I’ve got a troublesome spot to figure out how I’ll scenic it. It’s a nearly vertical wall and nothing is looking right in my mock ups so far. I’ve tried retaining walls (7" is too “klunky” looking.) A rock cliff is also a bit “phony” looking due to the wall being right in “your face” at the end of the aisle way. I’m playing with part rock work, part retaining wall, etc. There is a yard on top of the wall so putting the yard on a big stone arched bridge, etc. was played with but not very prototypical-or even possible (?)
I’ve perused many magazines, the John Allen book, online pics, etc. etc. but haven’t found anything that seems right yet. It has that toy train set look of some of the early Atlas track plan book layouts from the '50s and I’m kind of stumped to get such a tall vertical face look right.
If you’ve had a similar problem spot and found a nice solution and have any pics I sure could use some more ideas. My layout is mostly a small city/urban layout but the area I’m describing (the wall) could be and maybe should be more rural/mountain-ish rock work as this area comes off of the city which sits on a bluff or ridge or plateau. (Nobody knows for sure, yet!)
I’d love to have this small yard atop a steel structure leaving it open underneath to see and reach some back tracks without a lift out, but don’t know of any prototypical settings.
Something visual along the lines of the ore dock in the featured layout article in the Feb. MR but under the entire width of the yard would be great but don’t think it even comes near any reality… I’ll post on the prototype threads too.
This is a much lower wall, only about 2 inches high, but the casting is 3 inches and I had to cut it down:
Again, 7 inches would be too much for a timber wall, but you might think about staggering the wall a bit and using different types of retaining at different points:
This tall plank fence was made with coffee stirrers:
This scene uses a different stone wall casting, on both sides of the line going down into the subway tunnel:
For that front-of-the-layout signature scene, though, you can’t go wrong with a Bragdon foam rock face casting:
Back when I was cutting classes as a high school student, I got to see the result of sinking a highway into the natural armor plate that passes for rock under parts of New York City. The natural rock walls were easily 40 feet high, within a few degrees of vertical, and grooved on 18 inch centers with drill holes from the top to the bottom. The final blast left a surface that, as far as I know, was never covered or modified.
I won’t say what I did with the wooden DuPont box labeled 40% dynamite that I was given that morning. I WILL say that the experience added a lot of fuel to my interest in the civil engineering aspects of model railroading.
Thanks for digging through your pics files guys. One of the things that makes this so difficult to get looking right is that there are no tracks in front of (at the base of) the cliff/wall and the fact that it’'s 7" tall.
If there were tracks or room for a structure or two in front of the cliff/wall it would help to diminish the “in your face” aspect but there isn’t room.
I’m playing with a stepped wall but there’s minimal room for that as well. Please keep 'em coming if you’ve got 'em. Every idea helps. I’ve got the entire layout mapped out scenically now except for this one “bugaboo”!
Maybe it’s the fact that I titled this thread “inspirtation” instead of inspiration? [:$]
They are self-adhesive interlocking sheets that come in various syles of cut stone and various scales. You could use the smaller scale to diminish the “in your face” look. These sheets are shown right on the home page of the Chooch Enterprises web site.
I am using them on a 5 inch tall flush wall with no opportunity for tiering or setting back.
Start at the bottom with a row of pine trees and brush. Make it maybe an inch in depth, maybe it could be less. A vertical rock wall would also start at the bottom, with the pines and brush in front. Take the cast rock wall up about 1/3 of the height. At that point, put in a narrow trail that an old miner would take with a mule train. Put the trail on an angle. I like it going up and to the right. figure out a beginning and an ending for the trail if possible. It can be hidden around some trees or bolder etc. Maybe the middle of the trail could go behind an old tree clinging to a ledge somewhere.
Then continue up with the cast rock wall for the second third of the height. On this third, slope it in slightly as you go up. For the top third, I would build a vertical rough cut block wall. Add a few drainage culvert pipes along it and create some run-off water courses down the sides of the rock wall. Wash out a small section of the miners trail, but make it so it can still be crossed.
To me, this would look like the yard on the top had to be expanded, so they built a retaining wall and back filled it. You could use almost anything man-made for the wall. Block, stone, cribbing, etc. Whatever would fit your time frame.
Thank you again for the ideas and pics guys. I have considered the Scenic Express and Cripplebush stuff. The rubber rock walls appeal due to the right at the edge of the benchtop aspect/location. I thought perhaps I could get a bit more bend and slope to them in the limited space.
I am using the Chooch flexible walls elsewhere on the layout and really like them! Wish they had been around a lot earlier! They’re great for the curved walls behind the roundhouse.
Elmer, thanks for your detailed description/ideas. That diagonal angling and layering of details is something I strarted experimenting with yesterday. The diagonals help break things up visually.
If I feel that a slightly more, tied in, urban look is required I’ll fool around with some staircases, ladders, platforms in place of trails.
I’m considering extending the bench top area at the end of the (only) aisle so that I can get a bit of more natural slope but I hate to lose anymore aisle space.
If I could use lots of foliage ala Appalachian cliff sides I could easily reduce the HEY LOOK HOW BIG AND FLAT I AM aspect of this area. It’s going to be the main focus/eye draw whenever a visitor comes into the room so it’s distracting considering the rest of the layout.
Unfortunately this layout is being built primarily for operations sessions and the foliage/trees will be too exposed to damage while switching. I’ve considered a plexi-glass shield but without extending the benchwork/reducing the aisle’s length, I don’t think that’ll be possible.
Why is it always the LAST thing we’re doing/planning that causes the most trouble!?
I really appreciate you all taking your time to offer ideas, suggestions, products and the usual good fellowship/advice.
When I figure out what I’ll ultimately do, I’ll be sure to let you all know. It’ll be awhile though. I wanna be sure it’s the right thing. Lots and lots of mock ups to come I reckon along with the purchase of a few scenicing products
This idea just came to mind when I read that there is nothing in front of the wall. How about hiding it with a simple facia board, painted a dark color or whatever to match the rest of your facia. Peoples attention will immediately be drawn to something else, since there is nothing there to look at. I have seen many photos of layouts with facia that looked to be at least 7" if not more.
Richard, yes, I did think of that initially as the facia just to the side of this area is already high (54").
I thought it would be a logical and blended thing, but just the opposite comes to pass… Dang, I thought we both had a great idea there, too
But, unfortunately the really quite shocking flat area at the end of the aisle looks very wrong with blank facia. I got excited about maybe making that facia a work station with car card boxes, a fast clock, pencil holders, etc. as it would be great to work that high yard there, but that also just makes “you” look only at the vertical aisle end thang and nothing else. This wall-ish sucker is just hindering the blend of the walkaround layout thang, completely.
I’m thinking the next thing to try, is to see if I (and my operators) can live about 3"-4" less aisle length in order to make things much simpler scenically. It would instantly make things more natural looking if it had a reasonable amount of slope to it. I’ll have to brainstorm to gain some “make up” access vial hand sized lift outs in order to reach the back tracks. Of course this is at the widest portion of the layout already so that “wall” will tell me I told you so, I guess
Thanks for the idea. If this was on the lower portion of my layout the facia idea would work perfectly.
Rich, after mocking up something, I’m going to reconsider that facia/workstation idea.
I did come up with something that may be a good solution just now. I could have a vertical cliff face or
even a high retaining wall if I place a “dummy” bridge/skinny diorama “thing” horizontally across it. It would take a large middle portion of the wall out of the viewpoint (mostly) and a bridge is something I could remove when we operate so that the big bellies can belly up to the end of the aisle if I don’t cave in and bring the slope out into the aisle.
To be continued for awhile…
Thanks again everyone! I’m mostly a lone wolfer so it’s great to get some pics, ideas and experiences from you guys.
This is a shot of one edge of my layout. It’s more finished now, but I still don’t have a “formal” piece of fascia here. Instead of just covering it over, I brouught a section of the subway tunnel to the edge, and buillt a station with an opening in the fascia.
Although the tracks are live and there’s a working turnout connecting this station to the rest of the subway system, I almost never run a train down here. But, it serves as an interesting bit of scenery and it’s fun to watch the subways round the bend as you look down the tunnel past the station.
The fascia edge could contain some different scenic element. I’m thinking in particular of a coal mine, set so that the edge of the layout slices through a tunnel to give you visibility into the mine. All you need is a dark tunnel, with some N-scale track and a few N-scale ore cars, and perhaps some bare light bulbs in the depths. Depending on where your layout is set, and the era, different kinds of operations would perhaps be more appropriate than a coal mine.
You could also go with that big rock face, but add some climbers. That small touch wouldn’t be noticed at first, but on closer examination your visitors would enjoy the scene.
