Proposed AT & SF Turbine?

Model Railroader Prototype information for the modeler
1

I am looking for more information on the proposed AT & SF turbine, #7000. This is what I have;

~Builder: Baldwin ~Type: Gas Turbine ~Transmission: DC Electric
~Wheel Arrangement: 2-D-D-2 Centipede A unit
~Gross Horsepower: 3750hp (3000hp available for traction)
~Builder’s Number 74072 ~Canceled January 21, 1952

The unit was meant for passenger service, and had an estimated top speed of 100mph.

I have other specs from the Jul-Aug-Sept 1975 Extra 2200 South issue.

Does anyone have any or know from where I can get more info on this unit?

~[8]~ TrainFreak409 ~[8]~

2

Hi, I don’t have any furhter information, but rather a question. Did the turbine ever materialize? I have a Con Cor model and don’t know if it’s prototypical, or what the loco was used for, if ever. Anyone know the real story about the ATSF Turbine?

3

This is new issue for me as well, one could reasonably assume it never left the drawing board, otherwise it would be documented. GE was building Turbines for the UP during this time, but Baldwin Locomotive Works was on the ropes struggling to survive with the demise of steam locomotive orders and the pending Lima-Hamilton merger. I’m surprised SF would consider Baldwin for such a radical design in as much Baldwin diesels being rare on the SF.

Dave

4

The book “Iron Horses of the Santa Fe Trail,” by E.D. Worley, mentions this locomotive in a chapter entitled “Iron Horses That Didn’t Make The Trail.” There isn’t much information – here’s all of it:

“In the late '40s and early '50s, the Santa Fe, working with Baldwin Locomotive Works and the Elliott Company, conceived a gas-turbine locomotive having a 4-8-8-4 (2-D-D-2) arrangement with a single cab. The turbine, to be builtt by Elliott, was to be rated at 3,750 hp. Details on the unit are skimpy, but it appeared that a Baldwin ‘Centipede’ 4-8-8-4 frame and cab were to be used to house the turbine-generator equipment, with a trailing tender to supply fuel, water, and space for auxilliary gear. How it might have looked is shown in sketch based on original data.”

The accompanying artist’s sketch, credited to Dean Hale, shows a Baldwin Centipede A unit in passenger warbonnet paint trailed by one of the Santa Fe’s 16-wheel, 24,500-gallon tenders. No explanation is given as to why a gas-turbine-electric locomotive would need a water supply, if in fact it did. The locomotive was never built so any further details would be speculative. Baldwin built relatively few diesels for the Santa Fe, but it had been the road’s favorite steam builder since the early 1900s, constructing just about every locomotive you’d think of when you think of Santa Fe steam.

So long,

Andy

5

Its a passenger unit.

The water is for the steam heater for steam heating the and air conditioning the cars. I’m sure the tender wouldn’t have the same proportions of water and fuel as a steam engine.

Dave H.

6

Thanks to all for your info, looks like I have a model of the Gas Turbine that never hit the rails. It’s a good thing that I own my ralroad.

7

Oh by the way, it’s longer than a Kato E8 and has 4 sets of 4 wheel trucks - 2 powered and 2 nonpowered. It’s part of the Rail Baron Collection by Con Cor in red & white war bonnet colors.

8

Con Cor made those in a variety of road names. Only Union Pacific(r) ever owned turbines.
The (r) is to protect myself from using thier name without permission,or paying royalties[:(!][xx(]!

9

SP Foamer you have to say Union Pacific only owned Gas Turbines. The N&W, C&O, PRR, Westinghouse, and GE all had steam turbines. There was an article in Trains Classics a while ago about turbine development. [8D]

10

The tender is probably actually for fuel. Gas turbines had a voracious appetite. The UP had tenders for theirs.

11

Please don’t forget the United Aircraft gas turbines that PC, Amtrak, CN, and VIA ran. Also the French gas turbines Amtrack ran and the American copies made later, which the state of NY now owns and is in a fight with Amtrak over the operation. Also Long Island ran a combination gas turbine, 3rd rail electric in the late 1970s early 1980s that was workable but not successful enough to repeat.

Also the “Blue Goose” that Westinghouse built and demonstrated in the 1950s was a gas turbine electric. It was a B+B-B+B like many of the GEs. It operated on a number of railroads before being withdrawn from service.

12

Good catch Anthracite, I had forgotten about the modern turbines and looked the other way.

Another point is that “UP” 50 was not a UP locomotive as it never left GE ownership. The double cabbed turbine was a true experimental.

13

Hey thanks y’all.

The tender probably had a large space for Bunker C. I believe that’s what my Extra 2200 South said it was to run on. And with a 16 wheel tender, that’s a lot of Bunker C.

Another gas turbine, was the Davenport switcher 1149 for the US Army. Not exactly a success.

Andy, is there any where I can get that picture from?

This sounds like a relatively simple modeling project. I think the hardest part would be finding a Baldwin Centipede unit.

~[8]~ TrainFreak409 ~[8]~

14

Sorry Scott,

But the book, “Iron Horses of the Santa Fe Train,” is the only place I’ve ever seen that illustration.

So long,

Andy