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Classic Trains General Discussion
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Sorry, but IT happened once again, sooooooooooooo

. . . . . ENCORE! A NOTE for all who Post here! . . . . .

Some of this may be repetitious, however, we have some new guys who may appreciate this info:

When you log in to this Forum (Classic Trains) and see the listings for the topics, you are NOT getting the most CURRENT Posts if you simply click on what you see.

Click on “Active Topics.” Use the “Active Topics Since” option (near the top, at the middle) and click on “last 12 hours –or- last 6 hours” etc., and you will then get “refreshed” info.

Another way to ensure that you are reading the MOST CURRENT info, is once you have called up the last page shown for “Our” Place and BEFORE you decide to respond, use the “REFRESH” or “RELOAD” option (usually located at the top bar of your screen). This will call up the MOST CURRENT info.

I cannot explain why the Forums operate this way, but they do. Since I am here more time than most, I see it happen several times a day where someone Posts, but does not respond to information that has been “out there” for an hour or more. Reason [?] Who knows! But one way to circumvent it is to use either of my “procedures” explained above.

For the guys who seemingly have repetitious problems with losing information before it gets Posted – use a word processor program to prepare your material. Cut ‘n paste it to the “message block” on the Thread. Should it get “lost” you always can retrieve it from your WP program. Simple enough, eh [?]

Finally, try to stick around for a couple of minutes AFTER you have Posted – then use the “REFRESH” or “RELOAD” option, just to see if someone has Posted during the time you were preparing yours.

None of this is difficult but will surely keep you “on target” if you are interested in such things.

3562

G’day Gents!

Just finished with some MORE Christmas decorations for the outside. My bride decided that we should have “something” in the BACK of the house. Hmmmmm. No further comment on that. Anyway, there is now an illuminated train for us to enjoy - Fa La La La La, Lah, La, La, La, LAH! [swg] Gettin’ a bit on the chilly side fer sure, fer sure - winds pickin’ up and it “feels” like snow. Sure wish it WOULD! [tup]

Man oh man, I check the Posts and what do I find [?] Argggggggggggggggh. Frustration abounds with this stuff. Thought for sure that my NOSTALGIA piece for today would “tweak” the guy who has been talking about the Zephyrs Oh well, win some, lose some and some are rained out. Double - Arggggggggggh.

Okay, so where am I [?] Ah yes, an Inclusive Post from our friend, earlydiesels Dan! Good show and thanx for the positive comments …

Gotta run - phone’s ringing, door bell is too and my wife just came home! [wow] A trifecta.

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

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Good Afternoon Tom, Time for a CR or better make that a double I am on the Blue Ribbon Crime Commission and this is our fourth meeting this afternoon. Sure will need something to get me through the meeting.

Tom loved the piece on the CZ and Denver Zephyr in 1949 that would have been the original Denver Zephyr a fine train that was replaced by the last full service streamlined trains to enter service before Amtrak. Those original Streamlined DENVER ZEPHYRS then became the TEXAS ZEPHYRS on the Colorado Southern/Fort Worth and Denver. I remember reading somewhere how many Million miles those original DENVER ZEPHYRS traveled and i beleive they held the record.

TTFN AL

3564

Tom everything in recent “Encore” makes sense except the part about “None of this is difficult.” If every sailor had your expertise the Coast Guard would soon be out of the S.O.S. business. Who doesn’t love Zephyrs. I think I rode the California Z eastbound in 1960. And there’s some Z’s in that top ten fastest scheduled trains of 1956, all diesel traction. The fastest electric traction that year was the 83.4-mile stretch of Paoli to Harrisburgh in 71 minutes on the Broadway (70.5 mph). Runner-up: Afternoon Congressional between Newark and No. Philadelphia, 76 miles in 65 minutes (70.1mph). But Steam is King, I think.
Going back to 1893 the NYC&H.R. (Hudson?) “Empire State Express” did a mile in 32 seconds (112 mph) and in 1934 some UP train flew 9 miles from Dix to Potter, Nebraska in 4.5 minutes (120 mph). All this according to the brittle yellowed pages of my trusty 1957 World Almanac and Book of Facts, published annually by the erstwhile “New York World-Telegram and The Sun,” cumbersomely named vestige of “The New York World” (first corporate sponsor of the World Series) and Virginia wrote the editor of “The Sun” about Santa Claus.

Can I get a Spam sandwich on white, with ketchup? Be careful lifting off the lid, Tom, the edge is treacherous! And please rinse off that slimy gelatin goo before you slice it. Oh the key is missing? No problem I just happen to have a spare spam key. Actually it’s a used coffee can key after uncoiling the strip of metal.

Doug, no one was mere seconds from getting run over this time, but near suffocation in a tunnel is pretty good. Until recently I had thought a Mike was a microphone and a Mikado was something like The Barber of Seville.

Nick, your new game may have a long future, considering that the legendary Boris seemed to have landed here on the wings of one of your idle whims. Reminds me, there was a board game called “Dispatcher” that collected dust on department store shelves decades ago. Based on UP operations I think. Can’t r

3565

A friend Of mine that I work with (also a fan and modeler) told me when I was just starting out, that working for the railroad would ruin the hobby for me.

I told him that it wouldnt, well it almost did. Right about the time I was going through my divorice, which I lost everything even my models. I developed a real bad attitude and I got to the point that I hated trains and couldnt stand the sight of them and it lasted for several years.Im not sure what got me back into to hobby again. But I can tell you that present day railroading does nothing for me. I do love the historical aspect though.

Of course im not going to say anything bad about my employer, but the company I do really like is the PC its the railroad I grew up with when I was a kid and it was the PC that fostered my love of trains in the mid 70s
P

3566

Afternoon Tom and the gang…Ok.,we have a tough crowd, the offer of lunch still stands

True enough PassengerFan, even after assignment to the commute pool the train masters ventured into freight duty in the off hours until the mid 60s when it was ordered that this must cease so as to preserve them for commute duties. Actually, they were intended for use out of El Paso, the arid/sandy enviorment wreaked havoc on the prime movers, forcing SP to move them west .

Ok Tom and all, here’s the trivia answer: The Bayshore Cutoff was designed for the later addition of two main tracks, making a total of four, also clearences where constructed generously for the later addtion of electrification. SP never developed the need for these upgrades as events turned out…

SP was concerned with image and addherance to the schedule in those long ago days. When events conspired to disable the usual commute power, it was not unusual to find Alco RS-32’s, GP-35’s, GE U-25B’s or low nose GP-9’s, all the former from the freight pool, assigned as relief power, such oddball power was confined mostly to Bayshore for switching and local service and therefore readily available in a pinch. My last visit, prior to CalTrain takeover had Tunnel Motors spotted at the service tracks, SP had abandoned the practice of building freight trains in SF, so I suspect this is yet another example of creative use of relief power.

Dave

3567

Hi everybody, Tom, just a glass of soda (unleaded) for now please. I had a “hit and run” quicky at McDonalds and haven’t been the same since.[xx(] Well, I did the “most recent posts” thing so I hope I’m caught up to date. Not good news on the Sears purchase is it? Maybe I’ll “luck out” of any major problems, “hope springs eternal.” Love all the data on the Denver and California Zephers which you and Al so gereously shared.[tup][tup][tup] As a little shaver during W.W. II, I had more than my fair share of Spam and can attest to the haazards of opening the can mentioned by wanswheel.[:O] The only thing more threatening would be the contents.[V] And yes, I did know of the “steam is king” for setting speed pasenger runs and the Road’s that did it come as no surprise.

Sorry for being late checking in but there has been a epidemic of interuptions this day. BK, glad to hear your rail journey wasn’t a “bust.” Sounds as if the second leg (VIA) was downright enjoyable. Doug, I haven’t read installments 2 and 3 yet but the first was very informative and looking forward to finishing them up. WOW, the “nuts and bolts” of keeping a Road competitive and “rolling” entails so many details it boggles the mind. Surely appreciate the time and trouble it takes for postings.[tup] Rob, there is no rush on the pix and I must apologize for “puttin you through the ringer” like this. Had I known of the potential problems, I would have demured from the beginning…“don’t sweat it” on my account please. Speaking of Pike Perspectives, I’m making some headway on my Cityscape but as work progresses, I need to do some more “undoing” from previous imprudent choices. Mostly “tweaking,” however there is one nagging “glitch” that needs some major surgery. I need to raise the north leg of the mainline about 1" to 1-1/2" for a more prototypical gradient. Since this abuts my work bench, I must raise the working surface of the bench.[#oops]

Pete and Nick, al

3568

Evenin’ Gents!

Okay now, where was I [?] Ah yes – earlydiesels Dan …. As much as you are looking forward to resumption of “duties” at the Midland I know that those of us who “followed” your long absence and recovery hope that you don’t “pu***he envelope.” Take care, man! [tup] And of course, have an enjoyable time – you AND your bride! [swg]

To the acknowledgments:

passengerfan Al Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 15:58:12

Why THANK YOU, Sir …. Appreciate the acknowledgment!

I always got a kick out of that term, “Blue Ribbon.” Have you ever actually seen the ribbon [?] And was it really blue [?] [swg] Seriously, sounds to me as if you are quite the civic minded guy – society can only gain by having the citizenry engaged. That’s not a quote from anyone that I’m aware of, just my thoughts on the matter. [tup][tup]

By the by, thanx for the THREE Posts today! [tup][tup][tup]

wanswheel Mike Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 16:30:47

You may not know this, but the USCG is indeed out of the “SOS” business. The international Morse code was dropped decades ago as the primary method for communications by ships at sea. Consequently, the USCG decided that there was no longer a need to continuously guard the frequency set aside for “SOS” – 500 Khz… An era ended one in which I spent about 14 years of my career dedicated to. Like the anvil salesmen of the 1800’s, my skills as a high speed radio telegraph operator are no longer needed. Change, my friend, it’s all about …… [swg

I received your Email – thanx! I still think you should Post that info. Just copy the URL on the last page you sent me to – and post it here. The gujys can then go directly to it and get the “story.” See, it’s easy! [swg]

Man oh man have you ever rekindled a thought or two regarding the “SPAM key.” As with the old roller skate key, I haven’t thought about either in y

3569

OH, #@&% !

3570

Well good evening fellow stop-outs & ner-do-wells,managed to stumble back in before Leon noticed me (He takes that bit in his contract about expelling drunks from the premises far too literally IMHO....) O.K,where am I ,ah yes- [4:-)]TOM-better set up a couple of those green bottles please,this might take a while:- ok,first up-still TOM-I hope the tunnel on the SCapades has a lift off-looks like a very long piece of track to have out of your control--Nice one on the Soo Line,another one of those maneagable size roads ( C.P. connection helps )[tup] BAR CHANDLER ROB-Appreciate the offer of a J.D but would prefer a beer ( youve never had the pleasure of my company after drinking spirits,it`s a luxury you can spare yourself,believe me–on a different note-([4:-)]TOM also) May looking increasingly promising,sister due home at Xmas,will start final negotiations then and report directly

MIKE-pull up a stool and take the weight off,a long Dr P over T.V advert crushed ice ?-Be good to hear your Old Mans story [^]-heres the bribe,you spill the beans,we provide an unlimited supply of Spam & Ketchup on white ( & heres the killer ) fla***oasted under a full-blast Salamander so that the outside is crisp nut-brown but the butter hasnt softened in the centre -N.B-[C=:-)]s tip-always chill can for sveral hours before opening-youll see why when you do it. RED P-welcome aboard,Jack + Coke it is AL-Now-Badger & Gopher,this is more my scale of train-the trans-continentals & such cover more territory than I can comfortably imagine......As to Spam,when I was a kid,Mum made sure we had meat every day-her definition being part of an animal. Spam-nice safe pink stuff with no tubes,bone splinters,strange purple bits,bits of bristles etc SIR THEODORE MANAGER-I am ashamed to say that Ive only just re-discovered your E-Mail R.E. your yard throat,will contact you separately once your current situation is resolved
B.K.-Glad you are enjoying the good things in life[tu

3571

Evenin’ Gents!

Just let me add a good nite to all as an addendum to Nick’s most welcome Post. Can’t top that one … always Inclusive and always most entertaining! Can’t imagine bein’ at the keyboard at 3:17 AM for any other reason than insomnia! [swg]

Very happy to learn that May is lookin’ good for the First Annual Rendezvous in Toronto Hopefully, we’ll add a couple of more before the event takes place … [tup]

Don’t give up on the “game,” Mate! Pehaps we should make a game out of trying to figure it out! [;)]

Hey! I saw jdonald Don peeking in at us - but no Post! Whazzup [?] Haven’t seen ya 'round here for a bit … [tdn]

Okay, P, you’ve vented, now as the Eagles song title says, Get Over it! (press H14 on [i]Herr Wurltizer![/i)

Leon the Night Man has the bar! Boris Ring the bell and give 'em all a nightcap on me …

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

3572

Good Evening Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a triple CR and a round for the house. Todays meeting was conducted by the Judges, District Attorney, and Public Defenders. After listening to this bunch maybe their is some hope for our high crime problem after all.

Tom never thought about it but I will certainly miss di di di da da da di di di guess progress eventually buries the past.

Tomorrow I we\ill find a short streamliner posting as it will be a twelve hour day at the office.

TTFN AL

3573

Evening Leon I’ll grab a CR and a broom and help put everything from whence it came.

Tom Saw your post but I was outta time and had to run.Enjoyed it once I could read it however, I’m not sure that some of the language in it could be used in modern times with out causing some alarm. Tha t whole " Land of A Million Thrills… Sped , Comfort , and Pleasure " Thing could be considered not PG-13 nowadays. You don’t want to get us [censored] do you [?] Good stuff anyway.

We have three old fichbowels in brantford as emergency power. If the low floors and GMC Classics crap out they will bring them out of the bus barn.

I found the models a atd pricey $38 dollars on sale her so I’ve avoided them at the moment. I reallt don’t like busses anyway.

Ted No problem with the disks really it’s more just a lack of time to sit down and do it.( read realitivley lazy Rob ) Rest assured I will get them up and running.Hope you are all right or am I misreading the hit and run bit. You shouldn’t be eating at MacDonalds anyway ( you thought spam was a bit off [xx(] [swg] ) Talk about blowing chunks as Tom would say.

Mike I’ve scanned that article really good read btw. Post the url i think as Tom sadi that the boyz will appreciate it [tup] Nice to know that trains sparked your existance in a way. You were starcrossed to love trains my friend [tup] I know a bit far out but hey it’s late.

Nick Glad to know that you may be amongst us in May. I’ll be sure to keep you away from the CR and or open flames [:O][swg]

Al thanks for the answer on the zepher question. I figured that they would be a pain to change out. Coarse Doug would know they have one at his museum. BTW Doug hows the repair comming on it ?

Dave Thanks for letting us off the hook with the answer .The Montreal transit authoriteies ran some odd power for commut

3574

THURSDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

We open at 6 AM, all time zones. (Don’t ask how we do that!) [swg]

It’s the 12th month! On the 12th day of this new month, ”Our” Place will be 8 months into existence! [wow]

One more day to go and this work week will end, for most. Time to grab one of those steaming mugs of freshly brewed coffee, a breakfast, and of course The Mentor Village Bakery pastry case awaits! [swg]

You can never trust a man who can look a pretty woman in the eye.

Info for the Day:

(1) Today is Fish ‘n Chips Nite and maybe something from Nick’s Picks!
(2) Friday is Pizza Nite along with Steak ‘n Fries Nite!
(3) Saturday is ENCORE! Day
(4) Sunday is Sunday Photo Posting Day! and yes, we are CLOSED!

SUMMARY

Name ………………… Date/Time …………………. (Page#) … Remarks

(1) passengerfan Al Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 02:42:37 (178) Streamliner #18 – Advance Denver Zephyrs

(2) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 05:27:39 (178) Game, etc.

(3) siberianmo Tom Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 05:30:18 (178) Wednesday’s Info & Summary

(4) barndad Doug Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 06:04:25 (178) Recollections of a Locomotive Fireman, Part I

(5) barndad Doug Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 06:06:26 (178) Recollections of a Locomotive Fireman, Part II

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 30 Nov 200

3575

Good morning Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a coffee and diet pastry from the Mentor Bakery.

PASSENGERFAN ALS STREAMLINER CORNER # 19

Something different for toadys post is not a streamlined train but a streamlined engine.

The engine was named COMMODORE VANDERBILT and it was NYC J-1e 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotive 5344 streamlined to head the heavyweight Twentieth Century Limited between Toledo and Chicago westbound each morning and westbound each afternoon. This was a distance of 223.6 miles. The engine entered service at the head of the TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED on February 19, 1935. The streamlining was of the upside down bathtub design that was popular with many roads. The NYC streamlined the 5344 and two Pacifics with this type streamlining and that was the only three NYC units so shroudded. The 5344 would later receive a Raymond Loewy shroud becoming the only NYC steam locomotive to wesr two types of streamlining.

TTFN AL

3576

Mornin’ All!

What a beautiful mornin’ here in mid-continent USA with light snow fallin’ – a brisk breeze and all the roofs of the homes covered in white. It’s only a dusting, but as Juneau and I made the 6:30 AM one mile trek, it was an especially pleasant sight! Especially so with the MMTB homes all lit up with Christmas lights.

MMTB [?] you ask – More Money Than Brains! That refers only to those who leave the lights on 24/7 …… a waste of resources fer sure, fer sure, but commonplace ‘round these parts. Hmmmmmm, maybe I should start sellin’ timers, and of course charge a “modest fee” to set them up! [swg]

My guess is that we are NOT going to have much of a Sunday Photo Posting Day! So, there will be a modification to the format – submissions of NOSTALGIA and Fallen Flags are encouraged. [tup] As always, we want to continue limiting the narratives to Monday thru Saturday ……

passengerfan Al Posted: 30 Nov 2005, 21:41:52 and 01 Dec 2005, 06:59:40

A long day for you. Amazing how some days one requires at least 34 hours squeezed into 24.

Nice “alteration” to the Streamliner series!

For all: Check out this URL – click on the pictures - http://www.steamlocomotive.com/streamlined/scrapped/

By the by, are you an old “key pounder” too [?] As I mentioned, my first 14 years was as a radio operator and the dit dit dit dah dah dah dit dit dit could surely snap one to immediate attention, especially while on the mid or 4-to-8 watches in early AM. Somewhere ‘round this house is my old “speed key,” I’ll have to dig it out and see if I can still “swing.” Been a long, long time …… We used to have “split phones,” with 500 Kcs (now Mhz) in one ear, another frequency in the other, and at least tw

3577

Good Morning: Coffee, please; round for the house, and more $ for the jukebox.

The coffee is most welcome today as it is cold and a heavy frost. It makes for a nice drive to work as all the trees and underbrush are coated with frost and the sun glints off of them. Who needs DVDs when you have this sort of show to enjoy.

Hot !@#$ - NYC material! It doesn’t take much to get me started!

“Bathtub” is surely the right word for these engines. IIRC, the 4-6-2 bathtubs operated on the Mercury while 5344 operated on the “Century.”

NYC 5344 appeared in many “styles” of we can call them that. IIRC, she ran “plain” after the second set of shrouding was removed. 5344 was the last of the Jie-class Hudsons, and the story is that it got the shroud because it happened to be in the shops for overhaul when the decision was made to do the streamline project. The design was developed by Carl Kantola, an industrial designer from Cleveland, OH. An interesting story abt 5344 is that she was brought to New York in December, 1934 to be displayed at Grand Central, but was too big to fit into the Park Avenue Tunnel. According to Zimmermann’s book 20th Century, Kantola, “…suggested filling the boiler completely with water - which worked. The extra weight compressed the srpings just enough to let the locomotive slip in.”

Now, a question - why hasn’t AWK been seen since Thanksgiving? Enquiring minds want to know - I hope he didn’t wind up as dinner somewhere…or maybe it was something like the Three Stooges movie with the parrot inside the turkey.

To our "steamed owner. Have you given any thought to setting a day aside for postings of Christmas/ Holiday train travel memories?

work safe

3578

Morning all , coffee please.
As far as sunday goes I already have my picture picked out [:D]
P

3579

Okay, that does it! Tweeeeeeeeeeeets! all around

We need a reminder - Greet the bartender - that’s me (or whoever is behind the bar). A good morning all doesn’t get it! [tdn]

Also, ordering just our free coffee isn’t keeping us in business - perhaps at five bucks a mug, hmmmmmmm! [swg]

C’mon guys - play along with this - it’s what the bar 'n grill is all about - Classic Trains and some fun!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

3580

Good show! The posts are still coming in “hot and heavy.” Just a quick cuppa Joe and a toasted Bagel this a.m., please Tom. You know, the mention of the “Fish Bowls” (G.M.C. city buses) was akin to being reminded of my Nephew’s and Nice’s ages. WOW, does that ever “date” me and my model Pike. The truth is, the afore mentioned bus is too new for my “cut-off” date of 1952. I’m still stuck in the “flat bottom” era (sounds appropriate) buses which were Plaster of Paris castings that needed lots of filing and cleaning up.[:O] The giant “take over” of City Lines was in progress, so I have 2 paint liveries (bus) from that era. Like Rob, I’m no fan for “rubber baby buggy bumpers,” still, the transition from rail to bus did happen and needs to be recognized (“more is the pity”).

The NYC shrouded steam that Al mentioned brought back a memory of Lionel O gauge models of some of them. Personally, the only streamlining of steam that I appeciated were on the Pennsy and Frisco rosters.[^] Part of the excitement of steam for me was the exsoskeleton of pumps, air resovoirs, feed water heaters, steam and sand domes, et al. Those old “heavy browed” locos hauling endless consists of freight cars in a sub zero wintery setting speaks volumes about the essence of U.S. r.r.ing.[2c] The articulated Burlington Zephers and U.P. 10,000 get about the same reception as the steam shrouded in sheet metal. They were (for me) a curiosity more than an important alternative to the record setting speed of the early steam “varnish.” [soapbox]

Yes P, although your approach to “the real thing” is certainly more “hands on” than anything I have experienced, your assessment of “present day r.r.ing” is certainly “on target,” in my humble opinion. As Tom has remided us, “change” in so rapid a time frame, is something we must live with. In fact, there has been so much “change” that I’m scarcely aware of all the new proceedures that have taken effect s