I know purists will cringe at my ideas and that is OK but I am wondering if I am the only rebel out there. I like the 50’s era for all the reasons many choose it: grew up at that time, change from steam to diesel, availability of locomotives, rolling stock, buildings, etc. However, I am modeling the Helena, MT area where I met my wife and raised our family and want to include some businesses that are in older buildings but did not start up until the 70’s or 80’s. I also want to include the Montana Rail Link line that did not develop until the 80’s along with Great Northern from the 50’s and before. The businesses will look fine as only their names are not of the 50’s era. The Montana Rail Link will definitely not look prototypical as it did not exist and my locomotives and rolling stock are all more modern.
I do not intend to win any prizes with my design and I will not try to deceive visitors by trying to convince them everything is historically accurate. My intentions are to make the layout family oriented and meaningful to the time we spent in Montana. My grandchildren can also ask questions and “see” a partial representation of our family history.
So, who else out there is willing to admit they are not 100% prototypically correct on their layouts and for what reasons?
Since I can find no evidence that my prototype ever existed in the real world, I guess nothing is 100% correct. Or everything is - not!
The topo maps show sawmill pond dam remains along the Elk River. Port Orford cedar was certainly known and valued in California for mine bracing and expensive homes. But was Port Orford ever served by logging schooners? Was a rail line ever built up the Elk River? Would it have been built in narrow gauge? Would such a railroad be expanded towards Roseberg to link up with a fictional standard gauge line, and become a common carrier instead of a logger? I have no evidence.
Setting the era was really tough, because like you, I had desires that conflicted with dates. 1900 was pretty late for working logging schooners. But knuckle couplers and air brakes weren’t mandated until 1893, and 1903 was the required compliance date - for common carriers and interstate interchange. A narrow gauge logger usually stayed with link and pin couplers until its demise. The 1893 silver crash really dented the economy of much of the West for several years, making it difficult to find capital for railway improvements. So imperfect as it is, I selected 1900.
Era-wise, finding accurate 1890s small steam I can afford is a real challenge, even in HO and HOn3. So I make do with era-inaccurate models until I can locate, order, and install era-appropriate details. Resin and wood kits for accurate cars are available, but I use out-of-era plastic stand-ins until I can get the kits built.
But frankly the number of model railroaders that know a Roundhouse Old Timer car is not accurate for 1900 is pretty small. And the number of visitors I have to my home layout is a minute percentage of that small number. A home layout is for my enjoyment - and those who I choose to share it with. If I ever build some Free-mo modules, that would be a different stor
I heard you were looking for me, and others who have a little trouble coming out of the closet. [swg]
There are many of us that have varying interests in different time periods and places. In my case i have my road as a (fictitious) Division of the Western Pacific as I have had a great love for this fallen flag from before it was fallen. It operates with a high percentage of WP rolling stock and power, however there is a definite presence of other western roads as were often in service on the WP. There are leased power units from GN, BN, D&RGW, GM-Demonstrator, TS, SN, as well as the Divisions own power which are patched Reading units SD-45,& GP-30s. On these I like the paint jobs and they were easily patched, definitely not prototypical. but it works for me and I like it and that is what counts. Anyone that doesn’t like it, they can go and recount their own rivets…
Just make sure you are enjoying what you are doing, That is where the wheel meets the track.
I’m not 100% prototypical. I’d say I’m about 40% if I’m lucky. I have things the way I like them. You’ll find a Y6B chugging along with an Amtrak Acela whizzing by all the time.
Yours truly uses both ’ WHAT IF ’ and ’ RURAL FLAVOR ’ concept in my HO modeling. My old HO modular club taught me this, as we modeled as still-in-extistence, a long-time gone, local, ex-B&M shortline switching branchline RR and our eleven club members had a lot of FUN doing it for over six years together! So, that made us semi- freelance and not one of us ever counted a single rivet, ROFLMAO! Life it too short, so have FUN! TTFN…Old Tom aka papasmurf in NH
As I have said before, and will say again I’m sure, Bob Heinlein had it right. If you don’t like what’s going on in this universe (#3, Neal Armstrong) just model a different universe. All you have to do is find a universe where all the things you want exist as you want them.
For example, I am modeling a very specific area of Japan at a very specific time. My scheme includes a private railway serving coal mines. There was never a workable coal deposit in that part of Japan!
So I simply moved to another universe where the local volcanic activity hadn’t burned up the underground coal seams. Which one? #13, Alfred E. Neumann.
What, me worry?
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - sort of)
The only ‘problem’ you will have is if you inform everyone that this is modeled ‘exactly’ like the Helena in the 50’s. Someone will hold you to it! Just say it is loosely based on Helena…
My layout is based on a ‘what if’ Milw line is SW Wisconsin - The ‘date’ is about 1959. I still have steam engines, and I have some 1963 built insulated box cars on the layout(cause I like them). I have a lot of ‘modern’ stuff, but most of it is sitting in the wall display cases. They come out to run every now and then(along with other favorites like a Rock Island E8)
I learned that the layout cannot hold all of my trains. That is why I built the display cases. I have a friend that modeled a specific NP line - not a lot of different traffic on it, and most of his NP equipment never ran on this secondary line. He had fun building it, but lost interest and never really finished it as he would not compromise(someone might point out an error). His new house/layout is pretty generic(it does use NP mainline grey ballast). He runs anything to he likes…
This is a case in which the old adage “it’s your railroad…” applies.
The places where I bend the rules are mainly vehicles and figures. My layout represents 1934ish, yet I have some vehicles that were produced in the late '30s and some of my female figures are wearing skirts that are too short for the era (I got a good price on some people). So far, it seems that I’m the only one who notices.
I try to keep things close to the era, so I wouldn’t include a computer repair business or a Toyota dealership because they are not even within a stretch of anyone’s imagination. Of course, that’s just me. It’s your railroad; do whatever makes you happy.
To be honest, even the most prototypical modeler will NEVER achieve 100% “prototypical-ity”. It’s just not possible. Although I am striving for accuracy on my 40s era NYC “protolance” layout, I know that there are a few details that I’m probably just not going to bother with and I can live with that.
The joy of MRRing - to me - is designing your layout that will be the most meaningful to you. Eagle, that sounds exactly like what you are trying to accomplish.
I chose to model the late 1950s and early 1960s. I’ve “smeared” the timeframe, with mostly autos from the 50s but a few from the mid 60s as well. The most “modern” truly dateable item is a Playboy centerfold from 1967 that hangs on the wall of the roundhouse. On the other hand, I’ve conveniently ignored the rules which banned billboard reefers from interchange service, and I run those Beer Cars all the time.
I also like steam engines, so I have made my layout “dual era,” where I’m supposed to swap out the trains, automobiles and a few time-inappropriate scenic items and replace them all with another set from a different time. This is a modeling trick that not only lets you run incompatable equipment, but also gives you an excuse to buy twice as many trains. I did say that I’m “supposed to” do the swaps, because I often end up with a mixture. My current excuse is that I’m doing track work, and I have to make sure that everything works, regardless of what era it belongs in. Sounds like a reasonable explanation, but who among us is ever done “doing track work?”
Many will recall My freelance short line is named Columbus & Hocking Valley…This was a real railroad from 1867-1881 before merging with two other railroads and changing its name to Columbus,Hocking Valley & Toledo Ry.
Instead of 4-4-0s I use GP7/9s for my N Scale C&HV and SW1000,SW1500, GP38-2s,GP40-2s and GP50s for my HO C&HV.
You see if I was to model the real C&HV in all its glory I would need to use 1860 era locomotives and cars.
As I have mentioned many times, I model a specific area (Oklahoma wheat country) and a specific railroad (ATSF primary)-SLSF-UP) and specific grain elevators and flour mills, BUT they are not always or completely down to the prototype nail by nail. I have caught the flavor of what I am modeling, (at least virtually every visitor says so,) but I have had to compromise, make exceptions, deviate, just like anyone else. But I am satisfied when someone new visits, and looking at the layout says “you are modeling northcentral Oklahoma.”
I might also say that I use real names for most industries on the layout which in many cases pinpoint the locale the railroad is set in. Many visitors can identify area with industry.
i try to keep my era intact, early 60’s central wisc… however three rails {actually four] served here during this time, the Milw, the CNW, the Soo and GBW. i have era correct engines and rolling stock from 3 of them. when i feel like changing roads, i simply pick up the engines and caboose from one, and drop down another, with same mixture of rolling stock. same area, different road. buildings are generic, serve all. anyhoo, works for me. that way i can operate my favorite roads without the hassle of crossings and interchange tracking. oh well, to each their own.
I know I am not 100% prototypical, for several reasons
I’m not that knowledgeable. There are plenty of rivet counters out there who can point to this and that and explain how it’s not right for the era or the location or the railroad. They will probably be correct. Too bad. I spent my hobby time getting bench work built, track laid, and trains running rather than research.
I don’t have the space to model even the tiny town of Lisbon NH without lots of selective compression.
I have favorite equipment that doesn’t fit my era. I run it anyhow.
I don’t have the time or skills to scratchbuild all the prototype structures. So I make do with kits that are fairly close in feel, but no where near prototypical.
I don’t have the proper piece of rolling stock for the assignment, so I use something close. For instance I lack a decent freight steamer for the B&M. So my P4 Pacific, a passenger locomotive sometimes heads up freights.
My era is 1953 modeling the Maryland and Pennsylvania RR. The Ma&Pa ran old steam locomotives (the most “modern” was built in 1925), open platform coaches, and had truss rod cars with archbar trucks. It also had small diesels. From interchange it ran more modern freight cars and also borrowed passenger cars from the PRR occasionally for excursions. One of the reasons I like the Ma&Pa is that it was a prototype example of a mixed era railroad.
But I also have some billboard reefers plus some fantasy lines like the Gorre & Daphetid boxcar. I’ll run these too. I can always remove them if I want to have a “serious” operating session.
Whew…I feel a lot better after reading these posts. I thought I might be the only one who took liberties with my general railroad design, which can best be described as a “what if” with a “rural/logging flavor”, and a sprinkling of Jeffrey’s comment: “I just do what I want.”
Thanks everyone for your comments. I will sleep a lot better tonight knowing that for every modeler who wants to be featured in MRR Magazine there are 10, 20 or ?? who just enjoy doing what we are doing. As a few of you said at the end of the day if you enjoy what you are doing and have done then too bad for those who thinks it has to be done a certain way. I hope to post some pictures when I get more of my scenery and buildings completed.
Eagle Scout Gary modeling Montana Rail Link and Great Northern around Helena, MT from my current home in Montgomery, TX
It’s my railroad, my time and my money. If I like it, I buy it, and use it. I am quite sure my railroad would cause rivet counters to go into cardiac arrest. The bottom line is I enjoy it, my grandchildren enjoy it and that’s all folks.
If you feel it is right, do it. If it doesn’t feel right, don’t do it.