I’m at the stage in my layout where I’ve begun the card-board strip braceing for my mountains, hills, etc. I have been testing a few different technicques in place of purchasing plaster cloth but I’m looking for some advice or comments from the more experienced folks. Paper mache (yuck, hate it). Foam carving, sanding (I will use it but don’t like it)
The current technique I’m testing is using cheap generic paper towels, saturated in a water & dry wall mud slurry (near a maple syrup consistancy). I saturate a paper towel sheet squeeze it out so it isn’t dripping but not to the point of it being wetless, and have used this over a test card-board strip mountain.
Currently the tests have come back pretty good. I’ve only used one layer of paper towel and it dries to a semi hard surface. It actually has some give but it is rigid enough to not “over give”. Sort of like a well done steak (hard to describe I guess). No cracking or chipping as it appears the paper compensates for this potential problem. I’ve place it in both humid and dry locations for several days without cracking. I just spray painted it last night to see if direct wetness deforms the shape (didn’t seem to but I’ll find out tonight).
I found this to be a very cheap alternative to plaster cloth given the amount of dry wall mud and costs of paper towel. I’m going to test my method more tonight by adding additional paper towel sheets over a new test mountain but it looks like I’d get through half to full roll of paper towel and a bucket of dry wall mud for about 14.00 USD.
The costs I’m seeing for plaster cloth for the same amount seems to be easily over 25.00 USD.
A couple questions / desired feedback:
How many sheets of plaster cloth do you normally use? (do you layer 1 sheet down and fill in the holes, do you lay 2 sheets down over the same area, etc etc)
If you have large areas to do then I can see why you need a more economical system.
But, for me, the ease of use with Plaster Cloth is really worth it. Less mess, quick and easy to do. However, I’m not doing mountains but more like hills. Most of my hills consist of crumpled newspaper (temporaily taped down) covered with Plaster Cloth and then coated with Sculptamold (with is also very easy to use with little mess and easy cleanup).
I usually overlap the Plaster Cloth about 50% so in the end there is normally 2 layers of Plaster Cloth over a given area. The layer of Sculpamold and be varied as needed depending on the final look your shooting for. You can add more water to make it smoother or less water for a rougher texture. You can also carve it as it starts to set up.
I’ve done a little with carved foam covered with Sculptamold but the foam gets messy and the newspaper is much easier for me.
Medical plaster cloth for casts actually “expires”. You can check with your local hospital, hospital supply company, MD or vet to see if they have any expired stock they’d give you for free.
You can find plaster cloth at craft stores like Michaels or A.C. Moore. It’s cheaper as a craft product than as a Model Railroad product, but it’s the same stuff.
I like plaster cloth, too, but I only use it for spots. For my mountains (hills, really) I use pink foam, covered with Gypsolite for texture. The plaster cloth is nice for “transitions” between hills and flats, or to cover over small gaps. I’ve also been using it to make scenic covers to hide above-layout Atlas switch machines.
Don’t hold your breath looking for expired product. I made just such an inquiry at a local medical facility (thanks to a recently broken foot) and they said the plaster cloth is never in the building long enough to expire. They’re constantly having to reorder because their supplies keep getting low. A technician there gave me the name of their supplier (I’ve since forgotten the name), but said they only sell to buyers with a tax ID number (meaning they didn’t sell to the general public, probably for fear of misuse).
I would read Howard Zane’s article in January’s RMC. He uses red rosin paper and Elmer’s glue for his mountains over a cardboard grid. I have not used his technique but plan to when I get to scenery. I know a couple of people who have seen Howard’s layout and say the scenery is terrific. As far as expense it is one of the least expensive techniques. For more information you can Google “Howard Zane Red Rosin” and see what you come up with.
My mom works at a health clinic. I asked her if she had access to plaster cast cloth and she said, “We have it. It comes in a BIG roll. So how much do you need?”
As Steveb said white glue can be used and I understand it is much less mess. Can use paper towels, newspaper, etc, not just the heavy building paper. There are several recent articles listed if you search for “glueshell” in the magazine index at the MR site. Just looked them up for a friend of mine, but didn’t keep the info, loaned him the articles. Plan to try it when I reach that stage again.
I’m at the stage in my layout where I’ve begun the card-board strip braceing for my mountains, hills, etc. I have been testing a few different technicques in place of purchasing plaster cloth but I’m looking for some advice or comments from the more experienced folks. Paper mache (yuck, hate it). Foam carving, sanding (I will use it but don’t like it)
The current technique I’m testing is using cheap generic paper towels, saturated in a water & dry wall mud slurry (near a maple syrup consistancy). I saturate a paper towel sheet squeeze it out so it isn’t dripping but not to the point of it being wetless, and have used this over a test card-board strip mountain.
Currently the tests have come back pretty good. I’ve only used one layer of paper towel and it dries to a semi hard surface. It actually has some give but it is rigid enough to not “over give”. Sort of like a well done steak (hard to describe I guess). No cracking or chipping as it appears the paper compensates for this potential problem. I’ve place it in both humid and dry locations for several days without cracking. I just spray painted it last night to see if direct wetness deforms the shape (didn’t seem to but I’ll find out tonight).
I found this to be a very cheap alternative to plaster cloth given the amount of dry wall mud and costs of paper towel. I’m going to test my method more tonight by adding additional paper towel sheets over a new test mountain but it looks like I’d get through half to full roll of paper towel and a bucket of dry wall mud for about 14.00 USD.
The costs I’m seeing for plaster cloth for the same amount seems to be easily over 25.00 USD.
A couple questions / desired feedback:
How many sheets of plaster cloth do you normally use? (do you layer 1 sheet down and fill in the holes, do you lay 2 sheets down over the same area, etc etc
I love Howard Zane’s red resin paper over cardboard strips for creating the shape of the hills but I had difficulty creating the shell with the white glue. I found the white glue would tend to run down hill and collect in depressions leaving other areas without much of a shell. I recently discovered powdered joint compount which I mix fairly thin so it can be spread easily. I just described this material under a thread called “My new favorite scenic material”. I find it clings to the resin paper better than the white glue and creates a strong shell. I’ve recently done a small hill this way and it worked so well I’m going to use it to create a much larger hilly region. I’m really excited about the results I got by combining these two methods.
There have been references in this forum about the use of used anti-static clothes dryer sheets being dipped in plaster and used like the more expensive plaster cloth. From the mess standpoint, it’s probably no better than dipping paper towels in plaster, but because of the fiberous nature of the dryer sheets they may make a stronger shell. I’ve not tried it myself, but I’ve asked my wife to start saving the used dryer sheets rather than throwing them in the trash. Another plus, is that your layout now will have that “fresh spring scent”.
Jason, if you scroll down the bottom of this page, you can see what ive done. Im at a similar stage to yourself and used Jo Fugates method of portland, plaster and vermiculite mix and it works very well and goes very quick in preperation and application.
Why are you guys using expensive plaster cloth and then covering it with Scuptamold? You may as well use window screening if you plan to completely cover it.
Why are we using scultamold? Sculptamold is pretty stiff even if mixed wet, Screen will not hold its shape well enogh to take the stiffer material. Scultamold is very controllable,it can be shaped etc while still moist and still hold the form you give it. Plaster is a little harder to work in this manner but only if you mix it stiff,but then the disadvantage is a short pot life. If you use plaster cloth underneath you have a nice firm base to work from.
I was in Hobby Lobby yesterday to get some WS ground foam (I struck out), and I found some rolls of plaster cloth that looked very similar to WS plaster cloth. It came in 4" wide rolls as opposed to the WS 8" rolls but it cost only 3 bucks compared to the WS cloth which is regularly 9 bucks but is currently on sale from Walthers at 7 bucks a roll. I’ve never used plaster cloth because it seems too expensive to use on a large scale but I figured for 3 bucks, I could experiment with it on a limited basis. I used to use paper towels dipped in Hydrocal using wadded up newspapers to create the basic form. This gave great results but what a mess. I’ve just used a variation of Howard Zane’s red resin paper method described in January’s RMC. Rather than using white glue for the shell, I am using powdered joint compound which I mix thinner than per the instructions. I get a shell almost as hard as hydrocal but without the mess. It also has a much longer working time than plaster products. The red resin paper over cardboard strips is a great way for shaping hills and mountains.
