OT: Salvaging the Ships after a Day of Infamy

A fascinating story revealed six decades later:

http://www.nytimes.com/opinion/opinionspecial/index.html

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl1.pdf

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl2.pdf

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl3.pdf

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl4.pdf

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl5.pdf

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/opinion/20061207_pearl6.pdf

Dave

On this day which will forever “live in infamy”, may God bless those immortal ships and all those who served in them on that fateful day. Dad, are you listening? [angel]

Jim Shaw

Aurora, IL

December 7, 2006

…Time is adding many, many years to the terrible event known as Pearl Harbor…May each generation read and learn of it’s history and allow that to not let our guard down too far that it can’t happen again…God bless the ones that perished as the event took place…Quentin Mong

PS…I’m of generation that can remember of it happening…even what the radio looked like that broadcast the word to us at the time…Too young to go to war at that time though…Did that later.

I worked for 12 years with a man who was a signalman on the West Virginia when it went down and later the Yorktown (CV-5) sunk at the Battle of Midway.

http://www.ussyorktown.com/yorktown/ This is worth a look!

We do not ever need to forget the men and women who were killed in defense of the liberties which are slowly being eroded by political correctness and history being rewitten.

I agree with all the above sentiments. Those members of our “Greatest generation” deserve our thanks and respect.

Not meaning to pick nits, but the U.S.S Yorktown (CV-10) sits today as a museum, I believe in South Carolina. It was her predecessor, U.S.S. Yorktown (CV-5) that was sunk on June 7, 1942, as a result of the Battle of Midway.

There are many historians who believe America’s greatest generation

was the men and women who fought for our independence from Great Britain,

and secured our liberties by establishing a viable national government

under the Constitution.

Dave

Right, Rick.

Thanks for catching that… it was the CV-5 sunk at midway… ( CV-10) She is now berthed in Charleston, SC, Harbor as a war memoria. http://www.ussyorktown.com/yorktown/ Here’s the web site for her.

Just saw on the ABC Evening News where the Arizona is corroding and rusting away at a rate that may cause the ship to collapse in on itself with 10 to 20 years.

So far, the only real cure discussed is to apply a electrical current to the hull to halt the corrosion.

Shame we can’t find a way to save this tomb, where many a sailor has his final resting place.

Been there, and stood in the Memorial, watching the fuel oil slowly bubble to the surface.

When you stand there, reading the wall of names, the quite dignity that covers the place also serves to remind you that you are looking at not only a sunken ship, but a grave site.

You can’t help but feel a mixture of sadness and pain for all those who died here, pride in their sacrifice, and pride for those who survived and went on to serve us.

Yes… the effort to raise those battleships “from the mud” was indeed a spectacular one…

As a person who has studied that war, for most of the last 25 years, the depth and breadth of the combat, and toll that the war had taken still boggles my mind, as well as the depth and breadth of the war effort here at home. It was a terrible, and exciting time, and a time that shaped the world in which we live today. I was not born until 21 years after the end of the war, but that generation fascinates me to no end.

We must always remember, always…

From Pearl Harbor then, to Baghdad now… we must always remember those who served, and those who paid the “ultimate price”

…I’ve been wondering how long that ship might last before it deteriorates from the warm salt water…Surprised it has survived still somewhat intact as it has. Perhaps a new memorial will soon need to be constructed. Believe the current one is anchored at least partly on the ship.

More interesting records and news’ broadcasts on the attack,

including FDR’s address to Congress on 8 December:

http://www.umkc.edu/lib/spec-col/ww2/PearlHarbor/ph-txt.htm#fdr

http://www.history.navy.mil/docs/wwii/pearl/CinCPac.htm

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq66-1.htm

http://www.umkc.edu/lib/spec-col/ww2/PearlHarbor/ph-txt.htm

http://www.navsource.org/Naval/logs.htm

http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/pha/invest.html

Dave

I knew a man named “Chester”. His last name was eithnic Polish and I don’t remember it.

He was a retired carpet layer. He came over, at my X’s reqest, to lay some carpet for us for some cash. Her retired plumber father knew him from the Parish.

We got to talking. He was part of an Avenger air crew (3 guys) and flew off carriers in the Pacific during WWII. I think flying off and on a wooden deck ship would be scary enough. But he bailed out three times. Into the ocean! (I guess he was the rear gunner)

He did it And then he just got back in the next aircraft. And did it again.

And then he came home and laid carpet for the rest of his life.

God Bless Him and all the others. Including especially those serving today who keep us safe.

Isn’t it amazing how these guys did the things we read about and watch in the movies and documentaries, and then, when it was all over, came home, hung up their uniforms and put on their work clothes and suits, and went back to their everyday life, living it, for the most part, as if nothing had happened?

I mean, most of the WWII vets I know don’t go around complaining about having to fight that war, nor do they seem to have allowed the stuff they saw, and the stuff they had to do, really change who they were or how they felt they should be.

If you ask them about the war, almost to a tee they can tell you stories that curl your toes and scare the crap out of you, but they tell you the stories with a straight face, as if it was no big deal to have a ship blown out from under you, or to have your bomber shot up, have to bail out of a burning aircraft over occupied territory, and then to sneak your way back to your side.

My Dad and I were fishing, years ago when I was a kid, and I got him talking about his ship and his service.

He told me about his DE depth charging a U boat so badly it had to surface, which was a rare thing.

His captain assumed they were surrendering, and ordered boarding parties to assemble.

Well, the U boat crew came out on deck, then went for their deck guns and opened fire, along with small arms fire…all the while the sub was turning towards my Dad ship.

His captain thought they were trying to line up a torpedo shot, so he ordered return fire, and my Dad got to the AA gun, sat there and blew holes in the forward section of the sub, while the rest of the deck guns chopped up as much of the U boat crew as they could find…the boat sank, with only a few survivors, who told the DE crew that their air delivery system had failed, and they had to no way to blow ballast normally, or compress air to fire torpedoes, so the U boat captain was planning on ramming my Dad’s ship.

Now he is telling me all this, while sitting there

Unfortunately, not everyone who experienced that war was as unaffected by it- my wife’s father went ashore on Omaha (or Utah? not sure) Beach a day or so after the initial invasion, and was there to help liberate some of the prison camps. The effects on him ultimately led to him being divorced from her mother, and to his death from Cirrhosis of the liver and Emphysema due to drinking and smoking. Joanie can tell alot of stories about some of the strange behavior she’s witnessed from her dad, such as walking into the kitchen where he was apparently having a flashback, reenacting some moment from his war experience. She’d say something to him, and it would be like flipping a switch- he’d act like nothing had happened.

…War is hell on many people…!

Back when I was a teenager, I was a member of the local ESDA (formerly Civil Defense) Rescue Squad. We were a voluteer unit that operated out of the Village Hall, we had a 1964 Chevy Step Van, Suburban, and a Chevy Station wagon, we performed various and sundry duties, like traffic control, pumping basements after storms, assistiing the fire department with salvage and overhaul. etc, etc, etc… Okay, I was making a point here… back to that… Anyway, our Director, a nice congenial man, that we all loved and respected, was a survivor from the USS Indianapolis, a cruiser that was sunk near the end of the war. The horrific part of this story, was the ship sunk in shark infested waters, and many of this man’s shipmates became a meal fora shark. He was recounting the story to us one night after our weekly meeting… I still don’t know how he could relate it to us with such a straight face…

Actually the USS Arizona Memorial does not even touch the ship at all it lies across the ship. The Arizona is still carried on the books as in commison. I for one have studied the attack and I can not imagine the horror of what some those men went thru trapped in the Oklahoma when she rolled over.

The tale of what happened to the USS Indianapolis, and ultimately to its Captain Charles B. Mc Vay, and the 90 plus survivors of a crew of 317 is a tale of military war, horror. and incompetence to the most frightening degree. Google : USS Indianapolis or Books: USS Indianapolis and it will send chills down your spine.

What those men did in the aftermath of Pearl Harbor is unlikely to be repeated, since we do not possess the will to rise from a blow of that magnitude. I hope that future generations will take notice of the importance of showing our attackers that we can and we will recover from their cowardly/brave (Some attackers acts against this country were within the laws of engagement, as defined by the Geneva convention) actions.

May we not have wasted fine young lives on a lost cause. Once should have been enough!