I watched video the other night on Wiring Your Layout with Andy Sperandeo as the host.
Towards the end of the video, Andy makes a comment that he uses Music Wire to “drill” holes through the Roadbed, Foam and Plywood. He states that he uses a diameter wire that is slightly larger than the dropper.
This sounded like a great idea, as I am modelling in N Scale and the smallest drillbits I can find with and length are 3/16.
So, I eagerly went out and bought some Piano Wire to try and replicate Andy’s suggestion.
Having a trade background, I did ask myself the validity of the method, as Piano wire has no flutes to discard the waste material, however, being an eager learner I have jumped in with blind faith in this method.
I haven’t seen that, but can think of several things that might help…
Music wire can be a lot longer that the average drill bit, so that helps where the foam is thick.
I don’t think it’s actually used like a drill, i.e. flutes and displaced debris. Instead, it simply pushes the material out or aside.
A piece with a loop bent in the end could be plunged up from underneath, have the feeder threaded through the loop, and then pulled down to bring the feeder with it.
I agree with Mike. I think the technique relies on the relative compressibility of foam to be able to shove the wire through.
I use a similar technique myself. I have an 18" long steel rod, 3/32" in diameter, which I use to “drill” holes. I use a 1/8" drill bit to go through the plywood at the bottom, then shove the rod up through. I then insert a thin plastic drinking straw to guide the wires up through. The “stuffing” of the terrain on my layout is either rigid insulating foam board or baled uo newspaper, depending on where you are “digging”.
I’ve used a method similar to this in the workshop for sometime. When using smaller, trim nails and the like through easily cracked material, I’d often use one of the nails as a drill bit to drill a hole. I cut off the head of the nail (what little there is on a trim nail) and install the remainder in the drill. The lack of head leaves it straight and stable. Since the nail is small in diameter, I’ve never had issues with the lack of fluting. I learned this method years ago in middle school shop class.
I’ve never done it with music/piano wire before but it sounds like it should work. I wouldn’t get any with insulation/wrapping on it - just bare metal. I’d also cut the end with some cheap wire cutters (don’t use the ones you use for cutting track!) so as to leave the angled, cut side on the “drill” bit. I can see there being an issue if the factory cut a nice square end and you try to drill with that when you hit the plywood. I found that the nails with different faces to the point drilled better than those with a smoother point.
Anyways, give it a shot. Piano wire is fairly cheap (I got mine from Ace Hardware since the big boxes didn’t have any.) so you’re not out much if it doesn’t work and wire is always handy in the hobby!
My first layout when I lived in an apartment was comprised of two layers of two inch thick foam laminated together. For feeding wires through the foam, I used a piece of 1/8" brass tubing. I bevelled the edge of one end so it was “sharp”. I could easily twist it by hand down through the foam and out the bottom.
With the tubing through the foam, I fed the wire down through the tubing and out the bottom. I then pulled the tubing out of the hole leaving the wire in place.
I found just making a hole in the foam without a guide, the wire would invariably get caught halfway through and ball up. This solved that quickly and easily.
Music/piano wire is more like thin diameter metal rod rather than electrical wire in the more conventional sense. It’s usually hard, rigid and sold in straight sections (sometimes coiled, but avoid that). Mine have always come in little plastic tubes which are great for storing it and it has the dimensions printed on the tube. Music/piano wire is generally rigid enough that significant force must be applied to permanently bend it. Otherwise, it will straighten out again. Getting it to roll into a ball would be next to impossible without exerting enough force to destroy the foam layout top. I believe, Mark, you’re mixing up the two wires and thinking of using electrical wire as a drill bit. That wouldn’t work at all. Also, while the brass tube is great for the foam, it won’t cut it (pun intended) when he hits the plywood mentioned in the OP.
Nah, I think we’re all pretty clear on piano or music wire. Yes, it can be bent, but it holds the shape, that’s why I suggested making a small loop at the end. If the wire is large enough diameter, it will still be stiff enough to push the loop through the foam, not just the wire diameter.
I think the OP is probably mistaken about wire of any kind being used to drill through plywood. And Andy S. would likely use the proper tool for drilling wood, a bit of some kind.
I use music wire / pinano wire for a drill bit when I need a small diamerter long bit. I sharpen the point just like a regular drill bit. The point has to have a flat angle type point. It is a point, but has two flats that will cut into the wood. I use a bench grinder but you could probably use a cut-off disk in a Dremel tool.
I, too, have used nails, sewing pins and piano wire ‘drills.’ Hey - they work!
I strongly suspect, but cannot prove, that, in denser material, they heat up and (mostly) burn their way through. In extruded foam (which has the resistance characteristics of cheddar cheese) they just force the material aside.
Jim, what I meant was, that after I drilled a hole through the foam, I had trouble passing the electrical wire down through said hole, and IT would catch and ball up.
Didn’t consider the plywood base concept. My layout was four inch thick foam slabs in a frame - it had no plywood bottom.
Andy Sperandeo’s tip is old school. I did exactly the same thing…but with 4th July sparkler wire, the larger diameter one’s. File down one end into a chisel point, it basically burns a hole in the wood, don’t need to have flutes on it. Didn’t have foam board in the 40’s and 50’s. You don’t even need a drill for foam, when you have all foam and use the wire. Or use an old fashion, ice pick, almost every household had one of those, before refrigerators were invented. Giving my age away.
One can buy a set of extra long (12") small drill bits online (Amazon) for less than $15.00, or find them at a home store. The 1/8 inch size seems appropriate for a small hole for feeder wires and will not be defeated by plywood. Slow drill speeds and steady hands are my experience.
For a few dollars, you can buy 1/8" diameter drill bits of various lengths at Lowes. The one I use on my N-scale layout is 8" long and easily goes through 2" foam board and 1/2" plywood. My power feed drops are 22 AWG solid wire 8" long which I push up through the hole from the bottom. If the drop wire is straight when you push it up through the hole, usually it goes right through and doesn’t hang up in the foam.
In an emergency situation, if there was no other choice, I might use a piece of music wire as a drill bit. But there are drawbacks to keep in mind.
Unlike a proper drill bit, if you cut it with wire cutters, it’s not going to be anywhere near as centered, etc as a proper drill bit. So it will tend to wander. The longer it is, the morre it wanders, thus tending to negate the advantage of length it may have.
The other thing is a wire bit is not going to break clean like a regular bit. They can have sharp jagged edges. But a music wire will just quickly tangle up, catching the work, you fingers, etc if you’re not careful.
Always best to use the right tool for a job – and safest.
Sorry if I misunderstood you. I was thinking drilling rather than fishing.
Ive be often considered the foam only concept and strongly moved towards building that way on my current (under construction) layout. The only problem is that I live in Florida and one can’t find anything but one inch foam and it is very expensive. It just doesn’t seem to be a building material of choice down here. Disappointed…
The video referred to by the OP is available on Youtube. I have just watched it, and Andy describes how he uses 22 AWG bare wire to create a feeder connection that looks like a rail spike. He does indeed use a piece of music wire slightly larger than 22 AWG to drill through the tie, the roadbed, and the plywood subroadbed (not foam). He uses a scribe to make a starter hole in the tie before drilling, presumably to prevent the wire bit from wandering. Apparently, Andy has found the proper tool to for drilling wood in this situation. He also discusses this method in his Bulletproof Wiring article in the book on how to build reliable trackwork. I am about build my first layout and intend to use Andy’s method for attaching feeder wires to track in an unobtrusive manner.
Hi all: I have been using Piano wire for a drill for quite a long time. I use “two-coil Switch Machines” and most of them are mounted on top, along side the turn-outs. I use .025" Piiano Wire for the linc-age to turn the points. “Snap Switches”. I use the same .025" wire to drill holes through 1/2" or 3/4" PLYWOOD to run the electric wires (3 wires) with 3 holes) up to operate the Turn-outs. I don’t have any foam on my layout except for scenery.
I use a variable speed drill and push just hard enough to let the wire to dig the hole. The end of the wire was cut with a diagonal cutter, so the wire is sort of flattened, and sharp.
Our club uses extra long 1/8" drill bits(there are even ‘extensions’ for them). We then use extra long(12") drinking straws shoved down though the foam - The feeders do not get caught or go ‘sideways’ with the plastic straw liners.
