And does the railroad car used to haul this product need to be specially equipped? Say, with shackles maybe?
Jeff
Portable Soylent Green processing?
What’ll they think of next?
oh…I know…
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/body-double-lifelike-android-demoed-futuristic-conference-040139620.html
Railroads routinely carry all manner of military hardware and materiel, all over the country. That includes tanks and other artillery.
As mentioned, railroads routinely carry methyl ethyl death, again, all over the country.
Several military arms depots are/were served by rail, with the very real possibility that such arms included nuclear weapons.
As for the example of a machine that would cause human misery - I would opine that the railroad might not even know what they are carrying - unless it is specifically identified as such. If the shipping papers accurately say “machinery” and there is nothing to indicate the true use, who’s to know?
Machinery in a sealed container, as long as it meets weight requirements, would not likely garner suspicion unless someone tipped the railroad off that the contents were morally objectionable. Even then, unless public opinion would damage (figuratively or literally) the railroad, who cares?
I may scream if it turns out to be an Auto-Max car!
Seriously, railroads will have discussions with shippers who do not properly load their cars (overloaded or otherwise improperly loaded, causing shifting or falling hazards), or who need to work on their loading sites to make them safe for their crews or subsequent operations (when I was working, we would often report tallow tank cars with wheels so greasy that they could not be slowed down in our retarders…there were also some powdery substances that caused the same problem).
Shippers are responsible for the cleanliness of cars that they empty out, and are required to close the plug doors on box cars before a crew can accept them. I had to remind a few people of that fact, too, as I’ve seen doors roll violently enough to run off the ends of their tracks–plug doors may be safer than they once were, but I’d still hate to have one fall on me!
Customers are required by law and regulations to properly identify their shipments( placards, type of rail car, etc.). A customer who deliberately misidentifies a shipment is committing a crime, and is liable for civil and probably criminal (jail time) prosecution.
Get a copy of 49 CFR (the DOT part of the Code of Federal Regulations,) and start reading. The requirements that shippers must comply with is too long for me to list here.
It is not the railroads responsibility to determine if a shipper has complied with the applicable regulations; this is what federal and state inspectors do. Obviously, if a railroad discovers that a shipper is fraudulently identifying shipments, the railroad has a responsibility to notify the appropriate government agencies. It will then refuse to accept these shipments.
One way to do it is to have a “Rules Circular” (used to be a “Rules Tariff”) Every time you establish a rate make sure it somehow references back to those rules.
In the rules circular put an item for “Articles not accepted for movement on rates referencing this rules circular”. List as broadly as possible the stuff you don’t want to haul. Human remains, hazardous waste, live animals, household goods, etc. Now your “Freight, All Kinds” rates, and all other rates, don’t apply on what you’ve listed. Unless there is a screw up, such shipments will be refused because there is no rate.
If the potential shipper contacts you and ask you to establish such a rate, just say “We don’t haul that.” Cite your own rules circular. By now you’ll have most of them flummoxed and they’ll go away.
However, and unfortunately, the government can, and will, force the establishment of such a rate. A while back the Union Pacific refused to establish a point to point commodity rate on a chlorine movement. The railroads really would like to get out of hauling TIH stuff. The potential shipper went to the STB and the UP was ordered (You WILL OBEY!) to establish the rate. So the UP came back with something like $30,000/car. The potential shipper screamed bloody murder. I don’t know what happened after that.
We wouldn’t haul hazardous waste in intermodal service. There was no control of where the trailer went after it left the destination ramp. We had a very valid reason for the prohibition (the waste could end up anywhere) and I think we could have defended the restriction if Big Brother got involved.
One Chicago area firm got its mammary glands in the wringer. They were processing used photo film to recover something. Silver IIRC. Anyway, the processing made the used film hazardous waste. They were
Simply stated - NO. Note the item I marked in red. Railroads are common carriers, not part of the judicial system or the legislature. Also, without its appropriate ammunition, even a Barrett Cal .50 sniper rifle that can deliver a bullseye at 2.7 kilometers is nothing but a heavy, awkwardly-shaped club.
There’s also the little detail that almost anything can fatally injure humans. One reason we (USAF technicians) were hyper-careful about making sure that things don’t fall off aircraft is the possibility that the loose screw or stripped nut might impact some innocent bystander - with about the same energy as that Barrett round will deliver.
As others have said, if the material is properly identified, properly packaged and the appropriate fees have been paid, the railroad HAS to accept it. It has also been noted that a shipper who falsifies content or fails to package the stuff properly can find himself in a world of legal hurt - even if nobody is injured in any way. When it comes to what’s listed on the waybill, there won’t be any bait and switch involved unless somebody really wants to meet a judge - from the defendant’s table.
My humble abode is not too far from a busy railroad and an even busier Interstate - which parallel ea
Here we are again. Moderators will squash discussions of grade crossings and crew fitness requirements but allow the totally insane, such as Falconer to post repeatedly.
Moderators, this man is not entertaining. He makes absolutely no rational point re: the rail transportation industry.
Enough is enough.
We get it. The topic and/or poster don’t meet your standards. You expect the moderators to read your post (and your mind) and do what you think is neccessary? I’m not certin that the moderators have been monitoring this thread simply to make sure that you’re happy.
What did the moderators say, when you contacted them, and pointed out how the thread violated the forum policies?
That’s, like, your opinion, maaaan…
On the lower left hand side of any post here there is a little icon that is in the form of a triangle…it is for reporting abuse…if you feel the post is that bothersome…use it instead of posting a potentially abusive post yourself…roight?
You mean, like shipping cigarettes?
Who is defining the substance as being toxic or otherwise dangerous? If 49CFR does not so define it, the shipper does not–and better not–describe it as being dangerous. It is six and a half years since I have been concerned with the shipment of hazardous materials, but I have memory of the regulation that you describe your shipment as being hazardous only if 49CFR declares it to be, or else you are in trouble.
If you think that something that is being shipped is hazardous but is not so defined, take the matter up with those who are in authority over hazardous shipments.
Still curious what the OP was referring to in starting this thread.
Amtrak Passengers should be Hazmat… Humans diseases spread by migration have killed more then then all the Hazmat spills combined.
There are numerous Agricultural-Chemical revised compounds that are no longer what the big companies claim they are shipping.
When the customer is willing to pay Millions of Dollars to the transportation company, there must be no responsibilty or liablity on the transport company to ever know how the end product is used or who it used upon. The Customer is always the boss.
The railroad workers are supposed to be servants who do not get involved in what the smart people in management have planned. You have to follow orders without questioning the end result. The people who are presidents and board members know what is best for the country.
Employees are not paid to think or question what the end result is. Employees are paid to take any direction. Everyone has to maintain a narrow focus on their job.
Eventually they want to replace most employees with automation. It means that no one can ever get involved.
Andrew
Conspiracy 101
The shackle cars, the black heilo’s - it all comes into focus
[banghead]
Any years ago a columnist in trains magazine suggested operations mgrs would love it when no products were sent but they could still generate revenue …sounds like a plan…
Awe come on now. You’re just taking a really broad, unfounded, nasty swipe at the entire railroad industry. Shame on you.
What you describe sounds like the outline for some episode of an unbelievable TV show.
I have to believe that railroad employees are no different than any other group of employees. Most want to do a good job, and do what’s right. The picture you’ve painted is not fair or accurate.
Agriculture-chemicals. Like what? Specifics, please.