Can one use steel framing as a defense against termites with a resonable cost on a layout?
Lee
You could try metal studs (2x4s) for framing, and foam for the subroadbed. No need to put wood in the layout at all…? I think the cost of the metal studs is on par with wood, and even if not, you don’t need a whole house’s worht anyway. The foam is about the same cost as a sheet of plywood…
Interesting question - let us know what you find out!
Andrew
Wasn’t there an article about steel layout framing in one of the magazines recently?
Man, if you got termites so bad they would eat a layout I think I would be more worried about keeping a roof over the layout than legs on it. What do you guys do, set around thinking of tall tales like this to post? BTW, all you would need is a termite sheild made of metal to stop termites, look it up in a DYI manual. FRED
No sir.
We fixed them by poisin with a service 2 years ago. Mold cost us a room which was replaced. These last 2 years we carefully monitored for more bugs and apparently they died at the maginot line we built.
However there will always be a termite problem here and one can look to the future. The house is fine, will be looking at wood reduction tatics ero steel framing.
Lee
I would think that steel studs would make nice stable benchwork, though I would have a file with me while cutting and assembling to make sure I softened all sharp edges. I know that I have suffered many scrapes and lacerations(one required about 7 stitches in the palm of my hand while working around(not on) metal studs.
If the metal studes don’t work out, I doubt that totally exposed wood studs will cause mech of a termite problem, since it is out where you will be able to observe it continually(tell the wife you need to work on the layout every day so as to monitor for termites) and the wood will not be in direct contact with the soil(I assume).
If your serious? termites need a dirt “tunnel” to infest anything not in direct contact with the dirt, so I would think you would see a dirt tunnel to your layout long before it was done. Also, metal shields stop termites. As I said look at a DIY manual for metal termite shields. They do work. FRED
There was an article on using steel studs for benchwork. I have also seen an article using welded steel of a heavier nature. One thing to remember is that your benchwork will conduct electricity! It is also worth remembering that whenever you currently get a sliver from your benchwork., with steel you might get a truly impressive cut. Have the bandaids handy.
Years ago there was a truly great (and huge!) layout called the Victoria Northern, build by a Canadian doctor named I think Roy Dohn. Dr Dohn had the interesting idea of inserting 2x4s into the walls of his basement so the layout had no legs (it might be the house and basement were custom constructed after the layout had been all planned – my cousin actually did this) Someone wrote into MR pointing out that while this would work for a while over time the wood would wick moisture and rot (perhaps up in Canada they do not worry about termites). I do not know if this ever actually happened, and I would think that by now Dr Dohn is long since deceased. Between moisture and insects wood is not optimal perhaps but the alternatives all involve problems and issues of their own.
Dave Nelson
Wow.
I need to do some reading and exploring in the home depot, lowes etc. And my wife even asked me “does it matter?” because the house is wood set on concrete. However, it was a good experience to express this as a idea and listen (Read) all the wonderful ideas and not so good issues such as medical aid, and conductivity. Another friend mentioned that the road bed may even transmit noise to the frame in harmony with the engine running down the track. (Scary)
Ty for helping me explore this idea in greater detail.
Lee
Rather than using steel, what about plastic composites? They would be easier to cut and smooth, but perhaps not as sharp.
Would soldering a sheet copper shield over the rough spots (then pounding it in to shape) be better than working with steel? I ask this because I think copper is more malleable than steel.
Isnt copper magnetic?
Plastic mmmm (In style of Homer Simpson)
We ahve plastic everything, why not sized componets precut for framing? Saves expense of building a power tool suite just to assemble wood frame.
Hmm, this may be a heck of a market.
I just built a new module and made the legs from 1 1/2 PVC pipe. I mounted caps to frame so I can pull the legs to turn the module to go out the door. It’s a bit wobbly, but is OK when hooked to other modules. FRED
Many years ago ( I think the late 40’s or fiftys) a guy built the framework out of black iron pipe with unions installed for dismantling if needed. He then used a 1x4 frame on top but in this day and age foam could be layed right on top. 1/2" black iron pipe is pretty cheap and probably comparable to 1x4 wood pricing if not cheaper.
This last weekend I saw an outdoor deck using a material that is partly recycled plastic and partly wood. It said it was resistant to insects. However to me it looked heavy and dense and hard to work with. But there might be some potential in it.
Dave Nelson
Well, if you want to see photos of a large home layout being built of steel framing, visit kbhrr.com and look in the ‘layout’ area. In our part of the country (Chicago) current price of a 2x4x 10 foot quality lumber stud is $3.10 the steel version is $1.70. Track base will be 1/4" ply with 2" pink foam top. We’ve found that this provides extra sound deadening. We think due to the difference in the density properties of the two materials.
Art
The pink foam insulation is actually a hard surface, which tends to reflect sound. The Facility Manager where I work insulated a ceiling in a meeting room in an attempt to block outside sounds. He ended up creating a giant sounding board.
Another option you might consider for termite avoidance is redwood–it costs more than your average 2x4 but cheaper than structural steel, just as easy to work on with traditional methods, and termites don’t eat redwood. Plus, it’s pretty. It’d be perfect if you were interested in modeling Northcoast logging lines, too…
I have a 4 x 8 layout. I started with just 2 8’ metal studs. I placed them 2 feet apart and glued on a blue sheet of foam (4 x 8 x 2"). It’s light, ridgid, and I am happy with the sound. The only wood on the layout is in my mountain (paint stir sticks hot glued to make a rough frame for cardboard stripes and plaster hardshell.) Asyou can probably guess, I’m on budget. the steel studs are cheaper than 2x4s. The paint sticks were free. the cardboard came out of the recycle bin and the plaster of paris is way cheaper than Hydrocal.
I think everyone was picking up on my comment about sound qualities, rather that the original question about termites. I don’t believe that there would be any problems at all and the lower price would make the learning curve of a new product worth the effort.
Art
The plastic lumber material that everyone is referring to is known as “Trex” up here in Oregon. My dad looked into it for constructing a retaining wall and was firmly warned off using it for any activity that required structural strength or stiffness. The stuff basically sags over and inbetween the studs used to keep it off the ground so forklifts can lift it.
I would be extremely leery of using it for benchwork.
Jeff