Hi all,
I had a question about Pennsy steam engines 30s-50s. 1) I’ve noticed a red-like color some engine cab roofs were painted as well as the top decks of the tenders…what was the purpose of this if any and what color would I to model?
Thanks!
----Rob
The red is Tuscan Red AFIK.
I honestly don’t know the answer to the graphite question other than perhaps for aesthetics, but more likely the durability of the paint that had to cover metal hotter than that of the boiler cladding. The smoke boxes and fireboxes were danged hot!
The front section of the boiler - the smokebox - was not jacketed on most PRR locos, so they were finished with a graphite/oil mixture which was heat resistant. Ordinary paint would have simply burned off.
Cheers,
Mark.
Guys,
Thanks for the replies!
Mark, Sydney is a great city…my wife taught school as an American exchange student when we were in college (2000) in Perth. We met for a week in Sydney and also traveled to Cairns…great places and great people. ----Rob
Rob,
PRR steam engines were painted Brunswick Green (known officially as Dark Green Locomotive Enamel, or DGLE), a shade of green so black it may as well have been black. From Jerry Britton’s Keystone Crossings website (http://kc.pennsyrr.com) we have two suggestions:
“Testors Enamels: to a new bottle of Black, add 1 bee bee and Brunswick Green paint to the top, mix well.” – Greg Martin
“Polyscale: DGLE is okay, but a represents an oxidized, weathered color. Add steam locomotive black for a newer look.” – Bruce Smith.
Tender decks and slope sheets were often (but not always – this was inconsistently applied) Freight Car Color (FCC), which from the same site is given as:
“Freight Car Color 1930’s - 1 part (50%) Poly Scale Zinc Chromate Primer to 1 part (50%) SAL Orange – Bob Johnson PRRT&HS Paint Committee”
“Freight Car Color 1930’s - 4 parts Scalecoat Illinois Central Orange to 1 part Oxide Red – Bruce Smith PRRT&HS Paint Committee”
“Freight Car Color 1940’s - 2 parts (66%) Poly Scale Zinc Chromate Primer to 1 part (33%) SAL Orange – Bob Johnson”
“Freight Car Color 1940’s - 50% Poly Scale Special Oxide Red to 50% Zinc Chromate Primer – Bruce Smith”
“Freight Car Color 1950’s - 100% Poly Scale Zinc Chromate Primer – Bob Johnson
PRRT&HS Paint Committee also: Greg Martin”
“Freight Car Color 1950’s - Elden Gatewood PRRT&HS Paint Committee also: Douglas Nelson”
The cab roof was painted with a mix of black and FCC which varied from shop to shop. Generally, the cab roof should be several shades darker (up to 50%) than the tender deck.
It should be noted that while all locomotove classes (except switchers such as the A5 and B6 classes) may have received this paint (red roof and tender deck) up to World War Two, after WWII it was sort of a crap shoot.
PRR Steam locos were not all DGLE, The Tender Frame, Pilot and Trailing Truck Wheels and frames, Tender Trucks and wheels, Remainder of coal space, Engine Walkways, Wood Pilot Beams were painted black (Steel pilot beams were green). The Tender Slope sheet was also painted FCC along with the tender deck. The cab roof was painted with one coat of FCC, a second coat of 50/50 black with FCC and a third coat of 25/75 FCC and Black.
The firebox was also painted with Graphite Paint. I prefer using Scalecoat Graphite and Oil for this along with the smoke box.
The cab sashes were painted an orange/red color also.
This is from memory on what was painted what color, I don’t have my painting guide handy.
Rick
To clarify, you do mean just that portion of the firebox below the running boards and the side of the ashpan, right? That’s the part I paint to match the smokebox.
Mark (and Rob), the graphite finish on smoke- and fireboxes was common to most all railroads which did not lag (insulate) the smokeboxes or fireboxes of their steamers. The practice came about as a rust preventive, because paints of the day would not stand up to the heat of these areas, and would burn off. A bare metal smokebox or firebox will begin to rust almost immediately. A mixture of graphite and oil could be brushed on, and the oil would soon evaporate on being heated, leaving the gray graphite coating, which prevents rusting. The color when freshly applied would vary depending on the proportions of graphite and heavy oil being used at the time. Most roundhouses kept a barrel of the mixture handy, being replenished with a scoop of graphite and/or a bucket of oil as needed.
Dave, that’s right - the portion of the firebox below the running board is the part that is left uninsulated, and which would get the graphite and oil treatment. Not always the ashpan sides, as they do not get as hot as the firebox.
That is correct.
Rick
One problem with “Pennsy Steam” is that many of the photos were black & white making it impossible to tell the true color. Pennsy although it stated it was the “Standard Railroad of the World” should have said it was standard most of the time.
I try to find a color photo of a particular locomotive first. Having found that I go on to copy the color scheme. If I can’t find any documentation other then the black & white photo then I use locomotive black. The choice is up to you.
Doc