Has anyone here ever replaced the numbers on their number boards? I have an IM EMD F3. The detailing is very nice except for the number boards. They look fine when the number board lights are off but become practically illegible when illuminated.
I thought I could just replace the numbers in hopes that that would take care of the problem. Is that possible or do I have to replace the entire number board, too. In either case, what’s the best way to get them off without damaging the shell?
Also, any recommendations on manufacturers? I found these on the ShellScale Decal web page and they look very nice. Would these be appropriate for the earlier (mid-late '40s) diesels, as well? How are they compared to Microscale?
Any information you have to share is greatly appreciated. Thanks for the help…
Shellscale has some great stuff, including Rio Grande specific fonts (#117 & #118). However, this won’t work if you need lighted numberboards, as it’s a black background on which you place the white numbers.
If you need lighted numberboards, I’ve played around some with printing on transparencies in reverse in a laser printer. Others have said it works for them, although that’s one project I haven’t got back to actually installing them yet.
Yea, I’m interested in illuminated light boards. As I mentioned, the ones that are already on my F3 look perfectly fine unlit. Illuminated, however, and the numbers become obliterated and unreadable.
I can live with it as is. I was just curious if it was worth looking into.
Is it possible that the backlighting is just too intense? In most cases the numberboards are illuminated just enough to read them at night but they weren’t what you would call bright.
Perhaps you could figure out a way to filter the light getting to the numberboard? Maybe a little sliver of black tape, a piece of paper or some Kapton tape to give it a yellowish glow?
Microscale has numbers that can be lit. Some have white numbers on black and some have clear numbers, these you have to paint or decal with white before applying the numbers. I would remove them to do the work, but you can do it while they are in place. Tou can try to remove the old numbers with 91% alcohol abd q-tips.
I just happen to be looking for the same thing for my P2K FA’s. They are lighted but don’t show up at all when unlit. I have a set of numberboard stencis that are etched brass but I haven’t tried them yet. I have some microscale decals that work pretty good but you have to cut each number and apply individually, not what I want to do, and they are not for lighted boards. Don’t remember who makes the stencils but it may be A-West.
Each number board on the nose of the F3 is illuminate with an orange-tinted LED that casts a yellowish beam - i.e. much more yellow than a “yeloglo” LED. I guess it’s possible that the beam is saturating the light board.
I’ll try shrinking some black heat shrink over the tip of the LED to block the beam and to see if I can get more indirect light to come through the number board. I might also be able to dim the light board LEDs. It’s just identify the correct CV to adjust for a Soundtraxx motor-only decoder.
I think that if you try to narrow the beam with heat shrink tubing as you have suggested you will only make thinks worse. What will likely result will be a very small bright yellow spot of light in an otherwise dim number board.
Instead, I would suggest using something like .010 white styrene between the lense and the LED to act as a diffuser. Also, sand the surface of the LED with fine sandpaper to diffuse the light even more.
I have an IM FP7A into which I have installed a sound decoder. The number boards work really well. I have a small problem with my records regarding this particular engine, meaning of course I can’t find them[:(!][D)] but I will take a look this week and if I can provide any more useful information I will do so.
By the way, you didn’t specify whether your number boards are black letters on a white background or white letters on a black background. The decal source you suggested will not work if you plan on having illuminated white letters with a black background. However, Microscale does have numberboard sets designed to allow white letters with black backgrounds to be illuminated:
This can be very fussy work. If you are new to decalling I would do some reading before starting, and don’t expect to get it right the first time. Cody Grivno seems to be annoyingly skilled at this stuff so you might want to research some of his on-line articles.
Thanks for the input. Although I probably didn’t explain it well, the heat shrink idea over the tip (lens) of the LED was not to concentrate the beam but to block it entirely “temporarily” to see if that would help before trying anything permanent. Your idea about the 10-mil styrene is a good one.
Thanks also for the Microscale link. My F3 does have white letters on a black background. I do plan on taking my time with this and read up first before giving it a try; hence my post. I will also take a look for any helpful video clips on this site.
The number board stencils I mentioned are made by Detail Associates and are a very thin brass sheet with the numbers on individual panes. You need a clear or translucent white background and then paint black with the stencils, leaving the number clear and the background becomes black. This is what my FA2 number boards look like so this should work really well if I can get my eyes and fingers to co-operate. The factory numbers have the proper dim illumination when lit, not bright as some of my others are.
Another suggestion to get a yellowish tint to the LED is to put a piece of Kapton tape over it or on the backside of the numberboards.
I’m not familiar with how your number boards are set up on your IM. But given it’s quality, I suspect they were pressed in, maybe glued and ink pad printed. Depending on whether it’s a black or white/clear background has a lot to do with how to move forward. I’ve done a lot of these and have found patience is key. I have scrapped off a black background and converted it to clear with dark numbers, but doing this is better to do with the board off of the loco shell. Microscale makes number board decals for either a black or white/clear background. I try to find the number sequence so that I cut/paste the least amount.
AFter their on, sealing is very important to get them lay down and stay on well. Microscale sells the chemicals for this.
I have had the same problem. Even Microscale decals often get washed out by the back lighting in number boards.
I have been using numbers printed on plain copy/printer paper, sized to fit the lense in the number board and held in place with a dab of Aleene’s Tacky Glue.
The numbers on the F7 and the E8 were made in Microsoft Word. Those on the E8 are illuminated. The F7 is not.
I just play with the sizing, most often font size 8, and the background color until I get what I want. Then print a half-dozen numbers and trim to size. Works for me. I’ve used the method for illuminated number boards and plain unlighted boards. This method works with white and black backgrounds and would probably work with other colors too. The paper while translucent is not transparent so it cuts down on the glare, compared to a thin decal.
Try it. You might like it and you can’t beat it for cheap.
This is what the number board stencils look like, illuminated in daylight. They are very thin brass etched panels made by Detail Associates. I had to make a clear plastic piece to fit where the original was missing from and then put the stencils on that. I painted it all engine black to match the other side.
I’ve only done this with my Athearn steamers,but I don’t see why it wouldn’t work for diesels,too… I paint over the #board(numbers and all) with a thin coat of floquil engine black,then apply a new set of decals over that. It dims and diffuses the light pretty well. Here is a before and after(different engines,but you get the idea)…
