Any predictions on whether or not HSR gets mentioned tonight and if so, what?
Can we please keep this discussion pretty narrowly focused? Thanks.
On this note I’d be surprised if we could even get past pg 1.
My feeling is if it is mentioned at all it’s going to be upgrading Acela sets----
Sounds like he’ll be announcing the $8B in awards in Tampa the day after.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/01/27/politics/main6145977.shtml
I’ll predict HSR gets a one line mention among things being done to create jobs.
The details are not yet apparent to the public as yet on the coming anouncements of the HSR award structure.
The TRAINS Newswire in yesterdays lineup carried the notation on the piece about HSR; they would be starting an adjunct site on their site as to the amounts, and recipients of HSR awards as they are made/anounced.
There was no mention if it would be a SUBSCRIBER ONLY Content [X-)]
or available to all viewers.[bow] (Hopefully!)
(Edited)
Censored on the first reply. My, my. What a deal. I think I’d ask that question on another railroad forum.
In a sense-yes.
Allow me to explain. We have a generic no politics rule as part of our forum policies. A lot of members have opined that they believe that to be too broad. The general consensus, is that politics is tied pretty close to railroads and transportation policy. Many have suggested, that we loosen up a bit, and allow some political discussion, as long as it’s limited to how it pertains to the topic at hand. This would be a fair thread to test whether that would work.
What we’re trying to avoid, is the case where discussion strays to general party politics, and away from the railroad tie-ins. Typically, that starts the name-calling, lack of civility, and eventual locking of a thread. Please don’t let this thread sink under that weight.
With that being said. Let’s experiment, and see if we can keep this thread narrowly focud upon the original poster’s question, and see if it works. Thanks
-Norris
…And I hope to follow the rules. In general, it seems we might be in for some spending freeze, possibly being announced tonight. That being said, we probably won’t see much spending going towards Hi speed rail, at least until we see some more improvement in our economy, hence, more incoming tax monies.
Wasn’t the commitment to spend $8 billion immediately, plus another $5 billion over time made nearly a year ago? Where does it stand today? How much has been spent so far? What has it bought? What are the details of the timetable for this HSR work?
One answer at a time:
Funding:
What has been appropriated to date (not just authorized, but actually appropriated) is as follows:
- $8 billion, FY 2009, under ARRA
- $1 billion, FY 2010, under ARRA
- $1 billion, FY 2011, under ARRA
- $1 billion, FY 2012, under ARRA
- $2.5 billion, FY 2010, under USDOT and other agency reauthorization
Rep. Oberstar and others are proposing as much as $25 billion additional, in the 6-year surface transportation reauthorization bill that will probably be created this year.
Spending to date:
None of this money has been spent yet. Applications for the first tranche of $8 billion were solicited from the states in 2009, with various application deadlines depending on what the money would be used for ending October 2. The majority of the first tranche of $8 billion will likely be awarded based on the “Track 2” applications that were delivered to FRA on October 2. It’s not easy to spend money, there is a tremendous amount of law that must be satisfied, and to satisfy the law, it requires a tremendous amount of preliminary engineering, agreements with host railroads and affected local government agencies, usually requires s
Whether HSR is mentioned tonight or not, both Pres. Obama and VP Biden are scheduled to be in Tampa, Florida tomorrow/ Thursday to make an announcement of funding for HSR projects. Many news media are speculating that will include substantial funding for Florida’s Orlanda-Tampa HSR proposal - yesterday’s/ Tuesday’s Wall Street Journal (pg. B-3) said that the R-O-W has already been acquired for it. For just one example, see the Orlando Business Journal’s article ‘‘Obama to announce high-speed rail plan’’ of Wednesday, January 27, 2010, 9:51am EST, at -
http://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/stories/2010/01/25/daily19.html
EDIT - Another article, with more details, from within the last hour or so, from -
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/breaking-news/story/1449021.html
Florida to get U.S. funding for high-speed railBY ALEX LEARY - ST. PETERSBURG TIMES
From the Wall Street Journal yesterday -
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704762904575024611266446690.html?
- JANUARY 26, 2010<
So you are advocating narrow gauge HSR?
I wonder how much less it would cost to actually accomplish things in this country if every project was not burdened with years of superfluous paper shuffling and meaningless studies.
A lot of it, at least down here is a ruse to get the advocates to shut up and go away so the legislature can get on with the serious business of the state, like, um, er… Oh, yeah! Routing corruption and reorganizing the DOT. And, making sure that if a kid accidently brings a fish scaling knife to school, they aren’t required to but him in jail, and trying to decide if texting while driving should be illegal or not, and deciding exactly the long the school day should be for all public schools in the state… Important stuff!
[(-D]
Every last one of those pieces of paper results from someone who cheats or steal or lies, or someone whose pet peeve or property is impacted, and everyone else says "Let’s put a stop to that! and it all outputs as yet another law or rule or regulation that has to be enforced, or it results in yet another lawsuit. Too many groups and people resort to the courts for their “my rightous end-justifies-any-available-means” end-arounds on laws or outcomes they can’t abide, and too many people simply view the nation and its wealth as sort of a giant shoplifting, cheat-'till-you-get-caught free-for-all. I have no solutions; we’re our own worst enemies!
RWM
And less time. Look how fast the Transcontinental lines were built ‘back in the day’, as well as the significant local and regional lines, as compared to today. Although, I believe the Pacific Railroad Act as advocated by Theodore Judah was originally passed circa 1862, but construction didn’t really get underway until 1866 or so - there was a Civil War on then until April 1865, remember ? - but then it was completed within 3 years. Today, the Environmental Impact Assessment/ Statement alone can take that long . . .
Some projects - even the re-establishment of passenger rail commuter service over an already existing R-O-W where a track was - are taking 20 to 30 years. Of course, the lack of any money significant money is a hindrance, too. I sometimes wonder if someone showed up with a blank check or unlimited funds to remove that impediment, how long it would then really take, if people were motivated. Still pretty long, I suspect.
But hey - as RWM said, a lot of good-paying jobs are created by that process. And having read through some of those studies, they essentially also analyze a lot of the alternate ‘business models’ or plans and contingencies, etc. that really ought to be looked at before committing large sums of money anyway, to avoid major mis-steps. That’s happened to, in the past - just look at the New York, Westchester and Boston construction and rapid abandonment for a good example of that.
I have worked for a large government agency.
Mountains of redundant paperwork are the result of upper management trying to supervise by reading reports instead of active supervision. Upper management uses paperwork in an attempt to supervise subordinates that they never actually see instead of delegating that supervision to intermediate level supervisors.
Our CATS Blue Line, which was being built in an active NS right of way, was delayed because the required environmental study (to determine the impact of adding two more tracks in the existing active ROW) found a federally protected weed that they required CATS to transplant to a new approved location. Of course every delay causes yet another cost increase. I can’t imagine how much environmental damage would have been done if the plants that no one even knew were growing there in the NS right of way had been harmed or destroyed during the construction.
I’m all for protecting our environment, but once implemented, such programs develop a life of their own and become an end unto themselves.
Joseph A. Szabo, the Administrator of the Feceral Railroad Administration will speak to a Business/Government Leadership Luncheon in Gary, In on Friday January 29th. It will be held at the Gary/Chicago International Airport at 1130am.
Going to try to crash the party if the schedule allows it.
Ed
Well, I just heard it. Two sentences. One said Florida’s project is one of the 13.