Kato has just released their new model of a JNR class C 62 Hudson.
Look at all that detail! The DC version sells for about 140 USD in Japan, which is a reasonable price.
Makes me wonder why there are so few US prototype N scale steamers in the market.
Kato makes a very nice product.
I wish Kato would try its hand at an HO scale steamer.
Rich
Manufacturers must do the same or more engineering for N scale as in HO. In Japan, the N scale market is much larger than HO. In the US, the N scale market is smaller than the HO market.
Lazy US manufacturers would rather make multiple “me too” copies of the same steam loco in HO scale than to innovate, sadly. The funny thing is, the market for the second or third or fourth HO Challenger is probably smaller than the market for a quality N scale oil-burning 2-8-0
HO scalers are never satisfied – all the HO steamers being made now in quality plastic by a half-dozen or so manufacturers and you guys just want more!
Why be satisfied? Kato makes some great product. Why not steam in HO?
RIch
Whatzamatter? The Kato D51 class 2-8-2 wasn’t good enough for you? And that’s not the only JNR locomotive Kato has produced.
Oh, I see. You want a Japanese company with a Japanese customer base (whose CEO throws an occasional sop to the American market) to build a model of a North American steam loco. Tell me, which of the approximately 10,000 American locos would you like?
I think we had this discussion while Mark Newton was still around…
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with a few Kato steam locomotives)
BTW…what happened with Mark Newton?
Oh, I see. You want a Japanese company with a Japanese customer base (whose CEO throws an occasional sop to the American market) to build a model of a North American steam loco. Tell me, which of the approximately 10,000 American locos would you like?
Why not? There was a British company with an overwhelmingly British customer base who tried it (with kits, no less) and failed utterly. They produced an NYC J-1, USRA light Pacific and Mike and a Santa Fe 3160 class Mikado. Of course, they had to dump them at a loss because they couldn’t make money selling them.
Even now that company does produce a model of a 2-8-0 which was used in North America although designed for use overseas in WWII. It’s a kit. They want the equivalent of $480 for it ( 1 GBP = 1.55 USD at current rates). Oh wait a minute. That’s way too much for a locomotive you have to assemble yourself.
http://www.djhmodelloco.co.uk/prodloco.asp?ProdID=3073
http://alaskamodelrrnews.homestead.com/Steam.html#anchor_26
People also seem to forget that that the C-62 and D-51 will sell well to steam minded Japanese customers in part because there wasn’t the incredible variety of engines as used by North American lines. JNR had 1 class of 4-6-4’s whereas the Santa Fe had 2, Milwaukee had 2, C&O had 2, NYC ( including B&A) had 3, and that doesn’t include all the lines that had 4-6-4’s (NKP, NYNH&H, MEC, C&NW, Frisco, CB&Q, NDeM, CNR, CPR and theB&O experimentals). When you get into 2-8-2’s, the different number of designs compared to JNR’s 2-8-2’s becomes incredibly large.
Andre
EDIT: If this D51 is any indication, JNR steam had awesome whistles:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_P6gxudCO8w&feature=related</
My intention with this thread was merely to show what´s possible in N scale nowadays. Kato´s C 62 and D 51 display a wealth of detail and have smooth running mechanisms.
The overwhelming amount of different designs of US steam locos is a major problem for a manufacturer in any scale, not only in n scale, but the lack of steam in N scale is very sad. Other than the UP Big Boy, UP Challenger, the SF Cab Forward, Bachmann 4-6-0 and now USRA 2-10-2, Kato´s GS4 and USRA 2-8-2, there is hardly anything in the market. Steam aficionados have a hard time, unless they want to revert to the rare and expensive brass locos from Key Imports.
Why does a manufacturer like Bachmann or Kato does not dare to produce 2 - 3 different locos from the “Standard Railroad of the World”? I guess a PRR K 4, L 1 or M 1a would sell quite well.
Andre - even the smallish JNR class C 11 2-6-4 T has the same impressive whistle!
Point of order, Andre. JNR had three designs of 4-6-4 - all kitbashes!
And, yes, JNR steam did have awesome whistles!
Mark Newton, the abrasive Aussie, said something (in a PM to Bergie, AFAIK) that got him exiled to Siberia. His posts are still in archived threads, but his member page comes up blank.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - sans C6X class 4-6-4s)
My intention with this thread was merely to show what´s possible in N scale nowadays. Kato´s C 62 and D 51 display a wealth of detail and have smooth running mechanisms.
The Kato engines are very highly detailed and smooth running and it’s certainly possible to have that level of detail in N scale in a North American based model (witness the Kato GS-4).
The overwhelming amount of different designs of US steam locos is a major problem for a manufacturer in any scale, not only in n scale, but the lack of steam in N scale is very sad.
That’s to be expected. The closest thing to standardization in the US were the locomotive designs of the USRA (forget the Pennsy, that was one railroad). However, even with standard USRA designs, things were modified over the lives of the engines on many roads where the ultimate look was totally different from when the engines were built (e.g. Erie K-5 4-6-2’s). Ditto N&W K-2 USRA heavy 4-8-2’s and C&O J-2 USRA Heavy 4-8-2’s. Not only that, but engines of USRA design on one line could look completely different from those on another.
http://www.steamlocomotive.com/mikado/nycstl641-hechtkoff.jpg
http://www.steamlocomotive.com/mikado/slsf4009.jpg
It’s that kind of variety that makes US steam so interesting and also makes you want to tear your hair out at the same time.
These two engines were identical when built. That’ll give any manufacturer fits.
http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/steam-01/2407_sp-steam-p01-gene_deimling.jpg
While true, it really doesn’t vitiate my primary point which was that there were no fewer than 13 classes of 4-6-4’s (ranging considerably in size) in the US (not counting the B&O specials and certainly not counting the Canadian and Mexican examples). There just wasn’t the same kind of standardization here. It certainly would have been feasible physically. It just didn’t happen.
Andre
Chuck,
Have you ever heard of the term “global economy”?
Other Japanese companies with a Japanese customer base also cater to the U.S. market with such items as automobiles and electronics. Wake up, it is no longer 1950.
Rich
Er, uh, no. They’re sold worldwide. Just for an example, check out the Toyota UK site and see what models are available. Want a Prius? They got it. Rav4? Got it. Land Cruiser? Got it (although why anyone would want one of those at British gas prices is beyond me). Yaris? That’s a big 10-4 (Yaris actually was available outside US before being available here). OK, we don’t get the HiLux pickup (at least not under that name - looks like a Tacoma to me). There are models not offered here, but then you could say the same thing about Ford and GM (think Vauxhall and Opel).
Strange that the Toyota Corolla is offered in Turkey (check out Toyota Europe), but not in the UK. OTOH, the Camry is available in the US, Canada and Australia, but not in Continental Europe or the UK. Then again, we don’t get the Avensis.
BTW, the Ford Fusion in Germany bears no resemblance to the one sold here.
Andre
Rich
You are comparing apples and oranges. I can’t think of one model railroad company that is publicly owned (and probably a good thing, too, given what Wall Street would likely do to such a company). Which means that the owners/CEOs make real decisions as to what markets they will serve, and to what extent. Profit is seldom the only motive in model railroad companies - almost all are owned or operated by a person with a passion for a particular part of the hobby. Most are not interested in growing beyond what they consider to be a reasonable time and financial commitment.
As Chuck stated, the Kato CEO’s primary interest is in serving the Japanese market, which he apparently does rather successfully. I’m interested to know exactly how you plan to coerce Kato into making more models for the US market, besides pronouncing how the company ought to be run.
my thoughts, your choices
Fred W
[quote user=“fwright”]
richhotrain:
tomikawaTT:
Oh, I see. You want a Japanese company with a Japanese customer base (whose CEO throws an occasional sop to the American market) to build a model of a North American steam loco. Tell me, which of the approximately 10,000 American locos would you like?
Chuck,
Have you ever heard of the term “global economy”?
Other Japanese companies with a Japanese customer base also cater to the U.S. market with such items as automobiles and electronics. Wake up, it is no longer 1950.
Rich
Rich
You are comparing apples and oranges. I can’t think of one model railroad company that is publicly owned (and probably a good thing, too, given what Wall Street would likely do to such a company). Which means that the owners/CEOs make real decisions as to what markets they will serve, and to what extent. Profit is seldom the only motive in model railroad companies - almost all are owned or operated by a person with a passion for a particular part of the hobby. Most are not interested in growing beyond what they consider to be a reasonable time and financial commitment.
As Chuck stated, the Kato CEO’s primary interest is in serving the Japanese market, which he apparently does rather successfully. I’m interested to know exactly how you plan to coerce Kato into making more models for the US market, besides pronouncing how the company ought to be run.
my thoughts, your choices
Fred W
Please take note of the word “wish”, that is precatory, not mandatory ! [banghead]
Rich
The last time the matter of Kato underserving the US market came up, I suggested that the chief complainer (then a doctor, now a motorcycle) purchase the company and manufacture whatever HE thought would sell.
At last report, Kato was still under the same management.
Of course, I’m perfectly satisfied with Kato’s HOj choices. I just wish I could afford them.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Kato makes a very nice product.
I wish Kato would try its hand at an HO scale steamer.
