Hello all. I am interested in seting up a model train. Due to limited space I was thinking about running a train around the edge of a room in my house. The room is 13’ x 8’. I will probably project out from the wall about 1’ and be about 17" from the ceiling. Will that give me a decent ammount of running space with the radius’. I realize trains cannot make 90 degree turns. I am thinking of going N scale. Any comments/concerns/advice are welcome.
Hi, and welcome to the forum.
You are describing a shelf layout, and one that runs near the ceiling, at that?
While one might see that in a commercial setting, it is unusual in one’s home. For one thing, 1’ is not very wide, unless you want to run around the loop in one continuous loop. Also, a layout that high will be difficult to appreciate, whether talking about one’s guests, or yourself. One of the cardinal rules of running trains is that they have to be readily accessible from all parts of the layout. They stall, derail, uncouple, and so on, so you will have to reach up and put them right.
May I suggest staying with us for a few weeks and read up on what sorts of issues we discuss. They will be germane to your interests. Also, please acquire How-to books, such as “Track Planning for Realistic Operations” available through Kamlbach Publishers.
Good luck controlling the ‘bug’. We take great pains to convince newcomers to take a breath, stay focused, and do lots of reading. A poorly constructed layout will last you a long time if you spend your funds on it. So will the lack of pleasure.
SELECTOR is 100% correct, you can spend a lot of time and money if not careful. With “N” Eye Level to the OWNER is a good hieght. My design started at 38" low to 54" high. The new is 44" to 60". Getting under the table was a big thing with me. With “N” see if you can sneak a blob in a corner and run a folded dogbone. Then you can run trains. Just my $.02
P.S. Welcome, this is a good forum and a greayt hobby. (They even put up with me!)
I’ll agree with selector and claycts. WELCOME!! The best thing to do, in my opinion, is to slow down a bit and do some research. Go through the forums here. Read some magazines and books (there are endless ones out there from Kalmbach and other publishers). This will help you see what is out there in the various scales, eras, etc.
Most of all . . . .ask questions. There is no such thing as a “stupid” question. I’ll bet darn near anything that any question you possibly could have was a question that someone else here had at one point!
Most of all, don’t lose sight of what the hobby is really all about - having fun!
palm0232, [#welcome], [#welcome], [#welcome]
Good advise already given! Take your time, do some research, and think through the building process. The old adage, measure twice - cut once, rings true here. Ask a lot of questions. You will get excellent advise. Even us guys that have been in the hobby for decades still can learn a lot from the others here at the forum.
Have fun on the journey!
Yes, high up by the ceiling, N gauge would be hard to see.(to the larger scale guys out there) Don’t some of the larger trains with short locos and cars operate OK on tight turns? I’ve seen things like this in hobby shops (and 1 or 2 bars) but they have always been larger scale. Make sure you do your research on this befor you start spending money.
Hello, and welcome to the home of the sane and not so sane!! Great advice given above, now I have a question for you. Do you have a special purpose for building your RR so high or close to the ceiling? An 8X13 room is not very big, but if you are just after a RR atmosphere here, G or O gauge Lionel or something like that may be a better choice as a train that high up spells train watching to me as operating would be a little difficult. At any rate, you have my curiosity up as to why 17 inches from the ceiling!!! Ken
Thanks for the answers guys, I will definitly read alot and talk to a lot of people before spending and cash. I had no idea the ammount of work you can put into this hobby. The idea for a ring is just a beginning. 17" from the ceiling to clear the highest door and I am 6’8" so that high to me wouldnt be that bad. Any other good beginner books to check out. I have a list of two or three but some advice from you folks who have read thme would be useful. I am thinking about going to the hobby stores around town tomorrow to get a look at sizes and styles, its suppsoed to be 90 degrees we arent used to that in minnesota so its a good indoor day.
Thanksagain
The stores are fine to a point, but remember that they are in business to sell you something; take what they say, and file it…don’t buy it until you know you need it.
Check out any model railroad clubs in your area. Talk to the folks there and learn from them what makes a good road.
Your first priorities, if I may be permitted to suggest them, are these:
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Get some books. Go to the Model Railroader magazine, or Kalmbach Publishing sites and pick up a few books on designing model railroads…if your local library doesn’t have them or if the club guys won’t let you borrow them for a couple of weeks.
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Make a concerted effort to rationalize the new way to control trains. It is called DCC (Digital Command Control), and has opened the eyes of modelers, old and new. There are still some luddites out there, mostly those who have a ton of dough invested in rectifiers and toggle switches. They fight their layouts, while the rest of us run our trains…some of them with on-board sound systems!! (I’ll probably catch some flak for that last statement)
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Make it a point to spend about 20-30 minutes here each day for a few weeks. Also, check out the Layouts and Layout Building forum (find 'Forum Jump" at the bottom of this page, and click on the down arrow to the right. Scroll down to Model Railroader Magazine, and there will be their fora.) You’ll have to play catch-up for some time, but soon you’ll be contributing meaningfully and confidently. It is about that time that you can turn to seriously contemplating a layout.
My motto for this hobby (it doesn’t seem to have caught on here…yet…is, “Sin (build) in haste, repent at leisure.”
6’8"…holy heck you ARE a train!!! [:0] I’m (only) 6’4" so I can appreciate your wanting to have things at your own level.
Some books that can help you get started are the ones that offer trackplans…there’s like 127 different books to choose from.
What interests you about railroading? For instance, do you want to have a logging operation, coal mining, or just sit and watch the trains go around? Do you like steam engines, diesel, doesn’t matter? There’s limitless possibilities and whatever you choose it’s okay because it’s YOUR railroad[:D]
Enjoy!
Mike
Yes, but you do need to be a little careful in your choices. Some apparently shorter cars will not handle curves that a longer one will - the problems are with 4-wheel Vs 8-wheel. 8-wheel cars will go round pretty tight turns due to the fact that the wheelbase on the trucks is short. A 4-wheeler has a longer wheelbase and can get stuck on a curve (I’ve had this happen - the loco ended up sitting there with all wheels spinning and the car behind jammed firmly!). A good rule of thumb seems to be that anything 4-wheeled and over 300mm (335mm can be ok but only in short trains) long is asking for trouble on R1 curves.
Locos also need careful thought - anything over a short 0-4-0 steamer won’t like tight curves, while big 4-axle diesels and electrics won’t mind them for the same reason as the cars. It depends on whether you want to go for US outline or European narrow gauge really. Hope this is of help!
Welcome to the forum!
Yes, it does seem like a way of life sometimes. But most of our conversations here are about trains. We all have lives outside this forum (well, most of us maybe [:D] ). There is another thread just started this morning about other hobbies we have.
I would offer a different point of view form those who say 8X13 is too small, particularly for a first layout. It will give you a feel for what you can do in the space. In N scale, you can get a decent sized layout with lots of operating potential. In HO, you are somewhat limited to shorter (6-8 car) trains if you want any semblance of realism. However, you can build in a few switching puzzles to keep those engines in motion.
Again, welcome to the hobby!
Tom
8 x 13 too small? Let’s imagine a train that runs almost all or most of the shortest wall. 8 feet. HO 40’ freight cars about 6 inches long- Diesel switcher or road switcher. 14 cars and a caboose makes a pretty good train in appearance. Short for prototype, but that is about of much of train as you can see at one time unless half a mile away. 24 inch radius curve for HO should be okay.
I would suggest NOT planning on making layout a uniform 1 foot wide everywhere. Putting track where curve will fit puts the straightaways way back from edge where difficult to see. You probably want to have track fairly close to front edge of layout for seeing from (for you) slightly lower angle. At point where track is going to have to come further out from wall to make curve, let the benchwork come out to where the curve needs to fall.
Perhaps might make sense to build scene that suggests track on an embankment as normally seen from below on prototype. Benchwork and frame 2 to 4 inches deep under track, but let scenery fall BELOW track level as it reaches front of scene (held by FRONT of framework, not on top of framework.) Track could be actually level but scenery undulating a bit to suggest track built level by railroad using fills and cuts to go through non-level terrain. Here and there, terrain in front of train may come up above track level as if track is in a cut, hiding train for a few inches, adding some drama and character to the run.
Just a few suggestions.
Happy railroading.
You know, if you listen to these guy’s you are going to be just fine!
For now, just read. Get a feel for this thing. Then begin planning.
Most of all, Welcome!
Welcome to hobby!
No matter what your new found interest develops into, you will find alot of willing and helpful people along the way. And tons of great model railroading products to help you achieve your goals. The two main problems you will encounter are a lack of sufficient funds (at least for most of us), and the notion that you can’t possibly create a layout as near as good as those in the magazines. Not Yet!! Give yourself time.
I have built several Plywood Railroads (no scenery or buildings) over the years. I still had my trains running and I had FUN doing it! I finally ballasted my track for the first time only recently. Now I’m ready to try my hand at some scenery.
Don’t be intimidated by the articles or the clubs you visit. At one time or another we were all in your shoes. You managed to find these forums pretty quick, so you already have an excellent resource at your disposal.
Over time you will sort of figure out what path you want to take. Take your time. And remember, a layout is never really “finished”. Cause then you’d have to start all over again [:D]
Most all of the “round the room near the ceiling” layouts are G scale. They are big enough to see up high. All LGB locos will , so far as I know, handle a 2’ radius curve. Even my G-scale 2-8-2 Mikado from LGB will handle the 2’ radius, and it is huge!!. Just the loco without tender is 23" long. There are a number of small locos available that look very good with this type of layout.
Most of the starter sets are ideal for this, and come with cars that are appropriate for the loco. All you will need extra is some more track.
I don’t have the link, but there is a company that advertises on the internet that sells prefab pieces to do the round the ceiing type layouts.
If you like running long trains without tail chasing, having good scenics - mountains and ravines on a 8 x 13, you would like n scale.
Welcome to the best hobby.