After looking on ebay I see that there are alot of mth premier protosound 1 engines for a fairly cheap price. I understand that most proto 1 engines cant be run dcs but besides that are there other issues? They seam like really nice engines to be going for so cheap. the only thing I can assume is that issuea with the old system causes them to be undesirable. Does anyone know? I also read about a conversion kit where you could turn proto 1 engines into proto2. Could someone tell me how much these kits cost and where they could be bought? Thank you.
The main problem with Proto 1 engines is cost facter to convert to PS-2. What you could do is strip the PS-1 system out and run without any command control features if you know how to do that.
Bought a Premier K4 with PS1 for a good price & also bought a Tmcc & sound kit from ERR since I have a Legacy set.
Hate losing the station sounds though.
You could run PS1 locos in conventional using DCS.
Some nice engines can be had for bargain prices as you have seen. I picked up a Hudson and will be installing TMCC in it. It was the perfect MTH product as far as conversions go. As to compatability, not sure. While I have some CW80s I have not run my engine due to the battery issue.
With PROTO 1 engines if the battery gets to low or dies it will scramble the board. If you do get a Proto 1 engine invest in a BCR, this is a capacitor that works off the track power. You need to have the engine on the tracks for about a minute then it will hold the charge for you and you can run it then. Here is a link for you. Hope this helps?
Proto Sound engines can be run by a CW-80 with the following caveats:
The bell will ring constantly unless a lighted car is also on the track.
None of the inherent features of PS can be accessed–station sounds, remote uncoupling, speed control off, etc.
Otherwise, it will be ok.
Unless a PS-1 engine is converted to PS-2, or a BCR is used to replace the battery, it will eventually give you grief, i.e. money and time to repair.
Railking PS-2’s are not expensive (maybe cheaper than converting a bargain-priced PS-1) and are better in every way. The same caveats re the CW-80 would still apply.
I can’t imagine a reason to do that, unless one is already involved with the Lionel system–but then, why bother coverting a PS-1…just buy Lionel engines.
The simplest and most cost effective way to go, IMO, is with a PS-2 Railking loco or starter set, for a digitallly run system. And PS-2 offers more available built-in features, for the conventional operator, than the other systems, though you had made it clear that you are a digitally motivated, future operator.
I have a RailKing Genesis loco with Proto-Sound 1 - and like others have said, the main issue with PS1 is the battery going dead. Once this happens, it scrambles the PS1 chips. I had this problem, and took it to my hobby shop where they installed a BCR and fixed the chips, and now the engine runs perfectly. Also, PS1 sounds are not near as authentic as PS2 - on my Genesis diesel, the horn is about the only thing that sounds like the real engine. But I really like it, it seems to be a workhorse. There really is no need to convert the engines unless you’re going to run them in a lashup, or on the same track with a command loco. Other than that, you can run PS1 engines with DCS in conventional mode. I mainly have Lionel engines, so I’m running my loco with TMCC and a Track Power Controller, and it runs great on it, too. I can also access all of the engines’ features from the CAB-1. Before I had TMCC, I had success running the engine on Lionel’s CW-80 and the older 80 watt transformer (80BW, or something like that) with no problems at all.
So, to make a long story short, don’t be afraid to buy a PS1 locomotive. Just make sure to install a BCR in it so the computer chips won’t be scrambled. PS1 engines are going at such low prices that it’s really a good deal for what you’re getting. PS1 locos are actually well made.
I have not had any trouble running Proto Sound 1 (PS1) Locomotives with a CW-80 transformer, and can even get the proto couplers to work properly, they ues a different sequence than PS-2 couplers do.
PS-2 Locomotives don’t like the chopped Sine Wave current of the CW-80, it confuses the electronics, and are very inconsistent in how they react to the chopped sine current. My PS-2 F-3 runs fine but I can’t access the PS-2 functions such as proto-couplers and station announcements. My PS-2 2-8-0 will blow it’s whistle almost constantly, my AeroTrain is difficult to get to reverse, and my 0-6-0 will randomly do any of these things.
Running PS-1 Locomotives with a CW-80 should not be any problem, so long as you don’t let the battery get weak, which is not a CW-80 related issue. Running PS-2 Locomotives with a CW-80 is unpredictable, and you throw the dice on your own there. While the PS-2 Locomotives don’t like the chopped sine current of the CW-80, it doesn’t seem to damage them any.
I have not had any trouble running Proto Sound 1 (PS1) Locomotives with a CW-80 transformer, and can even get the proto couplers to work properly, they ues a different sequence than PS-2 couplers do.
PS-2 Locomotives don’t like the chopped Sine Wave current of the CW-80, it confuses the electronics, and are very inconsistent in how they react to the chopped sine current. My PS-2 F-3 runs fine but I can’t access the PS-2 functions such as proto-couplers and station announcements. My PS-2 2-8-0 will blow it’s whistle almost constantly, my AeroTrain is difficult to get to reverse, and my 0-6-0 will randomly do any of these things.
Running PS-1 Locomotives with a CW-80 should not be any problem, so long as you don’t let the battery get weak, which is not a CW-80 related issue. Running PS-2 Locomotives with a CW-80 is unpredictable, and you throw the dice on your own there. While the PS-2 Locomotives don’t like the chopped sine current of the CW-80, it doesn’t seem to damage them any.
With all respect to the experiences of others, may I suggest not using the terms “always” and “never” when speaking of mixing power supplies from one manufacturer with equipment from another.
If one searches the various forums (certainly including this one) he will surely discover that certain combinations work while others won’t. Frequently, there is insufficient specificity as to the actual components being discussed. For example, as I tried to point out in a recent post, there are similar appearing “transformers” known as BW80, CW80 original, CW80 revised, PowerMax and apparently PowerMax Plus. All have been loosely referred to as “CW” or CW80-type transformers. On the MTH side there are certainly PS1 and PS2 systems. Add in the various TMCC, DCS and other systems and the number of combinations is almost endless.
MTH has at least one “transformer compatability chart.” * It is inadequate to resolve these issues, but at least it exists. (See link below.) If nothing else, take it as a caution before spending your hard-earned.
I will never use the terms always or never in this context – it’s all just too complicated. By the way, I have an early steam loco by MTH with PS1 that I have never been able to get to budge with my CW80 transformers, either original or revised, although it always works fine on when powered conventionally by any of my postwar Lionel transformers: ZW, KW, 1033, etc.
Check this link for starters and note the transformers that are not listed. That doesn’t mean they absolutely will not work under some circumstances, but it should raise a yellow flag: