The title is not a question but a comment. All the time I hear that is not protypical for that or railroads do not do something a certain way when I have seen them do it alot. The one thing I regret about being in a club is people who look to see if every little detail is there and if one thing is missing then rant on and on about it.
It is these kind of people that have helped to drive up prices on rolling stock and a Loco’s. That have put this hobby out of reach and not affordabl for those who do not have a decent job in tough times as we are seeing. It is people like this that make it hard for my other family members who want to get into the hobby but the prices are just to high.
So what I have to say may offend you or anger you. I am not sorry to say it does not bug me one bit. Stop your rivet counting. Stop complaining about a unit you see not having the proper horn or missing MU hose. If you do not like it move on. Then these folks have the gonads to laugh at kids who bring in a train engine to run on a layout they cannot afford to build themselvs only to be laughed at and told what they have is junk. Your not a rail fan but a Rail Jerk.
Another thing stop whining when you see a Sd 70 lashed up to 1500. The RailRoads do NOT!!! Follow the so called “Modelers Protypical View” I have seen to many things done by Companies only to hear from people in this hobby say they would never do that.
You are entitled to your opinion, Big Beast. Play with Thomas, and do what you want to do. But please, don’t object to others who want their trains to look right.
Mark I do enjoy thomas the train. The one show on TV using trains to help kids learn you take a pop shot at. I do not object to people who want there trains to look good. However to say your train looks more right then others is a matter of opinion not fact. My problem is people obviously like your self who tear down other people’s stuff every chance they get.
When I detail a train I do my best to make it look good. Does it make it more right then others? No it does not it just shows more parts. I model Muscle cars on the side and from what I have seen 98% of the people who call themselvs Modelers in trains could not model a hub cap. they buy a Train with all the bells and whistles already attached and call themselvs Modelers. Then proceed to tell someone else they did a part wrong. I usually luagh at them and they wonder why luagh. To prove my point The price for Model cars in the past 15 years has gone up maybe 2 or 3 bucks. With trains it has increased almost 2 fold.
Oh yea Mark if you want to live in Protypical fantasy world by all means do so but do not Bash Thomas the Train.
I bought a caboose from the Trainmaster series. I thought I bought a SOO caboose. Now I know I bought a fake. This caboose never existed with SOO. That’s annoying for me !
And if a manufactorer produces a engine with wrong parts I think he does a bad job. It would be not expensive for him to do the job right.Ok, some compromises have made. But that’s another point.
The increase in prices may in part be due to better detail, but the bulk of the increases are really due to RTR and the labor required to assemble the models.
The whole idea of model railroading is to reproduce in miniature a replica of the real thing. That means doing it as acurately as one’s skill level allows. The more you do, the better you get at it. If you allow others to see your work, then you are bound to get some criticism, hopefully it is given in the spirit of helping you to improve your modeling, not to ridicule. If you don’t care to improve, then don’t complain.
It’s called Model Railroading for a reason. Toy Trains is another hobby.
Not that you’re offending or angering me, but if you don’t care that you’ll upset the people who want accurate models by what you are saying, then why should anyone care what you feel about how they bash your models? If you’re not going to take the words that anyone else tells you, then you needn’t start these kinds of threads.
Now in regards to the other stuff you said, if the people who are talking trash about your models belong to the same club you belong to, well maybe you should just leave the club and let them count all the rivets they want. If I were in your position, that is what I would. You need to enjoy this hobby to the level and desire that you want, not to the level or desire your club members (or even people on this forum) want you to be at.
IMO, this hobby is an expensive one but there are others out there that are more expensive yet. If your friends (or yourself) can’t afford the hobby, you might want to tell them (or yourself) to consider another one. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not Daddy Warbucks, but I do know how to budget my income in order to buy whatever train things I may need. My priorities are: my bills, rent, food, college tuition (I’m paying my own way for now), and medical expenses (when I have them); trains are at the very bottom of my list. If money is short for you in these hard times, well you may need to sit down and prioritize in order to make the most of your money; then you’ll see how insignificant trains are.
As far as the pricing goes, well I can say for certain that it’s not the “rivet counters” that are driving the price up. Sure the demand for more accurate models is a cry that m
The “lobby” for higher prototype fidelity is exactly why current models look more like real trains than Tyco “almost-Alcos” and generic 40-foot boxcars that are a blend of USRA and PS1 designs.
I consider myself a rivet counter but have never insulted other people’s work in the manner you describe. Neither have I laughed at anyone for their efforts. I have standards for my own work, but I don’t apply them to yours.
As tempting as it may be to say somthing very clever and condescending here, I’ll leave it alone. Your sorry state is clearly articulated in your choice of wording; you don’t need me to help you feel any worse about yourelf than you already do.
I hope you cheer up someday. But for now, please try not to bring the rest of us down too.
Periodically, we get a thread that the hobby is too expensive. While that has different meanings depending on your circumstances, there are still a number of economy lines available in HO. These aren’t the most detailed and the manufacturer produces one model in a lot of paint schemes, some of which may not be correct, to boost sales. But they will keep the cost down. With discount, prices are under $10 for a freight car and under $100 for a locomotive. Atlas buildings, among others are still pretty cheap as well. You should be able to build a 4x8 HO layout for under $500. This can be spread out, you don’t have to buy it all at once.
While a layout of Athearn, Accurail, Atlas, etc won’t win high praise, it can be well done and provide satisfaction for the builder. Use of paint and scenic elements can make such a layout fairly attractive even if it’s not museum quality. There will always be those who are snobbish because you didn’t spend a lot for a museum model, but you’ll just have to ignore them.
But the hobby’s not free and never has been. Food, shelter, clothing come first. Yes, the economy is not doing well and income/wages for most have not kept up with inflation for several years, but the key to better jobs with better wages is education. That’s even more important these days as low skill manufacturing jobs continue to leave this country.
You know, I keep hearing about these “mean spirited” rivet counters, but in all of my 30 years or so in the hobby, I’ve never met one. I’ve met plenty of people who are intensely passionate about their modeling, as you will in any creative endeavor, but never have I seen or heard anyone disparage a fellow hobbiest’s work just to be mean.
Only if you yourself want those superdetailed models with (if you will excuse the expression) all the bells and whistles!
Not true! If you can’t afford the latest and the greatest just go to your nearest train show! There you can still find Athearn Blue Box locos and shake the box rolling stock from years gone by - and often at very afforadable prices!
As I’ve just pointed out, the so called high price of getting into model railroading is a myth. If you or your family members cant’ find anything but Kato DCC equipped full sound SD70s, then you are just not looking hard enough.
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So what I have to say may offend you or anger you. I am not sorry to say it does not bug me one bit. Stop your rivet counting. Stop complaining about a unit you see not having the proper horn or mi
This young man makes a valid point, although he presents it somewhat coarsely. Whether you like it or not, or even choose to ignor it, the fact is that at least to a degree so-called rivet counters are indeed more than ever before driving the commercial end of the hobby and, as a consequence, its pricing.
Years back, you would purchase a relatively inexpensive, basic locomotive and detailed it to the specs and degree of detail you wished. Now many, or perhaps most, clamor for models to be as detailed as brass and as a consequence the pricing, particularly of steam locos, has gone astronomical. Yes, some less expensive steamers can be found but they are increasingly only from old stock or secondhand. Look at the prices being charged lately even by IHC for their larger, yet entry-level, steamers.
Another instance of rivet counters driving the pricing of products is through posts on Internet hobby forums. If the manufacturer makes the slightest error in executing a model, they will be torn asunder on these forums for it. Were it not for the Internet, 98% of hobbyists would normally remain unaware of minute errors or minor shortcoming in a given model and would have been perfectly happy with it, h
Really? The rising cost of labour and oil had nothing to do with it? The improvement in quality and additional features played no part in it? It’s all down to “rivet counters”?
If you or your family members don’t have a “decent” job and therefore can’t afford model trains, that’s your fault, and yours alone. It’s got nothing to do with people wanting better models.
No, neither. If anything, what you have to say makes me laugh, because it’s complete and utter nonsense.
Just say this. Its not a job its a hobby!!! I dont care if no one likes me consisting my AC4400 GE demo with a PRR M1b and J1. After all they are mine and I can do what I please with them. It makes this a great hobby to do what you please. Why else would I model the PRR on Cape Cod.
If you’re comparing your “near-enough” model with my accurate model of the same subject, then my saying my train looks “more right” than yours IS a matter of fact. Your opinions on the subject don’t count for much, as they’re based on ignorance, and coloured by your attitude.
You’ve proven nothing, because you’re making an apples/oranges comparison. Have model cars undergone the same improvements in quality and features that model railroads have over the last 15 years? I doubt it.
Sot let me put this to you - if model cars are so much more affordable, and offer so much more in the way of challenges to your modelling skills, why don’t you and your penurious family stick to them? Why persist with model railroads if they make you so unhappy?
This young man makes a valid point, although he presents it somewhat coarsely. Whether you like it or not, or even choose to ignor it, the fact is that at least to a degree so-called rivet counters are indeed to a greater extent than ever before driving the commercial end of the hobby and, as a consequence, its pricing.
Years back, you would purchase a relatively inexpensive, basic locomotive and detailed it to the specs and degree of detail you wished. Now many, or perhaps most, clamor for models to be as detailed as brass and as a consequence the pricing, particularly of steam locos, has gone astronomical. Yes, some less expensive steamers can be found but they are increasingly only from old stock or secondhand. Look at the prices being charged lately even by IHC for their larger, yet entry-level, steamers.
Another instance of rivet counters driving the pricing of products is through posts on Internet hobby forums. If the manufacturer makes the slightest error in executing a model, they will be torn asunder on these forums for it. Were it not for the Internet, 98% of hobbyists would normally remain unaware of minute errors or minor shortcoming in a given model and would have been
You would say that, since his ranting nicely dovetails in with yours about the future of the hobby. But the only point this bloke is made is that he is unable to afford high-quality models because he doesn’t have a decent job, and he has a chip on his shoulder on that account.
Have you not noticed how he pops up from time to time, gives some part of the modelling community a big spray, then sits back to enjoy the bashing and flaming that ensues???
At the moment, that’s your opinion, John. It would only be a fact if you had any evidence to support that contention. But I’ll lay odds you have none…
Yes, John, and you can no doubt can cite specific examples where this occured???
So it’s the newbies fault now, is it? You need to sort your story out and stick to it…
“…but 6” errors in fan diameters (that’s 0.07" on an HO model), a similar degree of sway in the roof of an 85’ passenger car, or the placement of an airhorn on the left instead of the right side of the cab roof, is hardly a matter of earth shaking significance…"
Guess that I have to count rivets now. 0.070 is more than 1/16 inch. I think we’d all say the roof was warped if it swayed that much, and then complain about the model quality.
What’s so sad about giving him some honest advice? I would be giving bad advice if I told him to charge his purchases to his credit card to buy what he needs. If he can’t make it on whatever funds he has coming in, then he should either find a better job or learn to manage his money better. I’m not trying to sound like a financial advisor but there are some people who really don’t know what to do with their money (now this here is really sad): Exhibit A.
So I guess that its the “rivet counter’s” fault that a kit in 1975 was $4.00 and a ready to run model is now $15.00.
I guess they are also to blame that gasoline was 25 cents a gallon and is now $4.00 a gallon, a house that sold for $20,000 now sells for $200,000, that a car that sold in 1975 for $5,000 now sells for $25,000.
I didn’t realize that asking somebody to follow a specific set of plans would create such havoc on the global economy. So by that token, it we go back to TYCO quality models the US economy should perk right back up.
Or maybe its just inflation and actually when you compare apples to apples, a modern, more detailed car or engine is cheaper than the generic kits of the 30 or 40 years ago.