One solution would be a dead “interchange” secation-a 3" snap straight section will work. All you need to do is shove your interchange cars to the DCC gap. A turnout would be required to have a place to put the inbound cars out of the way so,you can place the outboud cars on the interchange. This is a common interchange setup between short lines and their interchange road(s).
I always take the baby steps approach. I was in your shoes a few years ago, and my first step at this was to install a toggle switch that TOTALLY alternated the layout between DCC to DC. That worked until I learned how to convert most of my locos to DCC. My soldering skills improved as I practiced. I started on low-cost Mehano steam locos. Now that I am getting pretty good at this, I am gradually removing the decoders from my first installs to more expensive locos. I agree that the bulb is the most complicated part on the heisler . But with the baby-step approach, you don’t need to install a new light right away. Early steam engines did not operate with their lamps on during the day anyway…
Simon
The operating scheme calls for the Heisler to come out of the switchback branch into the interchange yard leading the cars to be interchanged. The runaround track is part of he interchange yard. The mainline trains making setouts and dropoffs at that interchange will also use that runaround at times. Adding a second runaround to the switchback just isn’t feasible. A dead section of track isn’t really an option.
The point is that both the mainline and branchline have to use the runaround track in the interchange yard. That means I have to have a section of track that can operate in either DC or DCC mode if I choose not to convert the Heisler to DCC. I can’t completely isolate the DC section from the rest of the layout.
John as far as I can you never said you wanted to run DC and DCC at the same time, yet many seemed concerned that you will manage to do that inspite of a center off DpDT switch.
I’m not sure how that system fails unless you have a loco chugging along on the keep alive power while you switch from DCC to DC. The other way to do it is with a plugs or connectors. Have a female connector for the bus and a male connector for each: DC and DCC.
I get what he wants to do, but he has me confused with the runaround track, making it sound like he might be trying to use both at once.
I think Larry’s suggestion is trying to address what he wants, using his DCC loco to shove cars on to the DC track so the DC loco can couple to them, or visa-versa.
I’d sure like to see a track diagram of what he has, and what he wants, with the runaround track.
Mike.
He’s talking about sharing a track, not switchign the entire layout. ALl it taks is for a metal wheelset to bridge the gap and DC is conencted to DCC in that circumstance. Or either the DCC loco or the DC loco runs past the gap. Having the DPDT set so the interchange track is DC will not prevent a loco or cars being shoved fromt he DCC side into the interchange, or a DC loco or cars being shoved from the DC side into the DCC side.
Not much of a photo, and you have to click on it to actually see it because Photobucket, but here is an install in the old round motor Rivarossi Heisler:
http://www.railroadredux.com/2011/03/adding-dcc-to-a-rivarossi-heisler/
October 2011 Page 32 of Model Railroad Hobbyist has a more detailed how to on adding DCC to the older models.
–Randy
I get that Randy, and then he states he doesn’t have room for a shared section, because of a runaround. [%-)]
Maybe we’ll see a track plan for what he wants with the runaround.
Mike.
To save headaches I would use a dead section… Nothing wrong with a push/pull operation.
My Summerset Ry shoves the outbound cars to the NS interchange and places the inbound cars on a side track,then places the outbounds on the NS track for pickup.
We use a former CR caboose on these shoves so the conductor has a place to ride after all its a two mile trip.
No, they are not both going to use it at once but both need to use it. That means the runaround track has to be able to switch from DC to DCC and back. There’s no getting around it. There has to be a section of track that is switchable. A dead section is not going to get rid of that requirement.
It would help if you would post a drawing showing the problem area.
Mel
My Model Railroad
http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/
Bakersfield, California
I’m beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
OK, so you make the runaround track the switchable track. I guess that answers my question.
I get that, but you will be using the runaround track, so there is your “dead” section, and “switchable” track, in one.
Mike.
You can’t have a dead section on
You can’t have a dead section on a runaround track.
It wouldn’t help me and there is no problem area. It is a simple interchange yard that requires a runaround move by locos on both the branch and the main. I started the thread to ask whether or not it would be feasible to use a switchable section of track rather than convert an older loco to DCC. Those are the only two options I am considering. I’m not interested in rearranging track or changing the operating scheme.
One track, or the other, or both the main and runaround, are going to need to be switchable.
Where is the change from one to the other supposed the take place? Use a section of track that’s already there.
Nobodies talking about rearanging anything, we are just interested in what you have, and what you want to do.
Overhaul answer to your original question…YES you can. figure out where you can put.
Mike.
The only other option then would seem to be to make the approaches to the yard at each end the dead sections, when the switch is flipped to DC, then the yard and the approach from the lumber side with the Heisler is powered by DC, the approach from the rest of the layout would be dead, and beyond that the rest of the layout would be DCC. When flipped to DCC, the layout side approach and the yard would be powered by DCC, and the approach from the lumber side would be dead.
This just all seems WAY more complicated than just putting a decoder in the loco. The referenced issue of MRH shows the install in pictures, it’s free to get. There’s a lot of misinformation out there about older Rivarossi locos. The late 70’s/early 80’s ones were much improved over the early/mid 60’s ones when it comes to the motor. They may not be Kato good but they are at least as good as anything Athearn was making at the time and far beyond the typical Tyco/Life Like/Bachmann of the era it isn’t funny. Some have issues with the accuracy of the model, saying they are horribly oversized, but it looks the part and generally runs fine.
–Randy
Perhaps we are arguing over the semantics of what a “dead section” is. To me it is a section of track that is not powered at all. It sounds to me as if some are using “dead section” to indicate a section of track that is switchable from DC to DCC with a center off position on the switch to make it dead. If that is the definition, that is what I had in mind. The interchange yard and runaround tracks could be switched from either DC or DCC depending on which loco was using them.
The suggestion that there be a dead section of track that isn’t wired isn’t feasible wi
Yep! That’s what most of us are talking about. A section of track that can be switched either way, or OFF.
Yes, that has been mentioned by some, because of the misunderstanding on just EXACTLY you want to do, and to caution against DC meeting DCC and visa-versa.
So, that clears up the confussion once and for all ? Yes?
So isolate track joints, and install controls ( DPDT’s or whatever) how ever you need to make what you want work.
One thing we ALL had a concern about is the co-mingling of DC/DCC. That’s all, just trying to make sure we were clear on that, and that you understood.
Good luck with your project John, let us know how things work out! [Y]
Mike
What you don’t want is ==DCC====|====DC== anywhere. Toggle switch or no toggle switch, it’s too easy to overrun the gaps, and with cars with metal wheels, or a loco, this will connect the two systems and SOMETHING will fry.
A dead section in this case means that when the interchange is switched to DC< it looks somethign like this:
==DCC===||===DC==|====DC=======
So that even if you do run past the gap, it won; link DC and DCC.
ANd when you finish with the DC loco and switch the interchange back to DCC, it looks liek this:
=====DCC====|==DCC==|=====|===DC===
where the | are gaps in both rails.
–Randy
OK, if I am understanding you, you are saying when the interchange yard is operating in DC mode, there should be an unpowered gap between the interchange yard and the DCC section of the layout which would require a dead section at both ends. When the interchange yard is switched to DCC mode, those dead sections would then be powered onto the DCC system and at the same time there would be a dead section between the interchange yard and the DC portion of the layout. Both the switchable DCC and DC sections could not be powered at the same time. That would certainly be the safer way to go but sounds like a lot more complex wiring set up then the simple DPDT switch I envisioned. I think I’d prefer to just go with the simple set up knowing the danger involved. The DC Heisler is only going to make one entry into the interchange yard each operating session and it would require me to flip the switch each time it did and then flip it back once it exits. I still haven’t decided on whether to go with this or bite the bullet and try to solder a decoder into the Heisler.