ranking manufactures locos by quality...

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

if someone could just give me a quick crash course here on the various manufacturers quality levels from bottom to top, bottoming at athearn BB’s and topping with, lets say overland brass models, and a quick couple or few reasons why on each… for instance, here is my experiance as of now…

athearn BB’s… first step up above toy loco’s. dual flywheel drive, ok details.

athearn rtr… don’t own any, but look to have slightly more detail than the BB’s, including partially modeled cabs, grab irons. don’t know about the drive, but assume it to be as good or slightly better… perhaps someone could clarify?

athearn genesis… to rtr what rtr’s are to bb?

bachmann spectrum… seem to be somewhere between athearn RTR and genesis.

Proto 2000… bought an E6A at the amherst show and it is the best model I have owned. details amazing, great drive mechanism, mars light modeled on DC. just nice.

so, really, how do all of the above rate against Kato units, the various Atlas models (silver, gold?) and various brass imports out there? anyone feel like breaking it down for me?

2

Erf.

One man’s junker is another’s Gold Standard in all of Hobbydom.

I have a pair of Atlas RS-1’s in the Classic. They are keepers and slated to recieve the DCC and Sound installations at some point in the future. Im still experiencing cowardly feelings at the thought of actually smoking a decoder or frying a speaker.

Broadway Limited can do no wrong. But programming all of the stuff possible in thier engines takes a week and then some. If I get off and stay off these forums I might actually get my set done by friday.

Roundhouse has a cute 4-4-0 with dual mode DCC and SOund recently released. I just finished programming it and look forward to actually trying to run a train with it. It is not much of a engine … almost like a “Runt” begging for food at your doorstep. But it has been a keeper due

3

I have Athearn Genesis F’s which I think are very, very well done.

Then BLI & PCM have delivered some outstanding models as well with nice paint jobs and just well crafted.

One of the most detailed and well crafted Locos have to be from Tower 55. I know they have not a wide variety of engines so far but the GEVOs look simply incredible and they also work like this.

On a side note: I have received great Customer service from both BLI/PCM and Tower 55 which is also a good selling point.

4

I have examples of all that you list and you are about right on.

My favorites out of those listed are the Athearn Genesis F3 Freight Engines I have and the new Proto 2000 E8’s with DCC/Sound that I just bought.

I have a few Atlas Units, One Gold Dash 8-40CW that is juts wonderful. Very good Sound quality and fabulous detail bits and pieces.

I have two Silver Series GP40’s with the Atlas Decoders. They are modeled after a local Railroad and match up to engines I’ve seen in the yard locally. They are fine runners.

I used to have a lot of fun running my Proto 2000 Switch engines. That was until I bought an S1 USAF Swticher that Atlas came out with last year. The weight and pulling power of this mighty mite is so nice. Slow speed ops are what they should be, slow and very smooth. It is a pleasure to use in Yard Mode.

As to some of the better stuff like the Tower 55 stuff. I have not seen or run any of those. I would expect them to be near brass quality, but what would I know…I own no Brass.

I like massive Dash 8’s and old E7 and E8’s. What I have on my layout I am very pleased with and get a lot of enjoyment out of them. Even my used E8’s that are about 8 years old I enjoy on my DC layout. Their heft and handsome looks are more than enought to keep me happy.

Chris

5

Atlas silver for straight D.C. or decoder-do-it-yourselfers; Atlas Gold for those in D.C., or D.C.C. for those who want everything right out of the box.

Athearn BB would be the baseline for the do-it-yourselfer.

Athearn RTR is basically a BB that has been assembled, with some painting done to the window frames, and some are now D.C.C. ready with a JST9 pin connector, plus the eight pin furrels if one wanted to solder a decoder in. (Actually, I threw their circuit board away, and hard wired the decoder in, and installed the L.E.D. lights) But anybody converting one of these over to D.C.C. will want to modify the lighting arangement as they still come with that only one lightbulb shining in the cab. There are no grab irons, although the shell has the dimples cast in, so locating and drilling the holes for grab irons wouldn’t be a problem. The motor, though still open frame- it has been improved so the current draw is not nearly as bad as it was with older BBs. Fresh out of the box, the trucks will have to be dis-assembled and lubed because they will be lacking grease. Sure, one can take the shell off and look down at the gears, and see that they are wet, but the spindles that the gears rotate on will be dry to the bone.

6

The bottom ranked locomotives in my collection are the 2 Model Power Hustler’s that I have.

Next are the Bachmann’s of which I have 10, of those 4 are DCC.

Next are the Athearn BB’s of which I have 14, 1 is DCC.

Athearn Genesis a 4-6-2, great detail but it’s always had problems.

Next up, Proto 2000, of which I have 4 An E6, E8, GP30 and a PA1. None are DCC, yet.

7

Like-Like / Model Power / Bachmann (toys)

Athearn BB

Walthers Trainline

Proto 1000

Athearn RTR

Bachmann Plus (older pre-Spectrum, but you can still find them)

Bachmann Spectrum

Athearn Genesis

Proto 2000

I don’t own any other brands of engines, so I can’t rate them.

8

Top to bottom of the ones I own or have owned

BLI - steam or diesel doesn’t matter. Great running, great looks, great sound. Doesn’t get any better.

Trix - Just have one Mikado but looks and runs great. Sound not quite on par with BLI

P2K - E8s I am very happy with. Outstanding sound. I just got a Berkshire that I am having trouble with. I need to check the manual to see if I plugged in in correctly. This was an older model without sound that I bought at discount.

Bachmann Spectrum - Run good and look good. Need sound. It looks like Spectrum is going to be offered with sound soon. Doesn’t help with the four steamers I need to upgrade.

Athearn Genesis - Have one Mikado, no sound. Runs well, looks good although the detail has to be installed by the modeler. Not necessary with the better brands.

P1K - Got a F3 ABBA set. Looks good and runs well. Excellent value. Needs sound.

Atlas - Only have a few older models. Always have been outstanding runners. By today’s standards, need more detail. I haven’t checked out their latest offerings. They need to come out with DCC sound equipped locos. I’d love to build up my diesel fleet with their line if they did that.

Athearn BB - Have a ton of diesels from the 1980s. They were good value for their day but by today’s standards, detail is poor and run just so-so. Hand rails were junk.

Bachmann regular line - Decent looks but terrible runners. Would never buy another.

Life Like - Not sure the original line is even offered anymore. If it is, I wouldn’t touch it. This falls in the junk category.

Model Power - The bottom of the barrel. Nothing good to say about it. I was pleasantly surprised when I saw some of their die cast vehicles. Will buy more.

9

Well ranking locomotives is always base on a modelers givens and taste.Sadly some is solely base on bias thinking and seldom as a fair and like brand comparison…
So,with deep thought based on my observations at the two HO clubs I am a member of…The pecking order from bottom to top.

The newer Bachman locomotives such as the GP30 and GP35 seems to be nice runners and fair lookers for the low prices.These are DCC equipped as well.

Athearn BB and P1K…Both are good models and runners… Some BB locomotives are getting hard to find.

Athearn RTR/P2K/Atlas Trainman.Great medium price range locomotives.

Stewart Great locomotives with limited locomotive selection.

Kato-Same as Stewart.Great locomotives but limited locomotive selection.

Genesis…Top of the Athearn line…Limited locomotive selection.

Atlas.Atlas sets the industry standards and has a medium selection of locomotives.

As far as brass locomotives at the club they are nonexistent except old brass steam locomotives from the 50/60s.

Looking over the selection of different locomotive types being offered Atlas,Athearn(RTR) and Walthers P2K seems to have the widest selection and the most popular brands by choice.

Another line of locomotives is Walthers Trainline…Not bad-no selection.

BLI doesn’t have a large following in this area so I won’t place them in the pecking order…

Bowser,Hobbytown of Boston(Bear Locomotive Works) have their place as well and shouldn’t be overlooked…Smile

10

While I respect your right to your opinion, you are often comparing apples to oranges. First, no one mentions that the better engines are somewhat or greatly more expensive. Second, you are often comparing todays production to stuff from years ago (hardly fair).

Third, there is no way Athearn RTR is all assembled BB. The SD40 was never made before, the GP35 etc are Protopower bodies on new mechanisms(the old ones wouldn’t fit) etc.

Ranking Bachmann Plus anywhere is suspect since Bachmann doesn’t even make them anymore(they were so good?)

BLI has had their share of problems - GG1s and PRR T1s had gear problems, the first F7s were all recalled etc.

P2000 had the famous “gear” in all the early runs, gear ratios are all over the place so they don’t run together.

So what is the point? Point is everybody makes some lemons but there is an awful lot of good stuff if you pony up the bucks. Tryoing to rank by manufacturer is totally flawed since you are talking about many different models (Remember Kato SD40s)

One last thing - I own examples of almost every loco made, even some Model Power and for 9 years I worked for American HO manufacturers .

11

It’s a little hard to say exactly which manufacturer has the best quality without identifying the criteria to measure quality. MR does a fine job of reviewing new models, and you can read their reviews to get a good idea about good manufactures.

I have some old standby Atearn engines that are as trouble free as any with respect to not derailing and not needing much maintenance…

12

I think Brakie has it nailed… I agree down the line with his ranking. He didn’t rank BLI. I would put them right up there beside Atlas. Also not on his list is Intermountain which is fabulous.

The more important point to notice on his list is that he makes positive remarks about every brand he lists. And he’s right. Today’s locomotives are just spectacular (compared with the ones I bought in the 70s). I own some of the “Cheap” DCC Bachmanns and an Athearn BB ($25)… and I love 'em! They run well. They look nice. I wouldn’t give them up.

Having said that, they just don’t compare to my wonderful Atlas, Kato, Intermountain, BLI locos. Those things are absolutely perfect in every way and really a joy to operate. Jsoderq said it: you can’t say an Atlas Gold is better than a Bachmann low-end DCC-equipped without also noticing the difference between $200 and $40.

You get what you pay for. But I don’t think you can buy a BAD engine from the currently manufactured stuff in our hobby today.

13

The only diesel I have is a P2K FA2/FB2 set that looks and runs great, especially with a lowly DSD 100LC decoder in it. If I hadn’t dummied the B unit for a sound box, I am sure it would rip up the tracks behind it.

All my others are steamers, IHC (a Mike), Lionel Challenger, P2K Heritage 0-6-0, a
Trix Mike, and BLI’s - Niagara, K4s, J1d Hudson, 2-10-4 Prr J1, and just yesterday a PRR T1.

At this early stage in my modelling, I find it hard to compare all of them, unless it is the somewhat modest IHC to the rest. For reliable pleasure, it is hard to beat the BLI steamers. I had one decoder replaced under warranty, but all the rest, including two customer returns sold to me from Outlet Direct, have performed admirably. And as for looks…well! I suppose I could add some piping and other things, but that is not what my modelling is all about. I like to watch nice steamers run, so my limits are my roadbed, turnouts, and tracklaying. If they are decent, the steamers look great.

For BLI, it helps if you favour the Pennsy, which I happen to do. It was a smart move for them to include some SP, N&W, NYC, Santa Fe, and C&O in their line-up, but I hope, for their sakes and those of disgruntled modellers, that other roads get some shrift in the next 5 years.

BTW, that PRR T1 is the most drop-dead gorgeous loco I have. I still have a strong soft spot for the mighty J1, but I think I am about to have an illicit affair…[:I] [:O]

14

Cracked gear issue aside, i like proto 2000 drive and operation better than atlas, they have better details also IMO and can run alot slower.

15

Animal,

That’s really difficult to make an across-the-board blanket statement on. Some manufacturers make better and worse locomotives - even within the same product line.

It really depends on the particular locomotive. Not all brass locomotives run like swiss watches and not all cheaper brands run like garbage. It’s contingent on several things. It might be best to break the “quality” points down into specific catagories. For instance:

  • Detailing - shell, trucks, add-ons, paint

  • Mechanism - type, smoothness, quietness, quality

  • Conversion ease to DCC

  • Sound

  • Accuracy to prototype

  • Value
    My guess is that not ANY one locomotive or product line is going to finish first in all four catagories.

Tom

16

Jack,I didn’t rank BLI or Intermountain because simply put they don’t show up at either club.I will not judge and rank a locomotive without seeing it in action at one of the clubs…I simply refuse to go by hearsay -good,bad etc because of what I read on a forum simply because there’s to many loose ends and the biggest is not knowing if the poster is bias against a certain company…

17

If you like the J1 the way it is, you will really be amazed after you replace the QSI sound chip with new one with the alternate chuff sounds and added features. It allows the J1 to start and run below 1 mph.

I ordered and installed the new upgraded sound chips to several of my QSI sound models and appreciated the improved operation and sound.

I have to agree on the J1 being a great model. If you think the model is great, the real ones were even better.

18

These are the brands that I own and without reservation would purchase again.

Atlas, BLI, Stewart (now Bowser Stewart), Walthers/Lifelike P2K and P1K.

For the longest time I was highly predujiced against Bachmann. About a year ago I got one of the Spectrum line Shays. It is a superb engine and runs like a Swiss watch. I am very tempted to try another Bachmann Spectrum steamer at some point.

IHC steam and Athearn Blue Box Diesel kits are excellent value for money and while not at the detail or running level of some of the other makers offer a lot for your hobby dollar.

As others have said, you can not generalize an entire product range as there has been variation from one model to another.

For overall quality I have to give the nod to Atlas. I have never had a problem, they run wonderfully and offer excellent levels of detail.

19

This is a good question that most of us would answer according to our own experience, and I noticed that no two replies are totally alike.

For absolute running qualities, Trix/ Marklin cannot be touched / PCM Comes close

For sound overall with no regard to running qualities = BLI QSI is the best installed at this time. The new Installed Tsunami’s are a limited version and not rated here.

For Detail without comprimise = Any Brass built recently by Samtech / Even better than Ajin builds for Overland. They are the engineers that worked for Samhongsa up to the time the brass portion of Samhongsa was canned.

For Fun and low cost = PCM Big Boys They really run good and a close second to Trix and you can add a Tsunami for less than $400 total.

For rock bottom cost without any accuracy concern + ??? I don/t have any of those but I could name a few from pictures.

For the lightest weight and no ability to pull anything compared to most others?? P2K steam . I am most disappointed with their weight, not their detail.

For the best shelve/Display model every made. The Genesis Challenger and Big Boy.

Just my thoughts for steam models,not diesels and I am sure they are not the same as listed up to now.

A

20

Atlas diesels are about as good overall as any diesel out there.

Did you know they announced their first steam recently??? Now before everyone goes off, it is in O scale. I wonder how long it will be for HO is that one sells great.