I’ll admit I have had some issues with my post-war, LTI, and DCS MTH O gauge equipment. But nothing like what I’m experiencing with 1950’s S gauge American Flyer engines and remote switches. None of my switches will cycle; my Baldwin is a mess; and I have a Pacific # 293 that lights up nice and the E-unit works, but the motor is silent.
The baldwin looks nearly new, but just won’t work. Port Line Hobbies’ suggestion for E-unit fix did not work.
Is there a really good reference book that includes how to fix and service AF equipment? I recently bought via Ebay a cd that was advertised as an all inclusive product. But it was of no use in AF repair or service. It was mostly window dressing.
Any references will be greatly appreciated.
Bill
You might talk with the folks at Port Line. Their on-line catalog lists three AF service related books, one of which is sold out, and one of which is on a CD, which might be what you already have. That leaves one that might be okay. But give them a call and ask.
Regarding the Baldwin:
I was once advised to not waste my time with these. I’ve been told that the motor is undersized, and the armature proned to burn out. I’ve considered buying one a few times, but never run across one that ran quite to my satisfaction
Regarding the 293:
Have you checked the tether? In my experience, the wires often times break or the solder joints go bad. If your engine has a 5-wire tether(4 plug plus a separate wire), the lights can still light just fine even with a bad connection in the main 4-contact plug. You might also check and make sure the big plug is seated correctly.
Regarding the switches:
In my experience, AF switches tend to be extremely reliable. I can’t offer much advice other than to make sure all of the wires are connected correctly(mine all have color-coded rings on the binding posts).
My other suggestion would be to bypass the control box. Connect a wire from the base post of your transformer the black post, closest to the motor housing(I think). Connect another wire to the fixed post. The switch should throw when you touch it to the red and green posts(2 and 4), and the lamp should light when touched to the yellow(3) post. If it works like this, you probably have a loose wire or some other problem in your control box.
Hope this helps
The repair book I use most often is the “Complete Service Manual for American Flyer” by Kline. There is another edition by Aurora and it is the same I think. Another usefull manual is by Tom Barker.
As far as the Baldwin can’t help you. I have only Steamers.
Ben is right on track (no pun intended) on the switches. When possible seperate the componets and determine what works seperatly.
On the 293, turn the loco over and attempt to turn the motor by hand. This will ensure there is no binding. You say the e unit is working, so focus at this point on the loco. Take the shell off the tender and the loco, remembering to remove the smoke stack tube. Look to see if there are any loose wires, brushes present and no missing parts. Attempt to hot wire the motor bypassing the tender. I don’t think any of the 293s had a plug so you will need to do this at the motor.
Jim
Maybe you should look for the book I use, published in 1991 by Greenberg Publishing Company. The back cover of this 710 page hard bound book states “For ordering information please contact: Kalmbach Publishing Company”.
Title is “Greenberg’s AMERICAN FLYER FACTORY MANUAL” edited by Smith and Smith. It covers 1946 to 1966.
Thanks to all for the info. On the 293, I did notice that upon removal of the brushes’ retaining springs no brushes slid out. So, I looked down the brush barrels with a flashlight while turning the armature to see if there were any brush remnants. I could not see the armature. Thus, I assume the brush remnants are stuck in the barrel. That could be the reason for no engine activity. Have some brushes on order.
Re the switches: I did test each one on the bench prior to layout installation. At first, not one of them would cycle. I removed the underneath plate and noticed how the solenoid and cam works. Cleaned and lubed (with graphite powder) and messed around with an adjustment screw at the cam or lever. I tried various adjustments until I got the switch to cycle. On the layout, all of them are getting the juice, but they appear like it’s not enough. I have them hooked to a constant 16v source. Maybe it’s a distance factor. My control board is a good 10-12 feet from the switches. The switches’ power hookup, though, is on a terminal board located right beneath them. The longer distance - from the transformer to the terminal board- is connected with 14 gauge wire. The controllers are connected to the switches with the same gauge wire that was on the controllers. My non-expert guess is they are 20 gauge.
Re the reference manuals: got my sights on the Greenberg Factory Service Manual and the K-line one on Ebay. Not cheap, however. The Greenberg one recently went for slightly over $51.00. The “buy it now” option on the K-line book is $49.95. Those prices were what led me to an inexpensive cd ($9.00). The only worthwhile part of the cd for me was a parts list. No maintenance info at all, even though maintenance was part of the cd’s title.
Now, if I can just get that Baldwin to run.
Bill
Don’t run from the Greenberg book, it’s hard bound 2 inches thick.
Good troubleshooting on the 293! When you get your brushes adjust the springs so they are about an inch long. Any longer and there is too much pressure on the armature. The indented end of the brush goes inside the spring. While you’ve got it apart, remove all the old grease and re-lube and re-grease.
Measure the voltage at the switch location. My guess is you have adequate voltage. If switches have been sitting for a long time spray electrical contact cleaner on the moving parts and manually move the switch back and forth many times. Sometimes this frees them up. When power is applied can you hear the solenoid? With the leads hooked up, manually put the switch in one position then attempt to switch to the other position. Do this for both sides.
Good luck, sounds like you’ve got a good project going.
Jim
Bill,
I did notice once I got my switches cleaned and lubed that the 14v fixed voltage from a TW Lionel transformer was not enough, (of coarse I fire two switches from one side of a controller at one time). I did notice that the distance factor plays a big roll as well. So I use the 18v side instead. Even when I had them hooked up to the ZW, I notice it took a min. of 16v to throw them at the same time.
The Baldwin, … argh. I have two (a 812 T&P and a NW 355) both run but sound like a couple of rocks are in them. They never did pull many cars either maybe 3 or 4 max. I have seen a re-motoring kit with improved pickups on the trucks that brings these things back to life…but never pursued because of their rarity… I will look to see who had that article.
Great news on the 293. they seem industructable except for the front pilots, if these are bent then the foward pilot wheels will hit it when it travels around a curve… and there is no way of bending them back w/o breaking them… I have tried and failed…hmmm maybe I will put a front coupler on this one…
J. Daddy,
You are most likely right on re not enough voltage for the switches. When I bench tested them, I was using the variable posts on the transformer and cranking it up most of the way. Also, the transformer I’m using at the moment is one of those little things that came with sets. The fixed voltage on it is, I think, 15v. I have the largest transformer that AF made (350 watts), but it’s out for restoration. May be a long time before I get it back. I do have a spare ZW that I could use to see if it will trip those switches.
Re the Baldwin: Port Line Hobbies sells a modern can motor and reverse unit that is designed for the Baldwin. I just ordered it. If I don’t forget, I’ll let you know how it goes.
Regards, Bill
Jim,
I’ve pretty much done most of what you suggested except check the voltage at the switch. Which two posts do I use to check the voltage? I presume the voltage must be checked while the switch control is activated? The switch lights do work. The transformer I’m using temporarily is one of those little jobs that were included in 50s vintage sets. I have the most powerful (350 watts) one AF made, but it’s out for restoration. In the meantime, I am going to hook up the switches to a spare ZW and crank the voltage up past 16.
Regards, Bill
Measure the voltage between the black (base) and the green, then the red. Anything over 15 volts should be adequate. You could also measure the resistance on the solenoid coil. If it is ∞ you have an open circuit. The activating coils are connected in the center; one drives one way the other drives to the opposite direction. Measure between the lead on the end and one of the center wires. Later 720A switches had one common center wire, earlier 720 had two wires and you will need to determine which of the center wires is for which coil. Doubtful if both have shorted. The resistance value for a 720 is ~ 2.4 Ω, for 720A ~ 1.9 Ω. To tell the difference, a 720coil assemble is about 2 inches long and a 720A is about an inch long. Also the 720A switch itself is more rectangular in shape without the cutout for the spur like the 720 has. The 720 also has a manual lever to manually switch the track.
Jim
Jim,
It was the low voltage - measuring at 12.9 to 13.2 at the switches. I hooked them up to a spare control on my ZW and cranked it up to 17 volts and, voila’, they cycled without hesitation. I don’t know why I didn’t think of that earlier.
Thanks for the info on the 293 brushes and springs. I also ordered new springs.
The only AF engine that I have that runs is a recently acquired 302AC Atlantic. It is in very good condition except that it runs slow. I will check the brushes on it as well. Yesterday, there was a train wreck that would make a grown man cry. That 302AC left the table due to a switch turned the wrong way and crashed to my hardwood floor - a distance of about 53 inches. I just knew it was done for. But to my surprise, it only sustained a broken light bulb filament. My floor did sustain a gash. That’s some testament to the durability of those post war engines.
Bill
Gotta love it when toy trains were made to be played with! A true testamony of American Flyer durability. If it running faster in reverse than forward, check the bushing at the end of the motor. Sometimes wear causes it motor to move slightly out of the field due to torque going forward causing slow speed. Fix is easy, get some bushings (very thin washers) and remove the motor and add a bushing at a time till you are satisfied. Another more common cause is old caked grease. I have removed some old grease that was as hard as plastic. It can cause binding. Just clean it out and replace with a quality grease, and oil axles and gears. Takes only a drop or two.
I hope you enjoy your American Flyer trains. I think they are the best!
Jim