Saturday, April 1st, I caught a UPRR Ballast Train in Delta Colorado, on the North Fork Branch. Parked on the side track in the small yard in Delta.
Can anybody comment on how these trains are used and operate ? Looks like the hoppers can conveyor the ballast from one car to the next, then the conveyor booms offload the rock. What are the 2 power units at the end of the train. The green container on the flat car on the end looks to be a shop / tool shed.
Steve
It’s encouraging to see a ballast train on this line. I heard the North Fork coal mines production was down.
We have gone from 3 mines several years ago down to 1. The West Elk Mine loads maybe 4-5 trains a week.
Steve
No ‘ballast’ cars are seen so I don’t think it is a ballast train. It looks, however, like a ballast cleaning operation.
Georgetown Dump Train…semi=permanently coupled,under hopper conveyor system. Would assume it is a leased set from GRR. Unusual that UP RR left it parked at all. (Turn, churn & burn 24/7/365 with those expensive and rare rascals!)
So … how does ballast cleaning work ?
Steve
Ballast cleaning train.
http://www.plasseramerican.com/en/machines-systems/ballast-bed-cleaning.html
Here’s the Georgetown dump train.
https://georgetownrail.com/Material-Handling/DumpTrain
You can also see them on the UP. Met a double set today going back for more rock.
Jeff
My limited MofW knowledge is causing me to wonder about the benefits of the GREX Dump Train. Both Herzog and GREX have their GPS ballast trains being used by the Class 1 carriers - dump 8K tons of ballast where desired at 10-15 MPH thus minimizing track time. I am not able to visualize the problem that the Dump Train solves. The GREX video didn’t WOW me.
The UP seems to use the GREX train to place piles of rock for smaller projects at strategic locations. Then MOW can access the rock at their leisure. I’ve had the train a few times, both as an engineer and conductor. Stop, they dump some rock, maybe move up a couple of cars, dump some more. Then go 10 miles and repeat the process. Move up and repeat until the train is empty or you’re out of time. Either track time or HOS.
Jeff
I would opine that the difference is in the boom. It gives the ability to put stone pretty much anywhere the boom will reach. Methinks most ballast trains will only dump under themselves.
OTOH, I’m not a MOW guy, so I’m not sure how often that ability has value. Seems like washouts and similar situations would require such a capability, vs a ballast train/car.
Larry/ tree68 has it pretty much right. Georgetown says the boom will reach to 52’ from the \C/L o the track. Also, that it can handle rock up to 3" size, which is a little larger than normal ballast stone.
The versatility of DumpTrain and DumpTrain for Curves lends itself to a wide range of applications. Put it to work for your railroad to expedite formerly labor-intensive tasks:
Note that ballast placement isn’t in this list - that’s more for the specialized and high-volume ballast trains. Instead, the Dump Train is more for ‘spot’ projects that need a different size stone, small quantities, precise placement, etc. that a ballast train couldn’t do. The video shows some of them - a non-obvious one is placing ballast on partially supported ‘skeleton’ track (new construction or washed-out) either ahead or adjacent, where running a ballast train with locomotives and fully loaded ballast cars would risk bending the rails and other damage to the track.
Mea-culpa - Bad resolution on the monitor I had yesterday. It is an undercutter set up with the extra screens.
Balt: Being that the air dump is getting to be a rare bird (between chronic lack of maintenance by mechanical and typical lack of priority/shoddy handling by operating with the few survivors) … the dump trains can be a blessing where you have a need for ballast in compact work spaces… on the other hand the thing has its limits - don’t try to deliver screenings/chat/waste/fines with the thing. Trying to unload a conventional hopper full of ballast to stockpile is a giant, ineffectual waste of time & effort.
Back to the original post - Grand Junction/Roper to Delta to Hotchkiss/Paonia/Sommerset is way overdue for Mr. Undercutter plus the steel bridge at Hotchkiss is in the process of overhaul & replacement.Hopefully the ground does not freeze up to delay the undercutter’s effectiveness.
Mudchicken,
Question about the above post. What is Roper ? ( Grand Junction/Roper )
And your reference to the steel bridge replacement in Hotchkiss ? Are you referring to the 3 span steel truss bridges over the Gunnison that were replaced with a concrete steel bridge in 2016 ? That bridge is located in Austin, between Delta and Hotchkiss.
Steve
I wondered about that - but anything I’ve ever seen about undercutters showed them in operation, not with all the works parked/nested.
Steve had a question about ballast cleaning.
Essentially, it’s pulling the ballast out with the track still in place, screening out the “undesirable elements,” then putting the ballast back. It would then be resurfaced per usual procedures (tampers).
Almost like when they grind away a highway/road asphalt surface and use the same material to repave.
Ballast works best when it’s all rock against rock. Good ballast “interlocks,” and will hold a pretty steep profile. If the ballast gets contaminated with “fines,” it doesn’t hold as well. Fines can be pretty much anything - sand, coal dust (a major problem on the PRB lines), or whatever.
It’s probably not as good as it would be if the ballast was removed and replaced with nice, fresh, new rock, but it’s a whole lot better than doing nothing at all.
I’m sure MC can expand as needed.
[quote user=“tree68”]
mudchicken
Mea-culpa - Bad resolution on the monitor I had yesterday. It is an undercutter set up with the extra screens.
I wondered about that - but anything I’ve ever seen about undercutters showed them in operation, not with all the works parked/nested.
Steve had a question about ballast cleaning.
Essentially, it’s pulling the ballast out with the track still in place, screening out the “undesirable elements,” then putting the ballast back. It would then be resurfaced per usual procedures (tampers).
Almost like when they grind away a highway/road asphalt surface and use the same material to repave.
Ballast works best when it’s all rock against rock. Good ballast “interlocks,” and will hold a pretty steep profile. If the ballast gets contaminated with “fines,” it doesn’t hold as well. Fines can be pretty much anything - sand, coal dust (a major problem on the PRB lines), or whatever.
It’s probably not as good as it would be if the ballast was removed and replaced with nice, fresh, new rock, but it’s a whole lot better than doing nothing at all.
I’m sure MC can expand as needed.
[
What is Roper? Roper is the former Rio Grande yard in Salt Lake City.
(answered while trying to enteer Penn Station in New York after sitting in Newark, N.J. on an Acela for almost an hour. I have not yet heard just what the problem is.
We are now under the Hudson.
East Yard is the larger of the two yards at Grand Junction. Roper is at SLC and pretty much calls the shots at the greatly diminished East Yard which has been demoted to a flat switching yard like ATSF Pueblo. The track alignment on the North Fork Branch is still hindered by it’s narrow gauge origins, late as they were. The river bridge project is only partially complete and that took way too long to make happen. Kinda weird still to see the milesposts on the NF branch changed to accomodate math challenged operating guys confused by the original three digit numbers. (Same thing happened on the Denver-Pueblo joint line, creates all kinds of “fun” when dealing with legal documents and contracts.)
The East yard in Grand Juction used to be a hump yard, but was changed quite some time ago.
Which bridge are you referring to when you say “The river bridge project is only partially complete” ? I just posted pictures of the Gunnison River bridge replacement here in the General Disicussion Forum. That Project was done in 2015.
Here is the link to that posting. http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/111/t/262228.aspx
Steve
The pictures in my first post were taken Saturday April 01. Today, Tuesday April 04 the train was still parked in the same place. Here are additional photos.
By the way, that white stuff is alkali, not snow.
Steve