Hi everyone. [:D]
What is the secret to photographing under florescent lights? I’ve tried shifting the camera’s light/dark settings and using Photoshop to correct the color balance but I’m not satisfied with the results.
Also I use telephoto to get better depth of field and this does seem to help some.
Any comments on these two subjects would be appreciated.
Most digital cameras nowadays automatically compensate for the quality of the ambient lighting, although my previous one required the user to manual set it for fluorescent or incandescent lighting. Here’s a shot done under fluorescents with that older camera (click on any of these photos to get an enlargement, then click on the enlargement to get a full-screen view):
This one’s taken with a slightly newer camera (but still a simple point-and-shoot type) under incandescent light. It has no option to account for the type of light source, and simply adjusts automatically:
…and an on-layout view (under fluorescents) of the same cars, using the same camera:
Depth of field is dependent on the aperture of the camera’s lense: the smaller the aperture, the greater the depth of field. Here’s a few scenes taken with the older camera - it has no means of adjusting the aperture, and is pre-set to give generally acceptable results under most normal conditions:
In this one, the unloader in the foreground is almost touching the camera’s lense and is out-of-focus. The loader, a little further away, is slightly fuzzy, while the rest of the scene, about 8’ deep, doesn’t look too bad…
This one, taken with the same camera, has only the nearby ground close to the lense, and pretty-well everything of interest is in focus. The scene is about 4’ deep:</
I have the same problem with flourescent lights. I bought a new camera, pretty nice one, the Panasonic Lumix. Specifically for taking photos inside. While my photos have improved, and depth of field has gotten better, the colors always seem off, and i have to adjust them in photo editing software.
A couple of observations on color:
What you are talking about is known as color temperature. In general incandescent is around 3000-3500K, cool white florescent is around 4000K and daylight is around 5000+k. The camera must be set to match the color temp of the light on the layout or you have to adjust the color temp in Photoshop afterwards,
Point and shoot cameras may have rudimentary adjustments or none at all. The SLR types usually have a white balance/color temp adjustment…
I have mine set to around 3200k (the temp of my warm white cpfls). I notice if it gets changed in the camera settings, the color goes wonky.
A couple tricks I have used over the years: Look up a color temperature chart for the bulbs you are using and use it to set your color temp in the camera (if you have a setting) or to match as close as possible the daylight /cloudy/ incandescent etc setting of the camera.
Make sure all the lights on your layout are the same type, mixed cool and warm fluorescents wreak havoc on color temp. Same goes for incandescent and florescent mixes. It makes it much harder to fix color temp if the bulbs are not all the same.
In Photoshop, you can adjust color temp by using a variety of methods including the auto levels under the images menu or the color temp adjust in RAW. I rarely try to make hue adjustments individually as they usually end up looking wrong.
For more interesting light I recommend getting the basic lighting right and then using a hand held flood light to paint the scene as the long exposure is running. The light can be bounced, filtered with your fingers, pointed towards the backdrop etc. I usually will shoot several different combinations until I find one that I like.
BTW: I have noticed that internal JPEG software in point and shoot cameras has gotten much, much better over the years at getting the color temps right.
Your mileage may v
While using the telephoto option on your camera to improve your DOF, it has the unfortunate side effect of compressing your scene.
Mark.
Guy,
That was it!!! White balance. My Lumix L7 has a setting to match the lighting. I pointed the camera at a piece of white paper, under the fluorescent lighting, and set it to match that.
Much much better now. Thanks for the tips!
setting film speed will help with the grain of the photos
F=stop 13.6
APP 3.6
35 MM Focal length
ISO 64 exp .77 sec
ISO 100 exp .59 sec
ISO 200 exp 1/3 sec
ISO 400 exp 1/7 sec
ISO 800 exp 1/15 sec
ISO 1600 exp 1/30 sec
Using a telephoto lens or setting will give you less depth of field. Wide angle settings will give you more. Smaller lens openings (f/8-22) - f- stops - will give you more DOF. A lot is demonstrated in my model railroad photography website in my signature.
Good luck!
How about some post-production software. This one was done with Photomatix, Perfect Effects 4 is also a possibility.
Thanks Guys Everything helps.
River-Eagle
I like your instructional site. It brings back information from a beginners class I took 35 years ago at a local community collage, and since forgot everything I had learned.
My camera is a Nikon cool pix P500 basically a point and shoot with some extra features and a 36 X lens.
What temperature should the lights be?
I have 6 x 48" double tube florescent fixtures on a 28ft run. Too much??
New photo.
Can’t say I care for the yellow sky …
Mark.
I presume you just put this up for an example and did not mean it as a finished product. Were this real film I would have said oh look Fuji Color film because of the oversaturation of the reds.
I’ve often had this problem when trying to manipulate photos to get them “better”. I end up with that funny over contrast look like a laser photo, or washed out sky, or people with green skin, or ad nausium. … sigh. I have recently purchased a full version of Adobe Photo Shop and hope to learn how to do such things better.
Ah good old ASA 64 Kodachrome. These new digital cameras are getting closer and closer. I actually sent my dark room equipment to the thrift store. Never thought I would do that.
One trick is to slightly desaturate the color in the image menu. There are lots of ways in Photoshop to correct color - not all of them give satisfactory results depending on the photo. You have to experiment.
The soft ware won’t make a poor photo into a good one. Start with the following and the color correction and other alterations will be minimal…
Use the highest F stop possible with a tripod
Set the color temp/white balance to match the lights
Use the largest image file size possible on the camera
Find a reasonable iso setting (don’t go too low or the contrast is poor, don’t go too high or the resolution is bad) mine is at 200.
Use aperture priority setting and the auto timer to avoid moving the camera
Using some of these techniques should improve your images so that they need less photo sho
here is the data from your shot
I would shoot in aperture mode. and set to f/5.7, ISO 160 (limits of camera) shoot one in macro, one without, and one each with white bal. on auto & with the presets for comparison, and go with the settings that work best for you.
the great thing about digital is that you can shoot lots of pics, try different things, instant results, just delete the bad ones, make adjustments, and go right back and shoot again.
One thing about Fluorescent Lighting is to get CFL’s or tubes with very high CRI ratings. Standard worklight tubes are the absolute worst! With those the color rendering rating is around 60… Look for fluorescent lights having a CRI (Color Rendering Index) of 92 or above. The best camera in the wold can’t capture wavelengths that aren’t there in the light. I switched from standard CFL bulbs with a CRI of 80 to Daylight (5000°K) ones with a CRI of 92 to 94. It made a huge difference in both how the layout looks in person and how the layout photographs. Examples:
Photo taken with the standard CFLs:
Same basic scene after changing to 5000°K with CRI of 92+:
Same Camera, same lens. Notice the difference in the greens and the blue sky. Both were corrected as best as I could using Photoshop. The camera was set at auto balance for both shots as well.
I also highly recommend reading Railphotog’s site! He has been a great help to me over the years. You can contact him as well. I did and he helped me with a clinic on photography I did for the NMRA a couple years back.
73
Personal preference, I prefer the first one myself. The second one looks too bright. The foreground greens are almost washed out. Very little if no natural shadowing.
Mark.
Yes, my camera has chrome, standard, and B&W available for all ISO speeds, and I generally shoot models with ISO 64 and the chrome setting.
shot info
same basic scene in night time mode, all lighting on the layout, no off scene lights, let the camera pick all the settings
shot info
I agree that shop lights are the worst. The light to my eye is harsh.
However, I really like the warm glow in 3200 range (incandescent) Many of us make a point to model and paint etc. in the same light that is on the layout. I am careful to do this. At this point I have lots of models that have been painted and weathered in 3200K light. Experiments show that my models don’t look all that great when I change the color from 3200 to 5000K, thus I leave the lighting at 3200K.
Last summer I painted a plaster building (stone by stone) in the kitchen using sunlight, It looked terrible when I put in on the layout and I had to repaint.
I think the bigger issues are light that is pleasing to the eye in the layout room and making sure that things are well lit. That can be done in a variety of ways and still have a great looking layout regardless of the CRI.
Guy