What? ME take responsibility for my actions? NO WAY!
Sorry, couldnt resist.
I know. Personal responsibility seems to be a thing of the past. It’s been laid to rest alongside the rest of his family…common sense, moral courage, virtue, consideration of others, and community service. RIP!
Viva la litigators!!! Every man for himself!!! Blame your neighbor!!! Not in my Backyard!!!
Bad signals, poor veiw, sun in the eyes, fog. An railroad crossing consist of at least 2 large metal rails. It is very hard to miss 2 steel rails in the road. I amazes me how many peaple will look both ways before crossing a street but drive across a train crossing with out even looking. I you can’t see whats comming stop! If you miss that fact that there is a grade crossing due to visiblity you are driving to fast for conditions, this can get you a ticket here in NY.
THERE IS NO GOOD REASON TO PUT YOUR BODY IN FRONT OF A TRAIN!
Ok I get of my soap box now.
Just read the Denver Pest ,er Post , article.Did a cattle truck turn over in here or what! Something really STINKS![:(!] blaming the railroads really does what a vacuum cleaner does.[:(!]
Dan,
One of the first rules of action, when being sued, is…
Shut up.
The burden of proof rest entirely on the plaintiff.
Under the law, you, as the defendant do not have to say a single thing in your defense, you are not required to prove your innocence, they have to prove your guilt.
As long as you dont open your mouth and say anything that might be used against you, the person bringing suit has to do the leg work.
Ms. Blackwell is doing exactly what she is paid to do, admit as little as she can, by saying a whole bunch of nothing.
Railroads, and all other large companies have two things the average citizen lack, time and money.
Because adjudication of federal regs is so lax and leinent, large corpations know that the longer they wait, the less resources the plaintiff will have, and at some point, they will give up and settle.
Think about it, when was the last time you read or saw a really large company get fined in such a manner that the fine and any sanctions assessed made any difference in the way they company does business?
Even the Enron deal…its gotton to the point that the justice dept really dosnt even know who to prosecute, they just lit out after Ken Lay for the press value.
Did UP, CSX and NS do the things mentiones in the reports?
Who knows, what we have been shown is information taken from court reports, and then edited again by the reporters to back up their story.
Taken out of context, just about any testimoney, when reworded or edited, can be used to make anyone look bad.
That said, I am pretty sure most of the incidents mentioned did happen, but are reported out of context.
Even if they wern’t, I still doubt that such actions are corporate policy.
All of us in the industry have seen middle management make stupendiously stupid decisions.
Trainmasters often do the dumbest things.
If the top brass chose not to en
Nice picture of CSX # 2657 in the Omaha Weird Herald. Won’t go into the whole story, but two things.
1: They wondered why the police didn’t notify the authorities about the rail accidents instead of relying on the railroads to do it.
2: They said that bottom line was people have to take responsibility. I disagree. That would come under looking out for # 1 and some common sense. We all know those two things don’t exist in the present. We have gotten to be a nation of people needing a babysitter so we don’t fall and go boom and common sense is a disease you want to avoid.
Growl…
I agree. I guess I need to clarify. Seems companies that know they are guilty have no comment. Companies that aren’t sure, spin out a release and mouthy spokesfolks that say alot…but absolutely nothing. Ms Blackwell kind of struck me as wishy washy…tried to say something and nothing and came off as less than polished…However (and this just came to me as I am writing this) , that being said…she may be an incredibly effective speaker, and after all…we are just seeing the quotes the NYT chose to include… If I were with UPs PR dept…(and I know some folks are going to be offended by this) I would have a black or hispanic female in the mid 50s as my spokesperson and go on the offensive about personal responsbility and such …in a firm grandmotherly, that makes folks feel stupid for treating a RR crossing like walking across the hall. But that’s why I’m in the business of breaking things…you don’t have to say sorry too often.
I’m a cop in rural Alabama near a fairly busy NS line. In the past year I’ve watched a friend’s daughter go to the hospital for racing a train across a crossing. (She’s now capable of sitting up and eating lunch on her own.) Near my church, a 17 year old tried to beat a train across an ungated (but marked) crossing… and lost. Fatally. That’s one near miss and a fatality in a fairly small area of Alabama. The Alabama State Troopers do the investigations on all fatalities, and they are the ones who collect the evidence. They are the ones who have the special training to investigate traffic accidents. Most folks don’t realize that cops are the ones who are responsible for collecting, storing, and preserving evidence. So, I have to wonder why people blame railroads for “destroying evidence?” Especially when railroads, like people, have a constitutional right not to incriminate themselves.
As far as bad reputations go, railroads have had bad reps for over a century. I don’t think a spin doctor could do much with Cornelius Vanderbilt saying “The public be damned.” (The quote, like much else that occurs in the media, was taken out of context. He was talking about passenger service and the more profitable side of the business, running freight. We are repeating history…)
The fact of the matter is that railroads and streets don’t go well together. You will have fatalities occur at any crossing, because the vast majority of drivers all over the world are lethal weapons behind the wheel of a car. If nothing else, the article pointed out that railroads and street crossings are dangerous places to be. Considering the NY Times reading audience is primarily aimed at folks who live comfortably along the NEC (which probably doesn’t have grade crossings where the ACELA runs…) it is at least a cautionary reminder. Maybe, just maybe, it will wake up local legislators who have been sitting on their butts and don’t see bridging or tunneling grade crossings as sufficiently sexy.
In my view the spokes person for the UP did not say nothing as perhaps she should have done. The UP already has 7 sanctions against them the explanations Ms Blackwell gave were not competant. Having been involved in MANY grade crossing injury investigations with and with out fatalitys I do know that I am intructed to cooperate with the local police and law enforcement to the best of my ability. If I download an event recorder and a police officer is standing right there I must give him the information that he wants regarding train speed, horn, bell etc. The bottom line is the class one RRs have everyone stretched so damn thin that a road foremans territory might extend 1000 miles, how prompt of a response do you think there will be in the event of an accident?
You can have mechanical people download the engine at the next servicing, but once the loco is moved from the accident location the collision log is lost more often what happens is it just gets forgotten about. The RRs are innocent but their not doing a good job proving it. How dare the UP take a cavalier approach to this issue, issuing Ill informed statements etc. this reflects badly on me and all railroaders. I am a competant railroader, not a criminal like the NY times likes to think.
Randy
I have to chime in on this, its just too funny…
A few weeks ago , most people on this (and other message boards) were blasting UP and its management as the second coming of Satan ,for their actions in suing Lionel and Athearn over their trademarks, and now everyone seems to be DEFENDING them for , if the article is accurate, negligence, incompetence, and the unlawful tampering or destruction of evidence at an accident scene. Heck ,for all we know, maybe the reporter is secretly a disgruntled Model railroader for all we know.(LOL!!!) Personally, I think that UP’s arrogant “we’ll do whatever we damn well please, 'cause we’re UP and we don’t have to answer to anybody” attitude has finally come around full circle and they’re paying for it now. Call it Karmic Justice…
Besides, my money was on CSX to get busted first, for what its worth…given some of the accidents they’ve had in New York state since the Conrail split up. You’d think they’d be a more opportune target, being practically in the Times back yard.
I don’t think folks are defending UP as much as they are, at least in my case, defending the RRs as a group. I don’t agree with UP’s method of enforcing it’s trademarks. However, I have and continue to acknowledge that it is within their rights. But at the same time I don’t agree with them or any railroad having to pay for someone’s inattention or carelessness at a RR crossing. But, if a RR or any company be it trucking, baby food, or whatever, is found to be guilty of gross negligence or tampering, resulting in injury or death, then are at fault, regardless of how much I like or dislike them personally.
[quote]
QUOTE: CSX President Michael Ward’s Response
Yesterday and today, the New York Times published lengthy articles on
grade
crossing safety and accident reporting by U.S. railroads, focusing
primarily
on Union Pacific and CSX Transportation. For those of you who have not
seen
the articles, you can read them at the New York Times’ website at
www.nytimes.com http://www.nytimes.com.
Today’s story highlights certain issues that should have been handled
better
by our company related to a 1997 grade crossing fatality involving
17-year-old Hilary Feaster. And while those issues did not lead to the
tragic death of Miss Feaster, we do believe they led to her family’s
anger
and sorrow over the tragedy, and we deeply and sincerely regret that.
At the same time, CSXT has done exactly what responsible and decent
companies do when they make mistakes - we have learned and improved; and
that is what is missing from today’s story.
As each of you know, CSXT is dedicated to safety in all aspects of
operations, and to preventing grade crossing collisions. The results of
our
efforts speak for themselves: In the last 10 years, train miles on CSXT
have
increased 62% and vehicle miles traveled in the United States have
increased
26%. Yet during the same period, grade crossing accidents on CSXT have
decreased 34%. Our efforts are working.
Last year, CSXT spent over $70 million in grade crossing and signal
maintenance and conducted more than 14,000 man-hours of training for our
more than 1,000 professionals who inspect and maintain grade crossing
signals. And in the last three years, long before the Times began its
inquiry, we have further strengthened our grade crossing and public
safety
efforts with these programs:
- Clear Cutting of Vegetation: We have spent nearly $30
million to clear trees and vegetati
Gee now how hard was that!!! A much better response than the UP!!!
Randy
Posts: 102
Joined: 04 Jun 2004
Location: roundhouse
Too bad I can’t say what I really want to say ( bad word issues) I do feel how ever that the UP spokes person Miss Blackwell doesn’t have a clue what the hell she’s talking about. I believe there is some factual basis motivating these attacks and the sad part is it makes me ashamed to be a railroader
Randy
And I say “the way other people drive makes me ashamed to be a driver !”
Guys,
Keep in mind, just like what was stated, Ms Blackwell’s statements are taken out of context.
If you think about it, well, play this game.
Go back through any of the posting, on just about any subject we have discussed.
Take only sentences that make the writer sound stupid, leave out anything else.
Did you try?
Easy, aint it!
You dont get to read the question the reporter asked the lady, nor do you get to read her entire reply.
I agree with dan though, UP ought to hire a minority female spokesperson.
Have her explain, on a TV add, how dangerous it is around train tracks and crossings.
Set the tone of a well loved highschool teacher explaining why, oh, smoking is bad for you.
Stress the
Stop, Look and Listen (or Live) slogan, heck its plastered on a lot of locomotives.
I also would purchase a full page ad, directly across from the page the reports appear on, itemizing every thing UP has done to improve grade crossings.
Get aggresive.
They wont, of course, flying under the public radar is the norm for railroads.
Ed
Guys,
Keep in mind, just like what was stated, Ms Blackwell’s statements are taken out of context.
If you think about it, well, play this game.
Go back through any of the posting, on just about any subject we have discussed.
Take only sentences that make the writer sound stupid, leave out anything else.
Did you try?
Easy, aint it!
You dont get to read the question the reporter asked the lady, nor do you get to read her entire reply.
I agree with dan though, UP ought to hire a minority female spokesperson.
Have her explain, on a TV add, how dangerous it is around train tracks and crossings.
Set the tone of a well loved highschool teacher explaining why, oh, smoking is bad for you.
Stress the
Stop, Look and Listen (or Live) slogan, heck its plastered on a lot of locomotives.
I also would purchase a full page ad, directly across from the page the reports appear on, itemizing every thing UP has done to improve grade crossings.
Get aggresive.
They wont, of course, flying under the public radar is the norm for railroads.
Ed
Sorry to bring this to the top again, but FRA took the gloves off and called NYT on the carpet for their blatant cheap shot:
http://www.fra.dot.gov/Downloads/PubAffairs/NYT%20Grade%20Crossing%20Issue%20Brieffinal.pdf
(for those of you with .pdf readers_)
Way to go FRA! Unfortunately, none of the “regular” people who read the NYT article will ever see this response. Maybe we should take up a collection to run a full page ad of it in the NYT.
MC-Thanks for bringing this back. I was on the road and didn’t have a chance to follow the thread when it came up.
I, as many, felt that the article was an ambush. Find the relatively rare event where the railroads and/or regulators might be culpable and make it sound like it is the norm. Objectivity would have suggested that the reporters should have looked at the few reports suggesting railroad error and questioned if it goes on all the time. It appears they decided that it goes on all the time and then started their investigation. Either that, or after completing the investigation, they realized they didn’t have a really hot story, and had to write so they wouldn’t get hell from the Times’ editors for wasting time and money on a “puff piece”. As for quality editorial oversight at the Times, does “Fabrication” ring a bell?
The railroads were kind of stuck and had to use some care with their damage control, but I think the FRA was definately intitled to come out with guns blazing.
Jay