I’m curious how prototype railroad operating rules handle trains passing by a passenger train stopped to allow passengers to board or exit at a small passenger depot. Specifics: there are two tracks adjacent to the depot. The one closest to the station is the mainline; the other track is a passing siding or the second mainline if double tracked. There are rail-level passenger platforms between the station and the mainline and between the two tracks.
Situation 1. The passenger train is on the track closest to the station. Would a train be allowed to pass it, and if so, at what speed?
Situation 2. The passenger train is on the far track and the other train passes on the track closest to the station (between the station and the passenger train.) Would this be absolutely forbidden or would some extraordinary precautions be required?
Bearing in mind that Rights of Trains is rather generic:
Rule 105, page 32. “Trains and engines using other than a main track must proceed at yard speed.” That would indicate that a train running through a siding (or loop, as our overseas brethren call it) would have to move at whatever the railroad defined as yard speed - usually 15± MPH. Usually, at a small country station, the track closest to the station would be the main.
Rule 107, page 33. “When a passenger train is receiving or discharging traffic on the side toward a station, a train or engine must not pass between it and the station unless proper safeguards are provided.” Once again, “Proper safeguards,” would be defined by the railroad - anything from a station agent waving a red lantern to portable fence and platoon of militia, plus “engine not to exceed walking speed,” and continuous use of bell and whistle.
That covers what went on up to 1957 (the most recent copyright date for Rights of Trains.) I don’t doubt that things have gotten even more restrictive since.
The NORAC book (NORAC 8 - effective 1 January 2003) makes no mention of passing a train discharging passengers on the track nearest the platfrom.
However, Rule 121 - When a passenger train is receiving or discharging passengers across an intervening track, trains and track cars must not pass between that train and the station platform.
A supplementary question since you have the rule book and I do not: was any speed limit imposed on through trains on the main line running through a station?
I remember when I was based in the UK 30 years ago the trains that were not stopping moved through the station at a fine clip. Flat out I would think, with no regard for us on the platform.
That was an excellent demonstration of Doppler effect BTW![:P]
Hey Nick,
Sorry your post came in while I was writing the original version of this. Took me a while because I am “working” at the office and had a few distractions. Like work.
You also have a go at answering with the up to date rule book please?
As I noted, Rights of Trains is generic. Speed limits through stations are among the things that Peter Josserand passed off to the rules of the specific company.
I do know that I have seen express trains on the center tracks pass through local stations (platforms outside the ‘loop’ tracks) at a speed measurable in triple digits. Even with aerodynamic design, the displaced air was gale force on the platforms. (JNR Shinkansen)
I have no personal, specific knowledge of US railroad speed limits. Sorry I can’t be more helpful
Chuck (who models a prototype that had a maximum speed of 70kph - downhill, with a tailwind)
I’ll just add that on my favorite prototype, the Santa Fe, the most common arrangement in small towns was for the station to be adjacent to the main line, with the passing siding (if there was one) on the opposite side of the main track. There were exceptions, of course, but wherever the railroad could do so it followed this pattern. Santa Fe rulebooks include the same prohibition others have cited against a train passing between a passenger station and a train receiving or discharging passengers. So long, Andy
I’m looking at 1930-1940 era Southern Pacific “common standard plans” on stations and their platforms, appropriate for the typical small town.
For a combination freight/passenger station, the mainline was at least 37 feet from the mainline track center, and any passing siding would be outside that. There was to be a platform on the station side of the mainline and an island platform between the mainline and other track. The house track was to run behind the station, with the track center 7 feet 3 inches from the freight platform edge. Where necessary at small unimportant stations, the house track could pass between the station and mainline, with the same clearances, with the station still 37 feet from the mainline.
For a passenger-only station the 37-foot rule still applied, with the platforms between the mainline and station and an island platform. For such a station with a house track between station and mainline, there were two island platforms (between the house track and mainline and between the mainline and secondary mainline track).
The edges of the platforms were to be 4 feet 9 inches from track center and at rail height. Island platforms were to be 9 feet 6 inches more than the width of the platform. The plan shows a platform outside the secondary mainline (used when there is a subway or overhead bridge between platforms) of 8 feet for important stations and 6 feet for unimportant stations. I assume this width would also apply to the island platforms, making the track centers at the island platform of 15.5 to 17.5 feet (about 2.135 inches to 2.4 inches in HO scale).
On page 89 of George Drury’s Southern Pacific in the Bay Area there is a picture of the Owl (overnight passenger train between Oakland and Los Angeles, CA) drifting into Martinez on the eastbound track adjacent to the station. (Martinez was and still is a pretty busy place since traffic from the Shasta [north], Overland [east], and San Joaquin [south] routes pass through it on the way to and from Oakland.) The eastbound train (which will later turn south) is shown passing its westbound counter-part which is loading mail and express from the center platform. Passengers, thank God, are not visible on the center platform. However, there are railroad personnel shown handling express, etc. on the center platorm with a baggage wagon. (photo taken April 22, 1950)
(Track arrangement at Martinez has changed. The center platform is now in two sets of double tracks. The eastbound trains use the track adjacent to the station. The westbound trains use the third track. The current platform is 17’11" wide and about a foot above rail height. There is also a new Ambrak station. The old SP depot remains.)
What were SP’s rules on trains passing passenger trains stopped at station platforms? The above picture seems to violate other rule book citations. Thanks.
There are no speed restictions on moving through at station in the NORAC book. I’ve often been on a station platform waiting for SEPTA while Amtrak goes by at 60 mph. I’ve also boarded or disenbarked from SEPTA, while Amtrak sceamed by on the adjacent track.
However, the Timetable/Special Instructions book can limit speed through stations. I’m not familar with any restrictions in the Conrail TSI book. Although, if I can lay my hands on a SEPTA or Amtrak TSI book, I can give you a better answer.
That sort of information is invaluable to help the guys make realistic looking stations. Of course if not modelling SP they would have to consider if their prototype most likely used similar plans.
One thing that caught my attention was the term “unimportant stations.” That was written before the days of being politically correct. Can you imagine the local dignitaries in a small town fuming if they found out the railroad classified “their” station as “unimportant”?