when I was in the Army! I all so know all the repair people at BLI, we are on first name bases.
BLI strong suit is there repair department. In my case they have went out of there way to help me on the phone and when needed send me the parts for free! I do like to tinker and hate to wait, so fixing them my self with free parts was OK. Do I like fixing a $700.00 PCM Big Boy, NO. But on the other hand I can now, so it made me a better MRR.
BLI all so fixed a engine for free that I messed up, that is customer services!
Will I ever buy another BLI steam engine? If they come out with something I want yes! What I will do different is I will take it a part before I run it and lube all the moving parts. 85% of the failures where due to lack of lube.
TSTage, you the kind of person who’s opinion I was looking for. Do you recollect what specifically you liked about BLI steamer better? There are practically no videos of BLI steamer, but plenty of MTH on youtube.com - and MTH looks pretty good to me.
I don’t like what I read about BLI reliability, there a people with bad MTH steamers too, but it seems people consistently complain about quality of BLI engines. I’d hate to plunk $300+ for an engine I than have to fix, and keep sending for repairs - I barely have time for the hobby as it is.
I’ll keep thinking about it, but for now I’m starting to lean towards MTH Mohawk.
That QSI chip in BLI Hybrid sounds so tempting though! The choices, the choices!
Trainsbuddy, I can only speak for myself, an owner of 6 different BLI steamers and a PCM Y6b. Two of the BLI models are from their refurbished outlet, and I had to send one of them back for a faulty decoder. My very first every steamer was their Hudson 4-6-4, and I mucked up a cleaning of the phosphor bronze wiper under one truck…I broke it. I sent it back and they fixed it for the cost of return shipping…nothing more. Not too shabby.
I have three videos uploaded to youtube that you may wish to view for the few minutes it will take. I don’t have a video cam, so I must use a non-stabilized point-and-shoot on video mode. All engines you see are BLI, except for the articulated Y6b Mallet shoving the coal hoppers…it is their PCM product.
This link is to the most recent, a DC “Stealth” version of their Paragon J Class 4-8-4 into which I had a Tsunami “heavy” installed.
While I regret Ken’s experience, and wish he had not been subjected to all that frustration and down time, I have had wonderful, if much more limited, use of my engines. None of mine has more than perhaps three hours of total use, and I don’t load them up to see what length of train will make them stall or spin. Ken would be the first to admit that he makes his engines groan under the strain of heavy loads.
I have no experience with MTH. I am sure they are fine models, but I don’t wish to have limited use of the electronics I pay for, and that would be the case if I were to purchase one.
I really want to get my hands on the MTH class J, its just the price that gets me. I’m also waiting to see if they ever come out with the Powhatan arrow set. If they do, I’m sold.
I don’t do my own decoder installations. The fellow who does them is a good friend who installs them because he really likes that part of the hobby (has a perpetually unfinished layout, but you should see his models of structures and working draw bridges…wow!). All I have to do is to supply the decoder and speaker.
I expect to have to do some of my own installations at some point just to get the experience.
Thanks for taking a look and for your compliment. [:)]
Yes, I did run my steamers hard and have well over 100 hours on them, some 300 plus now. But, not the first Class J. It only had 3 hours on it when it stripped a gear. M1 a cracked center gear happened with in 2 days. I returned the Class J to my LHS for a exchange so I have no idea what was wrong with it. M1 a came with out a drop of lube on the center gear, it was the first one I fixed my self. BLI sent me the center gear for free.
I now limit my steam fleet to 20 cars max except my PCM Y-6 b and Big Boy, they drag 40 cars when I run them.
Even though I like the quality and detail of my MTH Triplex it’s definitely not worth the money and some have said they have gotten great customer service I have yet to experience it. I recently came into a few extra bucks and I intend to purchase a BLI steamer. A few guys I know have them and have nothing but good things to say about them,
Sorry I can’t give more specifics because I only saw my friend’s MTH Mohawk that one time. I just thought that the overall quality, detailing, and look of the BLI Hybrid Mohawk was generally better than that of the MTH Mohawk. MTH’s version - to me - still has a “flavor” of 3-rail O to it - if that makes any sense?
I’ve also seen pictures and video of the MTH Dreyfuss 20th Century Hudson and come away with the same conclusion. Here’s a pre-production pic of the BLI Hybrid Dreyfuss Hudson. Obviously, it hasn’t been painted yet. However, if BLI’s version looks this good unpainted?..I can’t wait to see what it will look like when it’s completely detailed.
Perhaps part of the difference is due to the fact that MTH’s version is diecast while BLI’s “hybrid” is brass and plastic. With that said, the BLI Mohawk has some serious weight to it. With it’s release this past May, I’m sorta surprised that MR still hasn’t done a review on the BLI-Hybrid yet. [%-)]
I will add that I am happy that MTH has also come out with the NYC Empire State Express (and soon-to-be subsequent cars). I’ve only seen a couple of shots of their ESE but it does look like a nice rendition of it. Even so, I have my pre-order for the BLI Dreyfuss in already.
You guys make it harder and harder to pick with which one to go. Does BLI model have cab lighting? By the way MR did a review of the BLI Mohawk - but it was pretty short and light on detail - you can look it up in the Member section.
Yes, the BLI Mohawk does come with cab lighting. Also, the review that you read, TB, was submitted by an MR reader. (Hence, why you found it in the “Member” or Reader Review section.) It has yet to be reviewed by the MR staff. (I thought Erik did a good job on it though.) The MTH Mohawk was reviewed in the Dec '08 issue of MR.
I don’t own either the MTH or BLI Mohawks, but I do own 6 MTH engines (4 steam, 2 diesel) and would not hesistate to buy another. One of my engines is an SP GS-4, which was the engine released imediately before the Mohawks. In terms of smooth mechanical operation and consistent speed control under DCC the MTH engines are the best available. The repeatability isn’t that big a deal when running a single engine, but the smooth drivetrain is always nice. Pulling away with a sting of passenger cars at 1 smph is a joy.
The tender gap can be brought closer together by either modifying the drawbar by drilling a second hole or purchasing one of the new two-hole drawbars that came on the ESE and Dryfess Hudsons. I’ve ordered a second drawbar for my GS-4 and will post photos of the modification when it’s done.
Interesting that they now offer extra draw bars to correct the problem of the possibility of a crew member falling off the deck plate. Did they furnish them as a customer free item or did you have to pay for the replacement?
I only have “one of the above,” an older BLI Hudson with QSI sound. I’ve been very happy with this engine. It pulls well, and has been 100% reliable. I like the sound, although it’s always had a bit of a rattle on the horn, and one day I need to go in and either clean out the speaker or replace it. But, it’s not enough of an irritant that I’ve gotten around to it yet, and that engine runs most days on my layout.
I ordered the extra drawbar from the MTH parts department. I didn’t ask to get it for free and I wouldn’t expect it. That would be like expecting NCE to give me a free EPROM whenever they updated their software. My intension for this bar is to drill a hole closer and shorten it from stock length. That will let me swap drawbars with a single screw when I get to operate on wider curves than what I have at home.
