My frustration level is overflowing, may I vent?

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

Hi!

I am an extremely frustrated and unhappy model railroader today. The folks at Bachmann have just about done me in, and I need to vent. I will try to do so in an acceptable manner, or at least one that will not get this posting deleted, or me kicked off this Forum.

I’ve been a member of this Forum since 2003, written over 1500 posts, and have never brought up a problem with a manufacturer or bad-mouthed anyone’s products. My point is, I am normally a positive and understanding model railroader - and been so since the '50s.

I recently bought a Bachmann Spectrum HO 2-8-0 w/DCC from an Ebay Store (Atomic Hobbies) and quickly got the loco. It was really nice, and my first Bachmann w/DCC. After two weeks, I was running it in reverse and it “threw a screw” - the one connecting the running gear to the 3rd set of drive wheels.

As mentioned in another posting, all my searches and endeavors to get a replacement failed. Bachmann said they would send me an entire chassis and I could exchange it. What a waste of time and effort (and postage) that is, and I initially refused. This morning however, having reached total surrender, I emailed them that I would do so.

Well, now they want my original receipt - something that I threw away soon after I received the loco. So, I was told that I would have to mail in the loco - with a check for $20 to cover repairs. Even though the warranty card has been sent in, they still $20 to work on it. Of course postage will be another $8.

No where was it written that warranty work was only valid with a receipt! If I had known that, I certainly would have kept it.

I am obviously very unhappy about the situation, and deeply regret buying the loco in the first place.</

2

Sorry to hear about your problems. I agree that if an original receipt is required for warranty service and that’s not stated in the instructions or the warranty card itself, it should be. However, I can kind of see Bachmann’s point of view. The warranty normally only covers the original buyer; no doubt in recent years there have been many cases of someone buying an engine and having it sit in the box for five years before they finally decide they’re not going to use it, and sell it on ebay. Then the ebay buyer finds out there’s a problem and wants the work done under warranty. Requiring some proof that they are the correct person to be covered under the warranty isn’t totally unreasonable.

3

I think the $20 charge is standard with Bachmann, from what I’ve read here, receipt or no receipt. [color=red]EDIT Note: Read below. This statement is not correct.[/color] Thanks to those who have pointed out the error. I’ve only got one Bachmann, a Peter Witt trolley, and I have not needed to test this.

How about contacting the seller, explaining the situation, and asking for a duplicate receipt? It certainly won’t cost him anything more than a postage stamp to send you one.

If that fails, you’ve got a computer and a printer, right? I see nothing un-ethical in creating a receipt, printing it up and mailing it in to Bachmann.

4

I recently had to return to BLI my new ‘Stealth’ J Class that I purchased from a seller who claimed it was NIB. Not a big shop, but a guy who has a business moving such products on a large auction site.

I had sent in no card by the time I knew I needed help. BLI asked for proof of purchase, and when I sent them an email with the scanned invoice (I always keep them for a year or so), they were happy with that and agreed to repair it under warranty.

I feel that, if Bachman is in receipt of your registration card, you should have had your purchase honoured, along with the warranty. However, did you happen to notice if the warranty terms require you to provide proof of purchase? If it says nothing about providing proof upon request, at their pleasure, then the card is the implied agreement between both parties for the purposes of warranty repair. Legally, they have no leg to stand on. Neither do they have an ethical leg to stand on.

This is my opinion, only, and not to be taken as legal counsel.

-Crandell

5

I think that they are asking for the receipt because they’re trying to determine whether or not you’ve had the model more than a year. Their limited warranty says that repairs are fully covered for items less than a year old. (I’m not trying to defend them. I’m only offering a possible reason).

To your point, however, the warranty terms are “Items less than a year old are fully covered and will be serviced or replaced at no charge when accompanied with warranty card or proof of purchase”. The way I read this, it is either/or. Either the warranty card, or proof of purchase. If you say that you mailed the card in, then I think that this should have had the date of purchase on it. If that is the case, then I think that I would call them and speak to them directly. If you mailed the card, then it is their responsibility to keep it properly filed. Unless, of course, they claim that it was never received, thereby making it a fault of the postal service.

How did you pay for the engine? Check or Paypal? If either of these methods there should be some sort of paper trail available. And when you ordered, was there any e-mail correspondence from the hobby place thanking you for your order and giving shipping information? If so, then in my opinion that information should satisfy the proof of purchase requirement. By the way, in my opinion when someone says proof of purchase, I think the UPC thingy on the box, not a receipt.

Good luck.

6

I understand your pain. Unfoutunaly that is the state of the world we live in, without a reciept, you cant prove when and where you bought the item, be it a model train or a blender from Wal-Mart. Can you email Atomic hobbies, they should have a record of the purchase. Depening how long ago it was, you might be able to get a something from Ebay or Paypal. Anything showing the date of purchase should suffice. If the item was new, did you email Atomic Hobbies about a replacment. A failure like that within 2 weeks of purchase, espicaly a new engine would warrent a replacement from the hobby shop I do repair work for here in town. Bachmann is the one wild card, you almost always have to ship it back to them for repair or replacment if you cant fix it yourself. Be forwarned, you might get a totaly different engine in return, very common if the model you have cant be fixed and its out of production like the 2 truck HO scale Climax. You would think you could get just a replacment pair of drivers and replace that axle along with the side rod screws as an “assembly”. Go over on the Bachmann forum message board and post your displeasure there. It sounds like all you need is a replacement driver set with side rod screws. Sometimes the Bach-Man customer genteman can assist in getting things made right. Please do keep in mind, that these things are made in another country and Bachmann along with many others including Athearn dont keep spare parts around like they used to. Unfortunatly thats the way it is. I do see junker Bachmann 2-8-0’s on ebay, you could always pick one up for parts and park the remains on a side track as an engine being scrapped. Not the best fix for a new engine, but sometimes the easiest. Call Bachmann’s customer service number, dont email, ask to speak to a supervisor and calmly explain the situation, that you purchased it online, dont have the reciept but give your best id

7

EEEE Gads man! [:-,]. I think one should keep all train receipts period. Whether it is required or not, they are good for remembering when things were purchased and how much they cost. If not for you then for the insurance man and/or your family if you should pass away unexpectedly. I’ve got a folder in the financial file about 2" thick, clearly marked Model Railroad Equipment & Supplies. Should I pass, my wife and/or children won’t be the ones out there saying “Is this old train stuff worth anything? How much could I sell a big locomotive for? It is made out of some yellow color metal? Is $20 too much?”

8

Sorry to hear that, what was wrong with the unit?

9

I’ve seen guys in hobby shops throw the receipt away right there, or even tell the clerk they don’t want one. “Destroying the evidence” for when the wife sees yet another train purchase.

10

I have the warranty in front of me, Friday I shipped a loco back to them for out of warranty repair or exchange. It does state that proof of purchase is required when submitting a claim or…“when accompanied with a warranty card or proof of purchase”. So if I understand this, you only send in the warranty card when you want warranty service? Weird?

I hope it gets straightened out for you soon, I know how issues like this can ruin your hobby time. Good Luck.

11

Not true, I have personally had two locos replaced by Bachmann for no charge, and yes they did ask for a copy of the reciept.

Mobilman44, I understand your frustration, but keeping a reciept for a purchase of that size/value seems sort of normal for me, at least until its out of warranty or i’m sure its OK.

Sheldon

12

I do not think that the request for the receipt is out of line. I would assume that you could send an e-mail to the vendor explaining the situation and that they would send you a duplicate receipt.

If you paid by by Pal you can download that transaction complete with a receipt.

I understand your frustration, but I would not let it ruin your outlook on the hobby. I had a similar situation with Walthers and no receipt no part as a warranty item. Otherwise it is a parts request.

13

Mobileman

I posted in the other thread about the lost screw.

BLI sends extra driver screws with their locos. You might see if one of those would work for now. You may try Bowser or even Greenway products for driver screws. Even if you get one that’s not threaded the same a tap will take care of it.

If Bachmann was to send me a chassis to replace the defective one than I would take the screws from the sent chassis and send it back to them instead of changing chassis.

I had a similar problem with a couple of Digitrax decoders about 7 years ago. They were brand new in the package and $16 each, plug in not hard wired. I plugged them in 2 different locos and placed them 1 at a time on the program track and poof. I unplugged them and put in 2 different decoders (TCS) and programed with no smoke. I emailed Digitrax and they responded to send them in with $15 each for repair. I emailed back saying you guys are nuts and I will trash them and never buy a Digitrax product again. 80 plus decoders now and not one says Digitrax.

All this frustration over a 10 cent screw.

Cheer up be happy. Its only a hobby and not a job.

Pete

14

Out of the box, but after he installed a speaker and decoder, my installer friend found it would lurch badly. He could have gotten into it, suspecting a cracked gear, but he didn’t want to void the warranty. So, I agreed to ask BLI if they would repair it, and they agreed once they knew I was on the up-'n-up. He removed the decoder, leaving the speaker in place, and I shipped it off. Three weeks later, to the day, I had it back and it runs fine. A little hitch at slow speeds still, but not objectionable. I expect it to be fine in another 3-6 running hours. The way I use my engines, that puts it about November of 2014. [:-^]

-Crandell

15

Mobilman44, I read the orginal post about you needing the nut. This posting remined me of something. I had long forgot about a old Bachmann steamer I had that cracked the center gear. It was about this time I went DCC and it was not worth fixing. It is a slop back something, think it was a 0-6-0. I have not laied eyes on it for a year, but is was in it’s box getting ready to be shipped.

Let me know if you want it.

Cuda Ken

16

mobil -

Of course your particular situation makes no sense from a dollar and cents perspective when all they should have to do is mail you a single screw. Well guess what? Companies don’t work that way. It’s just easier for them to replace an item a lot of times. They have their rules and policies and as long as they are stated up front, your option is to deal with the company or not.

I happen to like Bachmann products and given that their Locos have a life-time warranty (for a relatively small shipping and handling charge), it really doesn’t seem like too bad a deal. Heck, I had a similar situation last year. I got an “N” Northern loco (with a set) from eBay and after a few laps a push rod pin came loose. Attemts to reattach it only made matters worse. I mailed it back to Bachmann and a little while later got a brand spankin’ new one. What I paid for it on eBay + the handling fee was nowhere near the price of a new one.

Sure, sometimes company policies don’t make sense on an individual basis, but they have to believe it works for them. In this case - I can’t complain. I might even have a few older locos that “don’t run too great” to send back one of these days!

Archer

17

Folks,

Thank you all for your input (and Cuda Ken especially). Frankly, you all have good points and my now “cooler head” agrees. Normally I do keep invoices/receipts, but for some reason I did not for this loco.

And, while it is reasonable for Bachmann to want to see “proof of purchase”, I felt - and still do - that their possession of my warranty card would be satisfactory.

After sleeping on this, I realize that there are two things that bug me. First of all, Bachmann service essentially ignored my additional emails after the initial exchange. Second, this little screw should be easily obtainable from Bachmann, especially given the umpteen number of units they have sold. Third, they would not even tell me the official specs of the screw so I could order one elsewhere. Ha, I am normally a quiet and patient man, but just can not tolerate being ignored like this.

OK, there is some good news!!! Thanks to some folks that input on my other posting “Threw a Screw”, I learned about small metric screw measurements and was directed to “Micro Fasteners” and “Osorail”. Using a micrometer, I estimated the screw to be a M1.4 x 5 x .3, and order a pack of 10 from Micro Fasteners.

Our mail was extremely late yesterday (9 pm!!!), and they arrived, and glory be, they actually fit!!! Soooo, with a touch of Loctite, I should be back in business - NO THANKS TO BACHMANN!!!

Well, I think I can put this problem to rest, and get on with my layout construction. I learned some stuff from the experience (and hope you readers did too).

Oh, will I buy Bachmann products again??? Yes, of course I will! But, the bad taste this situation gave me will always be there…

Thank you!

Mobilman44 <

18

If you bought it on ebay and/or with paypal. You can go into your account options and print out a statement of activity-- which can go all the way back to when you first joined either of those services if you want/need it to. That should be more than sufficient to prove to Bachmann that you’re the purchaser. I don’t know how you could prove you’re the “original” purchaser however, since you probably don’t know or can’t prove that the guy who sold it to you is an actual dealer and not some guy who got a deal on a case of 'em and is reselling them on ebay.

19

I feel for ya.

20

You think YOU’VE got problems! Just look at what happened to MY Bachmann 2-8-0! I was just running it back from the turntable and it literally fell apart on the way back to the yard!

I paid $38 for it brand new about 15 years ago. I guess you get what you pay for…