I have this old locomotive that my grandpa’s friend built at least 50 years ago. Somehow my grandpa got it and my grandma was cleaning the other day and came across this thing in a box with some of his other things. I would LOVE to rebuild this thing and get her running again. There are no manufacturing markings anywhere on it. What is showin in the photos is everything that is left, except for the cab which is currently being fixed. Anyone have an idea on what I have?
It’s an old Tyco model of Sierra #3. The cab and smoke stack are missing. It was the engine used in the TV show ‘Pettycoat Jct’…
Jim
wow, thanks for the quick response. I have the cab, it was broken so I have it off glueing it back together.
I second that it appears to be an old Tyco Ten-Wheeler, I just wasn’t aware that there was actually a prototype for it. I sure wouldn’t bet on there ever having been a prototype for the Bi-Centennial version of it, that I had as a kid (Did I REALLY ever have one of THOSE, oohh the shame[:I])
Doug
Indeed, as others have indicated, this is the Tyco/Mantua ten-wheeler, introduced in 1966 and originally referred to as the “Hooterville Cannonball” from the Pettycoat Junction TV show of the period (1963-70). The initially issued models had the loco’s cab actually labelled as such, while the tender carried the herald “C&FW Railroad”. In later years this loco was generally referred to as the 1890’s “Dixie Belle” but carried numerous different road names, one of the longest running being Santa Fe. The model remained available for many years, so the exact date of your model would be open to question. Tyco/Mantua is long out of business, so replacement parts will be a problem (outside of purchasing a similar model off eBay and using it for parts).
CNJ831
Tyco, the trainset arm of Mantua. issued this engine as a trainset engine lettered for the Petticoat Junction tv show railroad. It is a model of Sierra RR #3 but for a variety of reasons was built to 1:76 proportion rather than true HO 1:87, so while it is the general size of a 19th century 4-6-0, it would look rather large if placed next to an accurate scale model of #3.
Mantua issued the same engine as a scale model, and in the Mantua version, it cleverly came with interchangable stacks and tender loads. That is why the stack comes off for example.
If you go to enough swap meets you will see many “basket case” versions of this once-popular model being sold, often at attractive prices, and it can almost be cheaper to acquire missing parts and pieces that way.
Dave Nelson
mw:
It’s old, but not quite as old as you think. It’s probably from the 1970s at the earliest, because the motor field is riveted together. Older Mantua PM-1 motors had a screw here.
Replacement parts aren’t too hard to get. Model Power still sells a lot of them - they bought the Mantua line and got a good many parts. Failing that, try Yardbird Trains. Yardbird also sells drop-in remotor units.
What I would do is take out the wheels, and clean the axles, bearings, and gears with alcohol, then lubricate sparingly. Use a bit of oil on the bearings, and grease on the gears. Clean the wheels and the tops of the tender trucks where they contact a frame (the latter is a common contact problem with old Mantua engines). I also like to replace the motor magnet with a stack of NdFeB rare-earth magnets, which gives a good boost in power, improves creeping performance, and lowers current draw. This is a bit tricky with the riveted motor field - you’ll have to drill out the rivet, then find a nut and bolt to replace it.
Thanks. I asked my grandma and she remembers it being played with by my uncle in the mid 60s. It is totally possibe this could have been remotored since then. Thanks for the link with the parts. I am going to try to rebuild her. with as few new parts as possible.
Hello I have one of those found it at a show. I turn it in to a inspection loco. It needed a good cleaning and a new traction tire but it runs ok good luck with it Frank
PLAYED WITH??? PLAYED WITH??? We never “play with” trains–we “operate” Scale Railroads; on the same token our models are never “cute”; rather they are awesome; magnificent; splendid; elegant; majestic; etc; etc; and so forth; stuffed bears are “cute”!
mw:
Interesting. You might be right on the remotoring. I looked at the bottom view and it shows three screws on the axle retainer - two close together. The 1963 exploded view at the HO Lit Page shows this design, but sometime before 1980, the shorter of these screws was deleted.
The motor isn’t the only unusual thing about your grandpa’s loco. The domes are the flanged style, parts #6516 and #6517. While the kit part lists show alternate wood and coal loads, and alternate straight and diamond stacks, both the 1963 and 1980 lists only include the rounded domes #6514 and #6515. The flanged domes were available with the Mastodon 4-8-0 kit, the rtr Dixie Belle in the 1970s, and the garish bicentennial-colored rtr “Spirit of America”. Maybe Grandpa had it through the engine shops sometime in the '70s?
Here’s the instruction sheet and exploded view of your loco:
http://hoseeker.net/assemblyexplosiontyco/tyco460tenwheeler1890pg1.jpg
http://hoseeker.net/assemblyexplosiontyco/tyco460tenwheeler1890pg2.jpg
http://hoseeker.net/assemblyexplosiontyco/tyco460tenwheeler1890pg3.jpg
Here’s a not-so-readable instruction sheet from the current Model Power 0-4-0 “Goat”,
which uses a motor that seems to be a drop-in replacement for the old PM-1 used on
your loco - this is Model Power part 389-3. It looks like the Yardbird D8120 may
actually be this very same unit. [:)]:
http://hoseeker.net/mantuainstructions/mantua060goatinstpg2.jpg
I’m with you, R.T.! Seems like we fought forever, back in the '50s through the '70s, to squash that image of “grown men, PLAYING with TOY trains,” only to have modern modelers “playing” with their trains! This was even a political issue, back then, as someone running for office sent out fliers asking, “Do we want a man who plays with toy trains in our government?” I’ve spent ten years rebuilding an O scale Thomas Consol and I think I’d contemplate shooting anyone who refers to it as a “toy train!” C’mon, guys, please don’t tell people you like to “play with your model trains” after a hard day at work. Couldn’t you just say, “running my model railroad relaxes me”?
Yes, that’s a Mantua/Tyco Ten-wheeler, which was actually built slightly oversize. Someone at MR suggested it was closer to Sn3-1/2 and suggested the cab be cut down a little to improve the proportions. I rebuilt a neighbor kid’s engine, turning more modern domes of laminated styrene and substituting an MDC/Roundhouse “Old-timer” cab for the original. Follow the suggestions of others and start by cleaning and lubricating everything first. Get the mechanism working well and the cosmetic details should be easy enough to complete. Mantua/Tyco steam locos are usually excellent runners and should give years of service.</
I “play” in my woodshop, with my power tools, & build nice stuff; I play with my dogs and cat; and I watch grown men “play” football most weekends this time of year. When I go to civic club meetings, my wife tells me to “play nice” with the others there. I “play” music while I’m working.
So maybe we could lighten up on those who “play” with model railroads. [:)]
My Dad gave me a kit version of this engine for my graduation in 1981.
Did I read correctly, a particular run suitable for use in S scale, gives us S modelers food for thought.
Dave
I suspect there were more than a few teenage lads in the 1960s who “played” that they were a resident of Petticoat Junction. If the Tyco 4-6-0 helped make it more real (“I guess I better check the water level in the water tank today. Oh hello who are you?”), then I say play on.
sigh
Dave Nelson
I think more guys wanted to play with the three girls skinny dippin in the water tower.[:-^]
They had one of those and my Mikado kit still shrink wrapped at the LHS about 2 years ago. ($25/each!) I wish I would have bought the 10 wheeler too now![banghead]
Yardbird sells cabs for those if yours is busted up too bad.
As others have said your locomotive is a Mantua/Tyco Dixie Belle as it was called.
I have one and use it on my tourist train. It has been converted to oil and now has a strait stack. It has been completely repainted with a black boiler with brass trim and a graphite smokebox. The cab is black with a tuscan red roof. Lettering is white.
Dean said:Seems like we fought forever, back in the '50s through the '70s, to squash that image of “grown men, PLAYING with TOY trains,” only to have modern modelers “playing” with their trains!
Well me buck-o guess what? We are still grown men playing with toy trains.Things hasn’t changed one ida.We are still looked down upon with pity and as immature adults trying to relive our childhood.
Cheer up me buck-o we know better…Let the “mature” adults do their thing of sitting in front of the TV munching stale potato chips and drinking “welfare” beer while we enjoy our great hobby!
Now who should be the pity ones seeing normalcy is full of fallacies concerning what is or isn’t acceptable as adult behavior?
Dave,Those 4-6-0s can be used for Sn30.I read that in one of the magazines many moons ago.I recall reading the article but,can’t remember the year.
