Is HO and OO same scale? a friend was trying to tell me they are exactly the same … however i dont know for sure please let me know
thanks Hobojim
Nope: HO 3.5mm=1 foot, OO 4mm=1 foot. Gary
Doesn’t the confusion result from the fact that although they are different scales, they both run on HO gauge track?
Our cousins across the pond use OO scale which is 1/76 (oh oh - maybe 1/72?) at any rate, HO is 1/87 (I’m sure of that!), but they both run on the same track!! I’ve used some British stuff in the past - Airfix used to import a lot of it - most of it is OK, but don’t put figures of the two scales next to each other - if the HO guy is 6’ tall the OO guy will be avout 6’8" - OK if he’s painted to look like Shaquile O’Neil!! [swg]
THAT confusion arises because there is something called HO/OO, 1:76 scale models running on 16.5mm gauge track instead of the more accurate 18.88mm gauge. The reason goes back into model railroading history in the United Kingdom, where the larger scale was needed to wrap reasonably accurate superstructures around the mechanicals of early HO frames/power assemblies. The result is that the models are accurate for OO scale, riding track that is too narrow. (Much of the difference is made up by wider-than-prototype wheels, thicker-than-prototype side rods and larger-than-prototype clearances.)
A somewhat similar situation confronts me in my own modeling. HOj mates 1:80 scale (which is, as far as I know, used only for models of Japanese prototypes) with 16.5mm track gauge. The end result is a model 9% larger than HO riding rails too widely spaced for the prototype’s 1067mm gauge (which scales to 13.34mm.) In recent years, some attempt has been made to redress the balance with wheels gauged to 13mm, and even 12.5mm - allowing for the same over-prototype thickness issues I addressed earlier.
Of course, now that On(watchamacallit) is running 1:48 models of 36" gauge prototypes on scale 30" gauge track, American prototype modeling is plummeting into the same abyss…
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - 1:80 scale, 16.5mm gauge)
Shaq is over 7’. Terry Bolleau is 6’8". You may know him as Hulk Hogan. Sorry you OO fans out there, I’m only 6’4" and they don’t make a replica of me in any scale.
A problem UK modellers had is that compared to their US counterparts, British equipment is about 1/8th smaller, so a tiny motor (for 1930) that would fit in a US HO engine was too big for an HO UK engine. So they made the linear scale bigger, 4mm = 1 ft instead of HO’s 3.5mm = 1 ft, but using the same HO gauge track. Some UK modellers have gone to the full track gauge in fine scale modelling, but most continue to use the “hybrid” OO scale.
Be sure and order the matching OO basketballs, from LimeycraftsUK.com. [:-^]
It is a bit complicated. American OO had track gauge to match the scale; Lionel had some OO in the 1940s for example. Scalecraft was another major manufacturer.
There are some British modelers who have OO scale with correct gauge track (most of them are also fine scale standards types) but more use the hybrid OO/HO.
There cannot be many American OO scale modelers left, although from time to time one sees the models at swap meets and they are just close enough to HO that one could be fooled unless you see an accurate HO model nearby. It was pretty much a coin toss at one time as to whether HO or OO would prevail.
Dave Nelson
It’s a good size to model with, but I do wonder why the originators mix metric with Englsh to arrive at the scale. 3.5mm / foot is close to 1/8" / foot. It would be easier if it was 1/8" / foot.
Perhaps the makers of scale rules endorsed it to increase sales.
Well Marklin set up the first gauges: 1-2-3-4 with 4 being the largest. This was toy train stuff so they didn’t really worry about setting the scale, just the gauge. No.1 gauge track is best known now as what LGB models run on, but true no.1 scale is 1:32.
When Marklin added a smaller gauge they had to call it “zero” gauge, written 0 gauge…which in the US at least was mis-read as the letter O so we call it “Oh gauge”; and instead of using the correct 17/64" = 1 ft., generally use a slightly undersized (but easier to work with) 1/4"=1ft, so the 1=1/4" track scales out to 5 ft. instead of 4’ 8-1/2". In Europe as I understand it the more common scale for O gauge was 7mm = 1ft which is 1:43.55 ratio. Cut that in half and you get “Half O” (HO) scale, 3.5 mm = 1 ft., 1:87.1 ratio.
Or something like that…!!
yes this is really interestig how all the deferent scales come about or what ever. Now that brings me to what I had as a kid what was or is as I remember O27 I know the O buy what the 27?
O-27 track creates a circle 27" in DIAMETER measured to the OUTSIDE of the tie ends. It also has a lower rail profile and slightly smaller joining pins than Standard O track. O-27 PROFILE track is also available in O-42, O-54 and O-72 curves. O-27 track also has available O-27 and O-42 turnouts. O-27 straights are also generally shorter than Standard O track straights. O-27 track, and the trains that run on it, which are generally smaller, were produced to lower the price of the economy sets.
Standard O track has a taller rail profile, and the “standard” curves are O-31, O-42,O-54 and O-72, with many others also available. Standard O turnouts “Standard” turnouts are O-31, O-42 and O-72, but again many other sizes are also available.
O-27 and Standard O Gauge track, are the same GAUGE, and the Locomotives and rolling stock will operate fine on either, so long as the minimum curve is adequate for the equipment being run, just like any other scale/gauge. O-27 is a smaller PROFILE (think code 70 or 83 HO Scale) Standard O is a taller PROFILE (think code 100 HO Scale)
It should be noted that in 3-Rail track curves referred to as “O-ANYTHING” it is measuring the DIAMETER of the curve, NOT THE RADIUS, as is the standard in most other scales, but there is some descrepancies between manufacturers as to where the measurement is taken, O-27 is pretty universally measured at the tie ends, but in O-Gauge (Standard O) some measure the diameter between track centers, some to the outside rails, and some to the tie ends.
Standard O, also should not be confused yet with “Standard Gauge”, which is even larger than G Scale, which is properly known as #1 Gauge, if referring to the actual gauge of the track. “Standard Gauge” track has a gauge of 2 1/8". I believe that Gauge #1 track, has a gauge of 1 3/4".
The reason that Joshua Lionel Cowen developed 3-rail track back in 1906, is so
I always wondered why the scales of modeling don’t correspond with each other. Model cars in 1/24, 1/25, 1/32, 1/43, 1/64 etc. doesn’t correspond to model train scales for the most part.
Why can’t manufacturer’s standardize scales?
Rotor
Hi Rotor,
Actually, You picked all the wrong scales for your post. I forget the “Scale” designations, but 1/24 and 1/32 are scales within the #1 gauge “FAMILY” I think that 1/22.5 and 1/24 are used in #1 gauge to model european metre gauge, and 1/29 and 1/32 are used in #1 gauge to model “American Standard Gauge” with 1/20.3 used for American 36" narrow gauge in #1 gauge. I have also read that LGB also did some 1/25 as well as their 1/22.5 and 1/24 scales in #1 gauge.
1/64 is “S” Scale proportions, and 1/43.5 is the proper scale for British O-Scale(which this is the O, that HO is half of) American O is scaled at 1/48. the models proportioned to 1/76 are scaled for British OO Scale.
This does leave the 1/72 that is common in airplane models that doesn’t corelate exactly to a scale that other models use, but is reasonably close to the 1/76 of British OO trains.
Doug
Chuck, you amaze me! What I know in generalities, you know in specifics, time and time again!
Mark
Mark - [:I]
Would you believe that I totally forgot that US O gauge is also a scale-gauge mismatch? In 1:48 scale, 1.25mm is 5’0" (only appropriate if the model is of something that ran in the Confederate States prior to 1886.)
Thirty-plus years ago, MR reported on the transmogrifications of an O gaugee steam loco that at one point changed from a heavy Pacific to a light Pacific. The “modification” was that the owner “converted” it from 1:48 to 1:43.5 (European O or ‘Q’ scale.) In the process, he corrected the track gauge.
Fun, isn’t it.
Chuck (modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
I’m late to this party. I think OO scale has been covered pretty well. I’ll just add that modelers in the UK do most scales differently than we do here in North America. I have a short article on Scales and Gauges in the UK which some of you may find of interest.
Best!