623 at very end of track about to return northward. Note both poles are up until motorman pulls front one down.
623 at end of run in Thorold. Note both poles up as direction of car is changed.
5/30/1958 Paul McGrane Collection
Radial car 623 (1956 ex M&SC 623, 1939 nee WE&LS 503) crossing a diamond. Ottawa Car 1930
Classic wooden interurban car 130 (Preston Car & Coach 1914) crossing trestle in a most picturesque scene near Welland.
7/4/1953 Wm.Janssen
NOTE: This car was preserved at Rail City*, a very early tourist railway in New York state.* Unfortunately it deteriorated from neglect and was scrapped. No NS&T equipment exists.
It was quite an extensive system that went to many communities in the area and served an industrial base as well and interchange. Power from mighty Niagara Falls, hydro electric, how clean can you get. Virtually cost free in the day until politics changed it all. Love those express cars. So mail, parcels, documents, light shipments all getting to where it needs to be, consistently on schedule several times a day, day in day out. People getting around just fine for shopping or appoitments or the start of a larger journey. Seems like an idyllic world. I remember it very very clearly and admired the electrics. It’s a shame, it all worked so well.
So now we have the industry gone, people dress like slobs, welfare, drugs, casinos, foul language, fast food and obesity. UPS and Purolater delivery trucks zippin’ around, the QEW highway is so busy it’s white knuckled insanity. Progress.
My grandmother grew up in Welland and has many fond memories of riding the ‘streetcars’, as she calls them. Thanks for posting, I will be sure to show her these photos next time I visit.
A couple segments of the NSC&T survive as industrial spurs and are operated by the Trillium Railway, but no street running remains. The last section, in Thorold, shut down about 10 years ago due to damage to the bridge over CN’s Grimsby Sub. The bridge was never repaired, and has since been removed. The sole customer on that spur (a paper mill) switched to trucks.
Video from 2005, a few years before train operations on the Thorold spur ended:
Did you notice in the pictures I posted behind Express car #41 is a Montreal & Southern Counties car. Did they purchase that for their own use or parts or someone is storing it there? Picture is 1956.
Those are some nice seats with deep cushions. Face to face seating arrangement is not loved by everyone though, but I heard this design is a trick for easier management of the compartment.
I just noticed something about the car in photo 13, the one and Thorold station. With those arches over the windows it has a look very similar to the Erie Rairoad’s Stillwell passenger coaches. Interesting.
Those Erie Stillwells lasted beyond the life of the Erie itself. They hung around in New Jersey commuter service into the early 1970’s, and I believe kept their Erie markings right to the end.
Here’s one for everyone’s perusal, although not in the best of condition.
The Erie had over 400 of them. Did the arch windows have something to do with structural strength or was it just a cosmetic feature?
Several lasted well into the Penn Central era and indeed were never repainted!
Old posting by David Klepper re Stillwells
Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 4:17 AM
The Chicago and Eastern Indiana had Stillwell coaches identacle to the Erie’s for commuter service. As noted, the Hudson and Manhattan (now PATH) original cars were Stillwells. The cars for the joint PRR-H&M service to Newark were designed by Gibbs, however. Stillwell also designed the original BMT “steels” or “B-Types.” Actually, A’s B’s, BX.s, and BT’s. Also the New York Westchester and Boston cars. Also the steel cars for the London and Port Stanley. There may be others. All were distinguished by lightweight and strenth in the days before stainless and Budd.
Miningman, that’s a very good question! I had no idea, so I hit the books over this one, but couldn’t find an answer.
Long story short, I looked up the long-gone New York, Westchester, and Boston Railway, an interurban line who (I believe) were the first to use Stillwell coaches and found this. Probably more than anyone wants to know about Stillwells!
What I gather from the 1912 article is the arches are there as a weight-saving measure which doesn’t detract from the structural strength of the side framing.
Interesting. And they do add to the esthetic appeal of the car, to me at least.
Now that is some top notch information Firelock. Really interesting read and the photos are outstanding. An arch structure has different load characteristics than a straight beam. We use arches 100% in underground mining for support and ground control. Had no idea this existed. Thanks
You’re welcome! Looks like Mr. Stillwell really knew his stuff, didn’t he?
Maybe even better than HE knew he did, considering how long those cars lasted!
As an aside, about a year or so ago, maybe longer, “Railfan and Railroad” magazine ran an article on the New York, Westchester, and Boston. Good article, although I don’t remember the authors name. I DO remember the opening sentences. He said as a boy growing up in Westchester County a great way to trigger outbursts from his grandfather, father, and uncles at family gatherings was to mention the NYW&B. The fury from his male elders over the abandonment of the same was VERY entertaining! They LOVED that 'road! [(-D]
PS: Researching those Stillwells made me appreciate even more all the hard work Wanswheel did coming up with the stuff he did. I sure wish they’d stop the damn train and let him back on!
PPS: I did a bit more searching and found some amateur footage of the NYW&B shot in 1937 prior to abandonment, and the abandonment itself.
Look sharp! Someone who’s mentioned in another topic makes a “guest appearance” right at the beginning.
In addition to MU Stillwells for thef Hudson and Manhattan (predicessor of PATH), and the New York Westchester and Boston, Stilwells were also built for the London and Port Stanley, and I assume some of the latter ended up on NStC&T.
The Erie suburban Stillwells were built with provision for electrification, conduit, etc, which never happened. Erie also had Stillwell long-distance coaches, some ending up with air-conditioning and reclining seats.
Stilwell also consulted on the standard BMT steel cars, often collectively known as B-types, but included As, single cars, Bs, three-car groups, all motors with door controls only in the center car and cabs only at each end, and BXs, same but the center a trailer, not allowed in Manhattan Bridge service.
CWI’s Stillwell coaches were ex-Erie. Not too surprising when you consider that Erie had a 20% interest in CWI. The suburban trains in question were rush-hour only and ran between Dearborn Station and Dolton.
Interesting stuff. It’s at times like this I really miss my late father-in-law. As a Westchester County (Yonkers) native, an avid railfan, and old enough to remember, I’m sure he had some memories of the NYW&B.
The NYW&B was mainline standards, and was supposed to somehow get around the NYNH&H paying the Central for GCT access. Melln annd crew expected the 2nd Avenue Subway to built by the City, with clearances like the BMT’s 4th Avenue Subway in Brooklyn, and this would be the NYW&B’s access to downtown Manhattan.
What if they had instead used the same technology and standards as the North Shore and CA&E? The Willis Avenue track connection that had brought the NYN&H Harlem Branch local Forney-propelled locals from New Rochelle to the 129th elevated station was still in place and used by elevated shuttle trains. The 2nd Avenue elevated had excess capacity and could have handled the NYW&B trains directly to City Hall - Park Row.
The Hdson and Manhattan Stillwell “black cars” were tested on the 2nd Avenue Elevated before the “Hudson Tubes” opened.
