This past summer, Marklin sponsored a US trip to visit the existing Big Boys that are on display across the country.
Which one do you think is in the best mechanical condition?
How long would a restoration take and what would it cost to be ready for tourist service?
Just thought I’d ask.
Ken
Proprietor of the Southamton, Sag Harbor and Montauk Line: The Route to the end.
Not having visited the display locos recently, I can’t say which would be the most likely prospect for rebuilding. Actually, the whole point is moot:
UP has made it clear that they have no interest in seeing a Big Boy returned to the rails. I’m willing to bet that if somebody really mounted a serious campaign to do so UP’s legal beagles would battle the project foot, horse and Marines.
Even if the UP decided to allow it, repairs and modifications to bring an aged Big Boy up to present day safety and environmental standards would probably run between five and ten million dollars (depending on how much volunteer labor would be used and how long the work would take. Fast work by paid professionals = $$$$$!!!)
It would almost certainly be necessary to do some serious upgrading on whatever rails the Big Boy would ride. Whether rebuilding and upgrading existing track or building a complete, new tourist route, trackwork capable of handling the stresses developed by a large, heavy steam locomotive is NOT an inexpensive proposition.
If the Big Boy and its track were available, there’s the little(!) matter of operating expenses. How would ticket prices be allocated to cover day-to-day outlay, debt service and debt reduction? Unless Bill Gates decided that he couldn’t live without a Big Boy powered 1:1 scale model railroad, the answer would almost certainly be unsatisfactory, even if every railfan in the country arranged to ride every year.
Don’t you hate it when reality intrudes on your dream world?
Chuck
Chuck,
Reality bites. However, as UP donated these to various governments, charitable entites etc., I don’t think they would have anything to object to. Current mainline is 132 lb welded rail, that’s above what was used when the Big Boy was in service, so I don’t think there’s an engineering problem. I’m guessing a survey would run about $50,000 each with travel time, metallurgy/rust testing, x-rays etc. I think one of the costlier aspects is the asbestos removal. Also, I’m not sure where the machine work could be done in the US…pehaps China? Now that would be a pip. We now get our model trains from China, why not our prototype rebuilds?
I don’t doubt your $10 million guesstimate. Just dreaming…
Mechanical condition is of secondary importance when restoring a large, modern steam loco. Boiler condition is what you need to consider - that’s where the bulk of restoration work lies, and where the bulk of the money will be spent. Chuck’s figures are about right, I would think. I 've seen four of the extant Big Boys, and without subjecting any of them to a detailed examination, I got the distinct impression that they were all as rotten as a chop. Some have been stored without having been drained first, while others have suffered damage from wet lagging. You mentioned asbestos. Apart from the health risks associated with it, wet asbestos lagging is a major cause of external corrosion and pitting on preserved loco boilers. So if it is present it cause two big problems. All would require a massive effort to steam again. Bear in mind that most US steam locos were withdrawn at the end of their economic life, and unlike fine wines, they don’t improve with age. Even if you found an engine that had been overhauled immediately prior to being withdrawn, fifty-odd years standing out in the weather won’t have done it any favours. But all that notwithstanding, Chuck’s comment about modern track is valid. Yes, the rail may be heavier than during the steam era, but over the years there have been subtle changes to track geometry in critical areas like curve easements and turnouts to accomodate diesels, at the expense of steam operations. Me, I don’t think you’d ever attract enough passengers to make an operating Big Boy worth your while. Cheers, Mark. (Former licensed boiler inspector.)
Ya I think clearances would be an issue in many areas especially curves and turnouts/crossovers. Mallets were awfully big and took up a lot of length AND width when not going straight.
I expect it could go anywhere the Challenger goes, but I also expect it is not going to happen.
UP must have had a wonderful PR machine.
Why is it these 25 locos that had a restricted habitat get so much attention? I have been looking for a photo of a light Mikado to see what it looks like. There were about 10,000 Mikados built (light heavy whatever 2-8-2) and only 25 Big Boys. But if we look for photos we would think the opposite is the case.
Similarly with models. There must be lots of Wyoming layouts around the US. I look at the ads in MR and just about every manufacturer has a Big Boy. But how many make a light Mikado?
I have this strange idea that my layout should have a loco population something like in the real world. So a type that was the backbone of the freight motive power at one time would be more strongly represented than a prima donna type that was confined to a small operating area for a specific task.
And preserved locos?? There are eight out of 25 Big Boys in various states of decomposition across the States. 32% of those built. A hard working honest class like mikes and 1% of them have been preserved!!
See also the site http://www.steamlocomotive.com/bigboy/ . The claim that the Big Boy was the largest steam loco is not even beyond dispute.
I call this Big Boy disease. A tiny insignificant class of locos gets publicity way beyond its due.[swg] That should draw the crabs!! [tup]
I am not a kill joy. Actually I love the big hulks of engine too!! If I modelled US prototype I would probably have one of the things.[:I] Just pointing something out that appeals to me as strange. [2c]
I have visited and looked at all eight of the preserved Big Boys and it is impossible to judge a book by its cover without looking into the mechanical portions of the locomotive. Most of the Big Boys went out of service having received back shop work at Cheyenne up to late 1957 and ome work into1958.
The 4004 in the park at Cheyenne is in a flood zone and this engine had several feet of water around it a few years ago. That probably caused much bearing damage that could not be repaired without extensive cost. The 4012 at Steamtown has spent forty winters in harse weather including the first twenty or so years in the Vermont snow. The 4014 at Los Angeles probably has less weather damage than any of the other Big Boys including the 4018 at Dallas, since LA has a very mild climate. The 4018 at Dallas was inspected about three or four years ago for possible rebuilding by a so called movie company, and it was moved and checked for both mechanical and boiler condition. It was deemed OK for rebuilding at that time, but they had no money to do the project. If you knew the mileage ran after the last rebuiling for the 4014 or 4018 before retirement, that would be the deciding factor in the best to be rebuilt factor in my opinion.
The 4023 certainly looks the best today as it was just repainted recently when it was mounted in Kenefick Park with the 6900. This engine was the last to leav