I must be from another planet. It becomes obvious that model railroading has become a hobby one purchases; sets up and operates. I feel like I"m a dinosaur. I purchased a solenoid switch machine when they were in vogue, then used it as a pattern and used my Unimat jewelers lathe to construct my own from scrap metal and some purchased wire. Cheap does not describe the cost of the switch machines I used on the layout I had back then.
Recently I purchased a slow motion switch machine and carefully disassembled it. Using scrap I had from other projects; my trusty old jewelers lathe and some wire; I was able to make my own switch machine for less than half the cost of the purchased item. I’m curious when I hear people moan about costs. This is a hobby; make some of the things you use yourself; save yourself a grundle of cash, become a craftsman, learn somethng new. This is a hobby; there is no finishline; there is no cash reward at the end.
Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately, I have no interest in doing the things you do, presumably things that motivate you. I have other activities that compete for my time, but I still have a strong hankering to run trains. So, apart from building a layout from scratch, and learning how to make spline roadbed and handlaid turnouts of a couple kinds, and wiring it all so that it ran, I would rather cut some time requirements and pay someone else to make the finnicky stuff…finnicky to me.
You are not alone, though. Many in the hobby still make their own locomotives and scratchbuild wonderfully intricate structures.
While I am not an RTR fan, in defense of “those” guys, there are advantages to having lots of folks building their layout with RTR equipment.
for those whose primary model railroading goal is prototype operations, quality RTR gets them into their desired operational mode many years or even decades sooner than if they had to build everything themselves.
RTR allows a beginner to have a reasonably realistic layout without having to learn all the skills first. He can enjoy running his trains before he learns how to build everything himself.
RTR is more profitable for manufacturers. Items are sold at higher prices relative to costs. Customer service and packaging is very costly for suppliers of craftsman kits and detail parts.
RTR guys buy in much larger quantities - one can only have so many unbuilt kits and projects sitting on the shelf at home before sanity prevails.
The larger quantities and revenues from RTR allow and encourage manufacturers to produce a much wider variety of goods.
Personally, I pick and choose what I wil buy and what I will make. Building my own switch machine seems like a waste of my time; I use manual controls instead with an occasional twin coil or Tortoise where needed. The same with electro-magnets - in less time I install rare earth cylinders, or hinged or sliding under the ties magnets for my uncouplers. I saw my Homasote myself from sheets. Building my own throttle, hand laying track, bashing and redoing low end locomotives and train set cars, building cars from kits, building and bashing wood or cardstock structure kits - these are all things I do to save money and/or enjoy my hobby time on my terms.
But I do appreciate what the RTR folks bring to the hobby -
Maybe its the tiny economist hiding inside of me, but this isn’t always true.
I had selected or designed three different mechanisms for turnout control. I decided that I’d have to build a test version of each one. Two of them would never see action, after the prototype phase. They all had production costs of less than $5 a unit. However, I decided that the time to construct each one, work the bugs out, and ultimately construct multiples of each would exceed the cost of using a commercially available product with a shorter construction time. The price of my own labor was greater than the increased price of the commercial product and the estimated time of labor was far lower. I’d rather devote my labor and my time on something else instead of making turnout controls.
The hobby is one which has many facets. Each of us can choose not only what to model, when to model, but also how to model. Personally, I’ll buy my switch machines, and run them with simple toggles. At the same time, though, i’ve been making my own trees this time around. I’ve spent more than my typical month-per-square-foot working on a swamp in an awkward, empty space on my layout. I’ve picked up more stuff at the craft shops and in my own back yard than I have at the LHS.
How much is a grundle? How about no switch machines at all? I make the little over center springs and hand throw with a skewer. I get a bundle of .015 spring wire for under a buck and get about 20 to 25 springs from a 3 foot piece. They are faster to make and instal than it is getting my pliers and cutters out.
There are those who like working with their hands and those who can’t wait that long so the buy what they want. It all comes down to the way you like to do things.
I don’t think that most of us have the means or the knowledge to do what you did. I think we all in the hobby become creative in our own way. I don’t know how many of use own a jewelers lathe.
Not all of us have the time to make your own selenoid switches.
I have 24 Peco switches, with the Peco switch machines, and it was a lot work installing these. Then I installed 24 NCE switch-its for all DCC control of my switches.
It took quit a bit of time, energy, and patience to get this installed and working correctly. I can’t imagine adding any more work than necessary just to save a few bucks.
To each his own, there are many ways to enjoy the hobby.
Going back to Economics 101, did you amortize the cost of the lathe into the price of the products?
There are a lot of ways to throw switch points. Most of them don’t require any kind of electrical machine, purchased or home-fabricated. I use cheap electrical slide switches to provide both locking and electrical contacts, and make linkages from such exotic materials as fishing leader, paper clips and worn out 1/4-20 hex nuts.
Even though I’m fully retired, I think of my time as a valuable commodity. Like Crandell, there are a lot of things I would rather do than manufacture solenoid switch machines. So, where I have to use them, I use commercial products - and control them by the stud-and-probe method. I still save a bundle, but at the opposite end of the wires. (I also save wire $$ by polarizing the activating power with cheap diodes. Since one diode costs about the same as 15 inches of wire, if the wire run exceeds 5 feet I save money. Most of my wire runs are a lot longer than 5 feet.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - inexpensively)
Those who buy everything will never know the feeling of satisfaction one gets when placing something on the layout that you have designed and constructed with your own hands. Too bad. They are still “model railroaders”, but they miss a great part of the fun in the hobby.
This is undoubtedly true. However, they might also never know the satisfaction of being able to run a working scale layout at all otherwise. Something to think about.
Again, true, the last part, but why is it “too bad”? That’s a value judgement. Would it be better that they don’t get to run a layout of any description because they are spending so much time trying to find the experience you feel is necessary? When do they get to assign a value to what they feel is most valuable, such as their time, expenses for tools, etc.?
Actually, it’s the first time I’ve heard of anyone actually making his own solenoid switch machines in this day and age. For that alone, I found it interesting. Other than that, though, we can live without another “this hobby costs too much” or “RTR vs. Scratchbuilt” thread.
No, you’re probably not from another planet, but neither do you seem to be able to grasp the concept that different people have different interests, abilities and priorities.
For example, I don’t own any machine tools, and I have no real inclination to buy or learn how to use them. My interests are more oriented towards operations and the electrical/control aspects of the layout.
So for me, it’s simpler, more economical, and quicker to simply buy switch machines than it would be to set up even a basic machine shop to make them on my own.
Those savings allow me to invest more time and money into “making” some of the things I use, such as the operational scheme, layout control logic, etc, save myself a grundle(?) of cash by not investing in machine tools, become an electrical/control craftsman, and learn something new, such as lots of things about how/why a prototype railroad operates.
I remember on this forum someone had comtempt for layouts that were all RTR with nothing scratch built. Or HO highrail layouts. I had my private thoughts about him.
If you had designed and built your own switch machines, I would be impressed. But taking someone else’s hard work, sweat, and investment and copying it? That’s simply stealing, in my opinion, and nothing to brag about.