Hello, I’m adding a pier to my layout and before pouring WS Realistic Water I would like to know if :
Once the Real Water has hardened can I safely remove the pier to relocate it somewhere else in the future?
Thank you and have a nice day [;)]
Most of the products used to model water will bind pretty tightly to whatever they are poured into and around. WS water is a bit softer than epoxy products like Envirotex.
Are you planning to remove the pier shortly after pouring the water? Or is this looking way ahead to a possible future re-use of this pier?
I’d imagine that a plastic pier would be easier to separate from the WS water later. A plaster pier would be hard to remove without damaging it. You might try using some plastic wrap (like Saran Wrap) or even Scotch tape as a barrier around the pier so the WS water can’t bind to it.
I agree with Mister Beasley. Once that water hardens enough to stay where you put it, anything placed in it isn’t going anywhere without a lot of effort on your part. I placed some figures in it, and did manage to salvage them by paring the polymer off with a hobby knife, but I wrecked the paint and some of the detail, and had to sand it down and repaint it.
I used this stuff and it is pretty permanent. I placed a row-boat on the water after it had cured for a few months and even the “hardened” water got a real grip on the boat. It solidifies but doesn’t fully harden, and dust sticks to it (Is there anything less realistic than dusty water?).
As a product, I’m less than thrilled with it.
Hello, thanks for the infos; the pier is made out of balsa wood so I guess that if I ever want to redo my layout I would have to cut out the piece of plywood where the pier lies to reposition it on the new layout…
This is my first layout and after reading comments from veteran modelers, it will certainly not be my last…
I was just thinking a little ahead of time, because when I expand my present layout (9’ x 12’) I’ll be doing things differently, and it’s OK because it’s part of a learning process.
Once again thank you all for your comments and advice, they are much appreciated.
Have a nice day [;)]
Hi Serge,
I poured my harbour with this stuff a couple of months ago. After it had hardened for several weeks I placed a little barge on it and a speedboat ( Osborne kit). Well neither of them are going anywhere now as they are firmly stuck to the ‘water’.
I put a little Noch dinghy down a few weeks ago and have to lift it off every few days as it starts to get stuck down.
Next time I think I’ll use a different product for water.
CN Charlie
Hello Charlie, thank you for the additionnal infos.
You mentionned using a different product next time, can you elaborate a little bit more on the subject because I havent poured anything yet for my harbour scene.
Thanks.
Serge,
I might try Envirotex. Mister Beasley says it is harder and that would actually be better in my opinion. I believe he has used it and so perhaps he can give you more first hand advice.
CN Charlie
Yes, I’m a fan of Envirotex. It was the first and only “water” product I’ve used.
First recommendation: Get an on-line coupon from Michaels or A.C. Moore, the craft supply places. Pretty much every week, they have a coupon good for 40% off of one item. I bought the larger package of Envirotex, (Envirotex Lite, actually) which has a list price of around $35, so that coupon saved me a considerable amount of money.
Envirotex is a 2-part epoxy. It hardens in about 24 hours. The package I bought has been in my workroom for a few years now, and it still works just fine, so the shelf life is good and there’s no need to use it all at once.
I do several thin pours. If you pour Envirotex too thick all at once, it will develop bubbles that will harden permanently. I also tint each layer, getting progressively lighter from bottom to top. I add a drop or two of cheap acrylic craft paint to an ounce or two of mixed Envirotex. This gets rid of the “clear as glass” look and makes the water look deeper.
Both of these water scenes are about a half-inch thick at their deepest, done in 3 or 4 pours. The larger “bay” was painted in darker colors, and I used darker tints as well.
The WS water is a “self curing” product, meaning it’s supposed to close up around things. Even in its hardened state, it’s still really a fluid.
My son placed a “Surfing Phineas” in the middle of a pond on my layout, and it did stick. When I pulled it off, about a week later, there was an impression of the bottom of the surfboard in the surface. That went away after about a week.
Yes, it does attract dust, but it can also be wiped clean with a lint-free rag and some all-purpose cleaner.
Some other options: Envirotex resin, as mentioned above, competing producst from Scenic Express and Noch, to name two (I don’t know how different these are from the WS product), Minwax Polycrylic polyeurethane, artists gloss medium.
Hello, thank you all; I really appreciated the additionnal infos.
Almost every saturday I go to meet “The Guys” at the LHS, this is an issue I will bring up and see what comes out of it.
I like to see what I get into so if one of the guys used WS Realwater or Envirotex, I’m gonna ask them if I can check it out on their layout.
Serge,
I am in the same dilema as you and here is what I have done so far. I made a couple of samples of my harbor using plywood painted the colors (also testing colors here?) and used WS Real Water, Thick Clear Gel (from Hobby Lobby) and DAP 3.0 Crystal Clear Silicone. I plan to try Gloss Medium Gel and maybe Envirotex resin before I decide which to use on the real harbor (which is about 3’ x 5’). So far, WS Real Water is out of the running as is the Clear Silicone (although it make a very realistic water, I don’t like the sticky feel to it after weeks of curing). The Thick Clear Gel (I don’t remember the actual name of this) is my favorite so far. It dries hard and clear but needs several coats and I haven’t tried to make waves on it yet.
I would suggest you try some samples like I am and decide for yourself. I have heard pros and cons about the WS Real Water and MY OPINION is not what others say. You really need to try these products out. I don’t want to make a big mistake on my final harbor scene; it is going to be a highlight of my layout.
Bob
Hello Bob, I agree with your way of doing things, I’ll certainly do sample tests with different products and make my choice accordingly.
I don’t want to mess it up, the Pier is a Campbell kit and it was built by a veteran model railroader, I would not like to deceive him (and myself) by using the wrong product as far as looks are concerned.
Thanks for your advice Bob.
An option for preserving the pier would be to put it up on a low base, like a piece of painted plywood, so that the water material would not actually touch the pier. You could even use a rock casting for this.
scribbelt, here’s another product you may want to try. After less than satisfactory results with WS water, I used Magic Water and am very satisfied with the results. DJ.
!(http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm237/GrampysTrains/Hammer Creek/P1040141.jpg)
Serge,
One of the other posts mentioned putting your Pier model on a thin sheet of plywood could be a good solution. By mounting your finished model on 1/4" plywood and finishing the plywood to match your water on the harbor, you could make it removable (sort of?) should you need to remove it later on. You could finish the seams around the plywood so it blended in with the rest of the water. This would require making the water surface level match the water surface level of the 1/4’ plywood. Just mount the 1/4" plywood with temporary adhesive or fasteners from below. I guess the easiest way to do this is to add 1/4" plywood to the harbor surface except where your pier model is to be mounted, and then drop the pier into this recessed area. This way you would at least have a fighting chance of removing it without destroying the piers. I hope I didn’t confuse you with this suggestion but it makes sense to me if you are concerned about saving the pier model in the future.
Bob
Hello, once again thanks a lot for the additional sugestions, and as always you guys really are a BIG HELP.
I will follow your advice regarding the pier emplacement on a thin piece of plywood, I am sure I’ll be able to camouflage the joints with water ripples or stones.
Now regarding the product itself, well I guess I’ll have to test them all to see which one I like best.
I’m a student attending the Model Railroading classes and I still have a lot to learn…
Thank you and have a nice day [;)]
For the dust collector non hardening reasons (mentioned by others), I would never use WS water. I prefer Magic Water, which is a two-part resin and hardener. If the piers are made of balsa wood, why don’t you just snip them off at water level, or placethe footings on top of the hardened water. My saw mill pond gives the impression of the murky pond water. Strangely, the logs stayed in place for three years, and then the water started to curl up and had to be replaced. Bob Hahn
I prefer to use “Magic Water” that is a two-part resin and hardener. If the footings are made of balsa wood, why don’t you ,merely, snip them off at the water level and either place the pier on to of hardened water, or repour the water around raised footings. Bob Hahn
For large harbors, I would suggest the use of “door window plastic” with a small random raised pattern, that resembles harbor water when dark blue-green is painted on the smooth bottom side. When scribed, it can be broken into straight line form of the (hidden) harbor sides. Here is a small view of one corner of a 3’x5’ harbor. Click on photo to enlarge it. Bob Hahn 