Hey! I’m new to posting, so forgive any errors, or breaches of “forum etiqutte”. I did have a quick, simple question for those that know RR hiring, and seniority practices. The day you first show up for “Conductor Trainee” training, is that your seniority date? And if so, and there are 10 or 20 in the class, how do they determine who is most senior, and least senior? Are they watching who shows up earliest? Do they draw names? Or, does your seniority not start until after sucessful completion of training? I guess that’s more than “one” question, but, I’d appreciate any input, or answers. Thanks!
On the WSOR, the first day in class is your seniority date. If there are multiple people in class, they roll dice or draw cards to determine order of seniority. I got lucky.[;)]
Other lines do it differently, of course.
Like WSOR3801 says, different companies do it different ways. Gotta read your union contract. When I marked up there were four of us and it came down to age, older was better.
Craft and specific contract rules apply when starting your Seniority date and order. All contracts are different in their specifics.
Years–decades–ago, when I hired out, I was in a training class of over 20 people. Seniority was determined by the date on which application was first filed. It was used before training started, because that was the order by which we were allowed to choose whether we wanted to work in the yard, or on the Wisconsin Road. I chose the yard, and never regretted it (ironically, when I was on the extra board, I got more calls for Wisconsin road jobs than anything else!).
Correct. On Conrail it was done by the date of your physical. If more than one physical on the same date then the time of the physical controlled, if one or more at the same time, then by birthdate, oldest first.
NS is by first day on the property, then by birthdate.
LC
Like LC, my conductor’s senority date with Conrail is the date I took my physical. My yardmaster date is the day I “soloed” as a yardie.
CSX’s current policy is your conductor’s date is the day you report to the REDI Center for training, with your birthday as the tie-breaker, oldest to youngest.
I’ll also note, that CSX has a single Train & Engine senority date. If you go to engine school when your roster number comes up, your conductor’s date is also your engineer’s date. Not all railroads have this policy.
Nick
On the ns it is your Mark up date, Not the date you hired on and went to school they dont care about that just when you get your promotion to conductor, and if there is more than 1 in a class its the last 4 digits of your social security number low to high. to establish senority.
That’s the way it is on the UP, if there is more than one in the class, its the last 4 digits of your social security number to establish seniority. Most contracts in the different UP hubs stated its low to high, unfortunately for me where I hired out, our contract was “unique”, and established seniority high to low[:(!] . I ended up 10 with 12 in our class. Oh well, I still have two in my class under me and about 40 already below me in our hub.
Would previous service affect the seniority placement?? In my current (non-RR) job, I was one of I think 8 people who started on the same day, but because the others were new hires and I was moving up from a lower-level job with the same organization, I was listed ahead of the others on our seniority rosters for the new job.
On BNSF, the date starts on day 1 when the condr class begins. When I began my class in 1998, the roster ranking was done by each trainee drawing a number from a hat. If you were a craft transfer, you went automatically to the top of the class, followed by trainees who came over from another rr, then the off street hires drew their number. I drew the bottom, I became the baby in my class. The first yr it was horrible, but after that things began to smooth out and all is well.
Let’s see if I’ve got this right, people are hired and compensated by the date they are hired???, NOT by their qualifications, experience, enthusiasm, potential ? ? ? and does this seniority system follow you all through your career?? What happens if you are more qualified for a position but some mook was hired 10 minutes before you, does he automatically get the job with NO chance of you ever getting a promotion?? (it sounds like death is the only chance for a promotion)---- sounds good to me , (this is called “free enterprise??”)
Pretty much, yes. You gety hired, get e seniority date and it follows you for your career on the railroad. It can render you jobless (cut off) when there are not enough open positions and can result in you getting “bumped” off a job you are holding by a senior man. There are a multitude of exceptions and differences (for example some roads have “system seniority” while others are by district or agreement (for example NS has both the “Nickel Plate Agreement” and the “Southern Agreement” on the Northern Region(former-CR)). There can also be exceptions for prior rights under existing agreements at the time of a merger or other acquisition of one RR by another. Conrail was a crazy patchwork quilt of such prior rights and even the NS still has some of that and CSX as well. I’m sure BNSF and UP also have differences based upon past agreements. Also, rates of pay and “arbitraries” (arbitrary payments) based upon agreements can greatly affect your pay.
Oh, and working in a unionized workplace has very little to do with “free enterprise” (unless you count in that employees who try hard to “game” the agreements to maximize their paychecks). On the other hand, unions can and do offer some protection from overzealous or downright stupid management and unsafe conditions.
In all, an arcane system which has built up in layers over
What do you mean promotion? Do you mean assignment of jobs? Do you mean move from conductor to engineer? Or Train & Engine Service to Management?
Every conductor in the same class of service (yard/road/etc) receives the same basic pay, regardless of senority. Yes there are jobs that pay more then others. And yes they tend to go to the older employees. But that happens just about anywhere.
Promotion out of Train & Engine Service is based on merit and qualifications. Although, few T&E employees have the desire to leave T&E for the Management Circus.
Nick
When I hired on the NS in 1991 as a brakeman, we picked numbers out of a hat.Out of 10 I picked #5.I ended up being 9th account of not be related to anyone [B)] ,they claim they forgot to call me,for two days ?
We was required to take 10 student trips at $33.00 a trip,regardless how long we worked.We had to take so many yard ,road,and shifters jobs in those 10 trips.We then was marked up according to who got their trips in first.Clear as mud ?Yeah it was to me too [%-)].
So to get qualified as a conductor we had to get 300 calander day starts to take a conductor’s test.I got my 300 days in ahead of those who got around me as brakeman,to take my test before them [^] .
But then when we started getting called for LET school,I fell back behind those that volunteered to go to LET school,according to brakemans senority.So my conductors senority is all I beat some of them on.
Those that hired on after 1993 are required to take LET school on the NS.If you fail any part of the school.You must go back after 30 days and retake that test over (on your own time and money).If you fail the second time.Turn in your switch keys,lantern and radio.Because as Don Trump would say,“Your fired !”.
And yes that really does happen.
I just recently got hired at NS they use the last four digits of your SS to determine the order of senority as there were eight in my class from our yard and 47 from across the country
On the BNSF your date is the day thet your class starts training.
Rodney