I think that is the right term. I have been able to pull 36 cars max so far. Track does have a grade to it around 3 degress to my lack of skill with wood things. But power of the engines is not the problem. If or should I miss spell thing go bad it is at the 18" turns, car just fall over.
The tight end of the track with the 18" turns is only 44", will a 22" turn fit? Boy you folks will wish I never joined this site.
Cars have weight added but never weighed, most cars have 3 pennys glued on the inside of the car.
Cuda Ken, feel like a child again because I know nothing again!
One thing you will need is something called easements. Sadly I have no links for that just now.
Maybe someone else does though.
Also you may just have to redo that section to make sure it is level side to side [rail to rail].
Another thing to look for is that where the rails join that they are perfectly joined. By that I mean they are not out of alignment. You can file them into position but don’t file too much.
I think the name for it is “stringlining”, Ken. The resistance of the cars behind the coupler where it happens is too much, as is the draw ahead of that coupler, and enough so the car can’t follow and stay in the tracks at the same time. The car falls on it side due to torque, mayber torsion…if I have that right. Weighting the cars even more might solve the problem, but now you are limiting the engine, not to mention possibly wearing the bearings everywhere. A better fix might be increasing the radii, and if that is not really practical/possible, lengthening the coupler shank, or switching to one that pivots a few degrees on a secondary pivot, might help a great deal.
It is generally a bad idea to place your track closer than about 2" to the edge at a height where a falling loco or car could be damaged. If you must, then build in a safety barrier of plexiglass if you want it invisible, or use sturdy bushes, trees, a hedgerow, a log fence, a berm of earth, or a rock wall. So, you could get 22" curves in the area you describe, but it would not look good, nor would it be safe. Adding a 4" shelf to that side would permit the use of 22" curves, and you may get the solution you seek…though maybe not. Build a mockup of 22" curves with the same arrangement of track, and find out for yourself if the cars will track better.
As Crandall (selector) says, it’s called “stringlining”. There are a couple of ways you can run 18" curves without that issue. One (and the most effective one) is to make sure all your cars have free-rolling wheels. Most out-of-the-box cars have pretty poor ones, unless you’re spending the big bucks to buy the high-end ready-to-run cars. A dragging car, particularly one at the rear of the train, can pull the string tight and dump everything to the inside of the curve. Proto 2000 wheels are an easy fix, and will fit most truck sideframes with no problems.
Once your wheels will roll freely - a light push should send them halfway around the layout - then weighting the cars to NMRA standards would be the next step. That’s 1 ounce plus 1/2 ounce per inch of car length. A 40’ boxcar in HO would weigh about 3 1/2 oz. Keep your weights mounted low in the car, or you’ll make the car top-heavy, compuonding the stringlining issue.
I ran long trains when I had a 4x8 layout around 18" curves with no problems, with the cars rolling freely, even with the cars not all weighted to spec. Had one so long the engine was about an inch from the tail of the caboose… No derailments.
Need about 48" or a little more to get 22" radius curves. Adding a fence of some sort is always a good idea – dropping to concrete floor is bad for most train equipment.
My preference is Intermountain wheelsets. Needlepoint machined metal axle ends turn easier than dipped plastic axle ends. Accurail and MDC truck sideframes seem to work the best. Some Athearn BB trucks have too much slop, derail once in a while. Walthers trucks seem to work best when not used under rolling stock, perhaps a shop scene.
You can’t fit a 22" radius curve in only 44" of space - but you CAN fit an easement before and after the 18" radius portion. This would certainly help. Proper weight of th cars and free-rolling wheels are also important. So is smooth handling of the train - sudden starts and stops will certainly knock cars off the track on a long train on 18" radius curves no matter how good the wheels are.
An easement is a gradual easing into a curve. If you ave 18" radius sectional track, you are going from perfectly straight to 18" curve instantly. A true easement requires a bit of math and flex track, you can approximate it close enough for models using a thin stick, fastened in the straight line at one end and bent to the final curve at the other end. The center of the stick will naturally form a gradually increasing. With sectional track you can sort of cheat and use 22" radius sections at the start and end of the curve - the exact geometry is shown in one of the Atlas track planning books. It’s not a true easement but it’s better than none.
Depending on how big this layout is, 356 cars in one train might just be too many. It’s fun sometimes to see just how many cars our favorite locos can pull, but when the train stretches across 3/4 of the layout at one time, it tends to start looking silly.
Randy - I always felt the math behind the easement was too difficult so I have never messed with easements. Your stick method seemed like something I couild do, However I am not sure about the details. Could you go thru it again on the level of “Easements by the stick method for Dummies”? Tks look forward to your response.
Terry[8D]
I have up grade about 65% of my cars. I have cleaned up the trucks and used Atlas wheels. I should have used 2000’s wheels but they where out of 33" wheels at the time. Atlas are better than what I had.
I am going to added a little more board so I can run the 22" turns.
Also need to up grade the cars with Kadee couplers as well.
Ken I have found that putting metal wheels, KD couplers and proper NMRA weight on my rolling stock have made a significant difference in how they operate. The first year or so of my hobby was very disheartening. Nothing seemed to want to stay on the rails. Now derailments are almost always because this Goober forgets to throw a T/O or parks a car on the tracks and forgets about it until you hear the CRUNCH.
Terry[8D]
Do you happen to have Armstrong’s book Track Planning for Realistic Operation? It’s well illustrated in there. I was looking for a web site with a good picture but didn’t see any. It’s pretty much as I described, fasten one end of a flexible stick (thin molding works well) in lne witht he straight portion of the track. bend it into the curve and fasten the far end at the curve radius. The free middle will describe a gentle increase in curvature from strgith to the full curve radius. Draw along this to mark the location to lay your track. The needed offsets and how long the stick has to be are mentioned in Armstrong’s book.
Randy as a matter of fact I do have the book and have read it several times. I guess I’m going to have to lay some track out and try it. Thanks and I will go back and re read the section on Easements. May have to bug you again.
Terry[8D]