Recentlly I purchased a large number of locomatives from an estate sale (very cheap average of $10 ea.) of a modeler who was tragically killed in a car accident. Many of the locomatives run poorly or not at all. Because of the intial low cost of the engines I plan to invest some time and resources to restore these back to running condition. I need some tips on general clean up of the wheels ( best and cheapest method ) motors, running gear etc… There are about 35 enginines of various manufactures. Thanks in advance for any tips. I will check back in around lunch time.
I’ve found the easiest and most effective way to clean wheels is with a rag/paper towel and some rubbing alcohol. As for motors, I’d go with a good can motor; this is NOT the place to be “frugal”.
Without knowing the age or manufactures of the various locos only general information will apply. Some diesels ran poorly even when new. Most older AHM, Rivorossi and Tyco locos aren’t worth much effort. Except for the old HiF drives (rubber band), Athearn diesels were good runners, easy to work on and parts are fairly easy to find. The best place to start is dis-assembling the drive to clean any dried lubricant. Make sure all the electrical connections are solid. Lubricate with plastic compatable oils and grease. Clean the wheels and get an NMRA standards gauge to check the wheels for conformance.
It sounds like a potentially fun project to restore the old engines. I have done so several times. It might be best to group them by manufacturer and work on just one group at a time. There are some sellers of replacemnt parts on the internet.
As you get into the restorations, feel free to ask the forum members about a specific locomotive you are working on. There is a good chance you can find somebody familiar with thaat engine and sources of parts. You may alos decide to upgrade with a better motor as already suggested.
When I came back to the hobby about 8 or 9 years ago, I had all my trains from my younger days, which I’d boxed up in the late 1960s and hauled around with me for 40 years. I had 10 or 12 engines. I actually got a few of them to run, but their performance was very poor. Most were old Athearns, both gear and rubber-band drive. I looked into what was needed to bring them up to modern standards - wheels, motor, LEDs, couplers, decoder and maybe trucks with gears. I realized that I’d be replacing everything but the frame and the shell, and those old plastic shells were not exactly show pieces, either. When I found brand new engines for less than the cost of the needed parts, my mind was made up. As much as I wanted to bring my “old friends” back, it turned out to be more effort than it was worth.
I converted a couple of them to simple dummies, and two of them to “sound dummies.” I found a newer F7 at a train show for $15, and swapped the shells. I bought a new F7 chassis for about $45 and put one of the shells on that. In one form or another, most of those engines are “in service,” but not in the way I had originally planned.
Naw. The HiF drives were exceptionally smooth and quiet. At 50 mph. Absolutely NO gear noise. Ya just have to never let the speed drop below 30 mph or so.
While not a big fan of “fixin’ up” old diesels, sometimes you just HAVE to. I’ve got an Athearn Southern cow and calf set that I just love. When I bought it back in the day, I put in a permanent draw bar and also wired the two units together–16 wheel pickup! It never stalls.
But I am inclined to:
Do a DCC conversion, replace the motors, and replace the wheels.
First you want to get them to run. Many, perhaps most, of them will run again for just a good cleaning and lubrication. The lubricants, grease and oil, tend to harden over the years and everything gets so sticky they won’t run. The fix is to take them apart, clean everything, put them back together, and put a little grease on the gears and a single drop of oil on the other moving parts, motor bearings, axles, siderods and valve gear. Clean all the wheel treads till they shine.
Step 1. Don’t loose any little parts. Remember where each part fits. Take photos. Label things. Take notes. Most locomotives come apart with little more than a small screwdriver or two, and perhaps long nose pliers.
Step 2. Take the shell off. Diesel shells often come off for merely getting your fingernails under the edge of the shell and pulling sideways to slip over mounting lugs cast into the frame. Steamers often have a screw in the smoke stack or one coming up from under neath where the cylinders attach. Sometimes you have to remove the couplers to get the shell off. If totally baffled the HOseeker website has the instruction sheets for most stuff. While you have the shell off, you can improve the looks by washing it in warm soapy water and drying thoroughly.
Step 3. Check out the motor. Clean the commutator with a Q-tip dipped in Googone or alcohol. Oil the bearings. Never oil the commutator. Inspect the carbon brushes. They should be black, the business end worn to match the commutator, with a wire or spring bringing in juice. If missing or broken you need to order replacements. Apply juice (do not exceed 12VDC) and the motor ought to run. If it doesn’t, look for a broken wire on the armature that you can solder back together. Otherwise you need to rewind, or remagnet or get a new motor.
If the engines run poorly or not at all that is often a sign that the electrical pickup is poor. If the wheels are that dirty then some wheel cleaner (Wahl clipper oil is popular with some) on a Q tip should get the wheel treads clean enough to use the more usual method which is to soak a paper towel with cleaner and run the engine over the towel so it soaks up the dirt. That can be a lengthy process. It might be that the contacts that touch the back of the wheels (some makes of engines) have an accumulation of crud or even pet hair that prevents contact. And it might be that even the commutator of the motor itself is diry, or the brushes have picked up crud (or again, pet hair or carpet fuzz). Sometimes a VERY tiny amount of oil on the commutator of the motor can clean the surface and perk a balky motor back into running smoothly.
Sometimes the problems are mechanical. Some engines came with a lubricant on the gears that turned into a gummy substance if the engine was left alone too long and in that case only a fairly laborious process of cleaning off each gear and relubricating the engine will let it run again. Some of the early LifeLike Proto 2000 engines, in addition to a cracked gear problem, were prone to freezing up due to the lubricant the factory applied.
Unless a motor is burned out just about any engine can be made to run again without much expense – just time and patience (and remembering how to put it back together!). Can motors are great but depending on the engine a replacement motor might cost more than the loco is really worth. Let’s get the engine moving again before we think about re motoring.
Tstage your comment made me smile. On any given day cannot we all be a bit off our rocker ? I know I have a few here and there and later look back and wonder who was THAT IN MY BODY THAT DAY ?!
Some asked why. I just enjoy fixing things and it helps me . I find it relaxing way to unwind after a stressful day.
I have a few questions to some of the comments which were VERY helpful - Thank you so much.
Wht type of gear lube is recommended ?
Is rubbing alchol okay to use to clean ?
What type of lube should be uesed on plastic gears ? Metal ?
I have seen advertisements for "never stall " sp? What is that and how does it work ? Is it worth the purchase ?
Yes, rubbing alcohol is a good solvent for cleaning locomotive parts and wheels. Q-tips and paper towels make the job easier.
Get yourself a container of Labelle grease and a container of Labelle oil from your train shop. It is formulated for plastic gear parts and will not hurt them.
You have a lot of work in front of you… I would work on them one by one, starting with the diesels. Athearns would be good for the first one or two. Then perhaps go for an Atlas. I agree about avoiding the others. Do you have steamers? They are a bit more tricky. Can you give us a sense of your inventory?
These three Lube products should be all you need, in your project:
Have Fun!
Frank
BTW: One tip though. When you are cleaning and relubing, take time and put some #107 Oil on each end of the Motor shaft bushings/bearings, a step often neglected when relubing engines. Electric motors sitting around awhile the bushings will dry out, resulting in a squeal when run and won’t run as freely as they should, causing the motor to run warmer than it should and draw more amps.
Just about any alcohol will work fine. If in doubt, put a drop of it on a bit of glass and let it evaporate. If it leaves a film on the glass, it’s not so good. Alcohol should dry clean. I tend to use denatured alcohol , sold as shellac thinner and stove fuel, 'cause I have it in the shop. Drinking alcohol works, but I have better uses for it than cleaning stuff.
For gears I use white lithium grease, comes in little tubes from the auto parts store. I have used vaseline in the past. I have used automotive axle grease, but that’s a little heavy for model work. Actually, plastic, especially nylon, is so slippery that lube isn’t mandatory, like it is with metal gears.
I oil every thing with 3 in 1 oil.
Powdered graphite is good for sticky coupler boxes, but it conducts electricity so you want to be careful around motors and insulators. Wheel sets have to be insulated on two rail wiring. A layer of graphite over the wheel insulation can give a hard to find short.
The inventory is a wide variety of products, stem , diesels, Plastic shells, die cast metal shells, Atlas, AHM, Bachman , some I cannot locate a name on etc…
Thanks everyone for the feed back. I am sure as I start working on individual engines I will have more questions.
Has anyone had any expierence with "never stall " what is it used for and how ?
I have no experience with “never stall” but have tried several similar products that claim to eliminate stalling, and have found that none of them really do as much good as clean wheels and clean track.
You can read some reviews and questions about Electrically Conductive Lubricant and make your decision. Never Stall is one discussed. I have had no need to try any of them, so far, in 64y
Back in the day (early '60s),Pittman put out a geared-down conversion motor for the Hi-F drives. it had a solid shaft which ran straight through the motor, with a large gear, and the armature below it had a small gear, which gave the shaft about a 1:6 reduction. I think the Pittman designation was a DC 703, or some such. Anyway, with that reduction, slow-speed performance was very much improved for the Hi-F drives. I just happened to score about 5 of them, and now I’m looking to find an old Hi-F F7 to install one in.
