Just a rant born of frustration with the on-going lack of scale standards in LS. I just read Rene’s fine article “Garden Railways buyer’s guide to large-scale structures” in the Feb. 2007 issue of GR. On page 94 is a chart showing the various manufacturers and the scales that their products are made to. The majority of the structures are made in 1:24 scale, while only a small handful is available in 1:29 or 1:32 scale. There are some in 1:22.5 and quite a few in 1:20.3. Here’s the point: how many layouts are actually modeled in 1:24? … very, very few. Most are 1:22.5 because most locos and cars are 1:22.5. The 1:20.3 boys can now get a nice scale building to go with their B’mann Connie or Annie but they still have to pull freight and passenger cars that are seriously out of scale (1:22.5). The 1:29 and 1:32 gang now have a plethora of choices in both locos and rolling stock but generally have to settle for buildings that are too big. I’m beginning to think that no one in the industry is paying any attention to what the other guys are doing or what the customers are buying … there, I feel much better now.
Couldn’t agree with you more. While I am very new to this hobby I have been fustrated in trying to select various accessories to go with my construction plans. Seems like everying is either too big or too small to really look good with what I want to do.
Hi Remember it is your garden railway if it looks good to you then that is all that matters. Rember the 10ft rule if it fits in and you like it go for it. No two of us will have the same layout and buildings, if you and I were given the same track and building our two lay outs would be completly differant. If you like thats all that matters[:D]
Step 1: Get the manufacturers to consitently build to their advertised scale. Why Aristocraft builds trains to 1:29, but buildings to a larger but indeterminate scale boggles the mind. Aristocraft’s people are even too large for their trains! Pola–the granddaddy of large scale buildings–seems to have somewhat of a rubber ruler as well. Though marked as 1:22, their US western buildings are well suited to 1:20.
Step 2: Get manufacturers to recognize that what 10 years ago was a fairly amalgamous group of “g-scalers” has started to specialize into more-or-less two separate camps; the narrow gauge folks who are increasingly become very particular to scale, and the 1:29/1:32 crowd that needs smaller buildings to go with their standard gauge trains. “Middle of the road” isn’t going to cut it any more because the market simply has matured.
Step 3: Convince the average garden railroader that a 1:29 scale locomotive really looks out of place when sitting next to a 1:20 station. I don’t know how many times I see photos where a small closet-sized station dwarfs a Big Boy. Okay, there is the “run what you like” aspect of the hobby, but that’s like using S scale buildings on an HO scale railroad. It just looks funny.
Unfortunately, until all manufacturers recognize this diverging trend in large scale railroading, we’re going to have to suffer off-scale products that accurately match nothing. I’m glad to see more 1:29 buildings entering the market, and I sincerely hope folks show their appreciation with their wallets. THAT’s what’s going to convince manufacturers to develop more offerings. Getting back to step 3, we as consumers have to stand up and say THIS IS WHAT WE WANT. It’s happening with respect to our trains. Now, we need to take it to our accessories.
Which is exactly why I vote with my wallet and don’t buy manufactured or kitted structures. They get zero dollars from me until a standard becomes standard, not just a selling point.
Gentlemen… I don’t have a great deal of experience here but what I do know that between the 1870’s and the 1940’s the average door frame increased in size over 4 inches so a house built in 1875 would have what today would be very short doors (5’6" to 5" 8" versus 6’ 8" today) and in overall peak height would be two to five feet shorter than a house constructed to the same style in 1920. Only the very rich would have houses or buildings with expansive spaces and ceilings over 7-8 feet. Until electricity was widely distributed in rural America in the 30’s-40’s ther were not many center ceiling hung lights mostly wall sconces and table lanterns. So in reality a 1:24/1:29 construction would look like an 1880’s home on a 1930’s scene.
I loved what you said mate i didn’t fully understand it but i roughly got the gist of it. Scale is a hard thing to understand and it is impossible to fully inplement.
I belong to the ‘if it looks right then it is right’ camp. I have to say that whichever scale of loco I run - and I have most of them - they all look daft against the scale tree that works out to be about 1000’ high and the 100’ wide flower. And as for them giant birds the size of a 747, well…
True for some buildings, but not others. Victorian era houses (1840 - 1900) are well known for tall ceilings and doors–often taller than contemporary doors. So while some buildings from that era may be smaller than “modern” houses, there are just as many that are larger. Such large houses weren’t just for the wealthy. My ancestors come from modest means, and up until the 1930s always had 10’ or higher ceilings in their houses. I’ve got photos of my nearly-200 year old grandfather clock taken around 1920 when it was still at it’s full 10’ height. Considering it was built in 1810, that’s at least 120 years in 10’ tall rooms.
Commercial buildings–especially those in developing downtowns–tended to have very high ceilings, at least on the first floor. Doorways were sized to match, often close to the 8’ mark.
That’s the primary reason it’s important to be able to look at key architectural elements of a structure when determining whether it’s suitable for your railroad. If a scale figure is staring face-to-face with the doorknob, then there’s a good chance the building is too large for the trains. If a person has to duck to get through the door, then it may be too small.
If you’re modeling 1:29, a 1:22.5 Pola station will be 30% larger in scale than the trains. What should be a 6’ door scales out to nearly 9’! Even with the “smaller buildings” argument, that’s just a huge difference in scale. The 1:29 crowd deserves to have properly scaled buildings. There are a few, but not many.
The 1:29 offerings in locos and rolling stock have multiplied significantly in the last five or so years. It seems like a logical extension to these manufacturers that they produce buildings (of a more modern nature, BTW) in the same scale.
I for one DO model in 1/24…And yes it is partly because that’s what scale the affordable cars and buildings are. It also makes the math easy. The fact that the track is now 42" gauge instead of 3 foot doesn’t bother me in the least.
I have to wholeheartedly agree with your post. With buildings though, I have found that I enjoy scratch building structures. I can build them to whatever size I want, and detail them as much or as little as I want to. I’ve always felt that pre built or kits lacked that little something extra anyway.
Aristo is the logical choice to provide structures at 1/29 as they are the leader in that scale and already have a line of structures…however the marketplace dictates selling to the widest possible spectrum. this is why the standard gauge trains are geared towards the 1/29 crowd, but the buildings are 1/24, so that those modeling narrow gauge might be tempted to buy them as well.
What I dont get is that with all the aftermarket building kits avalable no one has offered to fill that niche with 1/29 (or 1/30.5? to appeal to 1/32 scalers as well) scale buildings or kits. It would just be part of the natural progression occuring in large scale between the standard gaugers and the narrow gaugers. This split is inevitable, why not start marketing towards it instead of splitting the diffeence and producing a product that increasingly appeals to less and less on each side.
I have no ability whatsoever in this direction so i make my buildings out of concrete using the Jigstome system and they look pretty good (for me that is). What Kevin said has some sense to it, they do have slight variations to the design depending on the era and or what scale it is.
The NMRA tried a few years ago, but most people in G don’t really seem to care. So why should the manufacturers? This situation is very similar to 3 rail O gauge which continues to use several scales even though 1:48 has been dominate for years.
I was thinking something on the way home from work today that would solve all of this scale debate. If Eastern Mountain Models Ltd. of BC, Canada would produce an exact scale line of trains, say to 1/24 for example, market them at 1/3 the cost of the lowest price manufacturer in the industry with RCS from Tony Walsham already installed[yeah], then give everybody on the forum a complete line of trains to start with for free, then by default that would become the standard!
I think it’s a grand idea and I volunteer to be the first to take delivery of the free train! Industry G scale standard here we come, WHOO HOOO!!![:D]
However, since there are already Standards (NEM-MOROP) which cover both 1:32 and 1:22.5 scale, we decided to follow those Standards and let the “10% up or down” crowd put up with a “slight error”.
On that “free train”; from our perspective we offer real models and take real money in exchange. [;)]
What’s really annoying is that there are all these different scales using the same gauge of track. If you want dual guage trains, you end up with two (or more) different scales, instead of two different gauges of track. “G scale” is the only place in model railroading where gauge determines the scale rather than vice versa.
BTW, whatever happened to 1:24 scale?? Lately I’ve been reading my old issues of Narrow Gauge & Short Line Gazette from the 80’s, and at that time it sure looked like “G scale” was going to be 1:24. All the fine-scale modelers seemed to be working in 1:24 back then, and manufacturers such as Delton were producing 1:24 models. It made a lot more sense than any of the current scales, because there was (and still is) a large variety of vehicles and structural products available in 1:24.