I think in the Museum in ST.Louis they have one
The Denver public library has a picture of a Southern Pacific Prison car. The picture was taken by Perry Otto
and he notes -
Page 77 of “More Classic Trains” [Arthur Dubin, Kalmbach Publishing Co. ca. 1974] shows a picture of Pullman tourist car No. 3195 with barred windows. Barely visible below the windows are Rock Island’s initials. The caption states that it was used for aliens and Federal prisoners in the 30’s.
Interesting that the car had truss rods although it appeared to be steel construction. If anyone has a Smithsonian catalogue of the Pullman negative collection, (I can’t find mine), the car might be listed, though more than likely it was modified by the Rock Island for prison service.
The movie “Prison Train”, [Equity Pictures, ca. 1938], shows a group of “Government” prisoners being loaded into a real barred window car and then inside views, (which might be a Hollywood set). If the scene is accurate, the car had a heavy screened wall at one end for the guards. The train supposedly started in New York and headed for the west coast, of course with stock footage of SP and Santa Fe trains enroute - typical “B” movie fare from the 30’s…
I’ve read that some German prisoners being transfered during WW2 were simply give train tickets and directions to their destination.
If I remember correctly that History channel program about POW’s stated the German POW’s were singing the popular WW1 song, “Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag,” but in German. Knowing how our government was a stickler for abiding by the Geneva Convention, I’d be willing to bet the POW’s were moved in Pullman Coaches!
Sp Hist. and Tech. Society book shows ‘prison cars’ originally used for deportation and later used for transport of criminals. Two of these were transported by barge to Alcatraz with inmates although they were not offloaded on to the island the prisoners were from the barge.
Check out www.tri-ang.co.uk/OO/battlepow.html to see an HO/OO model of a POW car. This was made by the British company in the 1960’s as part of their “Battlespace” series of military trains. Of course this isn’t based on a real prototype. From what I’ve been reading, it seems that POW’s transported by rail had a lot more comfort in real life.
Wow there is so many types of cars out there I didn’t know about. I just ordered a blacksmith car and a worker sleeping car from my local shop that has a bunch of little porthole windows in it.
SOme interesting stuff.
Does anyone have anny info or pictures of the prison cars that were used before the jet age to transport criminals across the country?I have only found a couple of very vague mentions on the net.
I don’t know about the prison cars, however, there is an Army Guard car at Pine Bluff . I believe it was assigned to trains and the Army kept some soldiers in this car to guard the train or items being carried by the train. Anyway, next time I go down I will take some pics of it and other items and make them available for all to see.
I believe there is a photo of one such car in either Some Classic Trains or More Classic Trains.
What about cars used by the military to transport Axis POWs during World War II?
I can find plenty of info on the military stuff,but nothing on the cars used by US law enforcement.I remember a long time ago i saw in a magazine pictures of a mobster being put aboard a special barred window prison coach.I would assume that all of the Class 1 roads had at least one such car but it seems impossible now to track one down.Thanks for your help guys.Don
Not aware of prototype. I once dreamed up idea of a freelance prison caboose with bars on the windows and the cupola used as a guard tower.
I tend to think the prison car was only used to transfer groups of prisoners between federal prisons. (The most notorious event being the transfer of prisoners from various federal prisons to the newly built Alcatraz back in the 1920s.) Individual prisoners, especially those being taken to state prisons by local law enforcement, were generally escorted by one or two officers on regularly scheduled passenger trains.
I remember seeing an interesting piece on the History Channel not too long ago about Nazi POW officers in Texas (I think it was Texas). It was just a dramatization but the coach cars they rode on looked like oridanry passenger cars. Interestingly enough while they were at a station stop the POW were singing a song in German but the tune was familar to American ears (I can’t remember the name of the song). It was said that the citizens at the station heard this singing and begain giving these POWs food through the windows, well aware of the fact these were Nazi POWs.
I be darned if I can remember the name of the program this was on, the History Channel runs so many WWII programs, but that’s beside the point.
I’m criminal justice major and we’ve never talked about prisoner transport in all my classes. We usually tackle things like social issues and court procedures. Learning how to be a police officer or corrections officer comes with the training only after a person gets accepted for that job. I’ll tap my resources and see what I can find.
bbaw - (be back after while)
If it wasn’t the Christmas carol “Silent Night”, it was probably “Lili Marlene”, a song popular with soldiers on both sides since World War I.
Of course, there was also a large German-speaking community in Texas that existed since before the Civil War, which opens up a lot of other possibilities.
Sorry about the tangent.
We probably need to see the begining episode of the fugitive. The “prison car” may have been an old coach or combine. If I Remember correct, the coach derailed & that is how a prisoner could have escaped. It would be too harsh & dangerous to connect handcuffs or leg irons to the chair?
Barbarosa, I went to the Pine Bluff Muesum today and took pics of the guard car. It may not be exactly what you are looking for but it is interesting. I just dropped off the pics at Walgreens about 30 minutes ago. This weekend I will have them back and can see about getting them to those people who might like to see them. Anyone interested in seeing them drop me an email and I will email the pics to you.
Jim,it sounds interesting to me,please send a pic or two when you get them back.Thanks,Don
I have the Guard pics back and on disk. Anyone wanting to see them just send me the email addres you want them emailed to.
Thanks,
Jim