What do you use to make your wire connections

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

Hi,

a friend and I were discussing on how to make the wire connections for the lighting and track feeders from the main buss wires. We both agreed that the rail feeders would have to be soldered, but after that our ideas differed.

In the past I have soldered all the wire joints. On the last couple layouts all of my joints have been with marretts. Being a electrician I have come to appreciate the reliability of marretts, having used many thousands on the jobs that have been done by crews under my direction. Marretts have been used in applications from 12 volt lighting to 600 volt with fractional current draws right up to 30 amp.

My friend on the other hand would like to use suitcase connectors. I have never used these connectors but have read good reviews here on the forum.

How well do they stand up over the long term. My concern is that a good connection depends on pressure and surface area. With suitcase connectors there is only a small contact surface which could create issues with high current draw. What is your experience? Do you solder everything?

So what do you use?

Frank

2

since you obviously know how to solder and already have everything needed, why change now. burn on, big iron, burn on.

grizlump

3

Without question, a soldered connection is the best approach. That said, I use suitcase connectors between the 22G feeders and the 12G bus.

Everything I’ve read plus my own experience indicate that the connectors are completely reliable for a stationary layout in a climate-controlled environment.

Considering the ease factor of making under-layout connections, the high reliability, and the simplicity of repairing failure, IMHO, the connectors are an obvious choice.

Ok all of you journeyman electricians out there… chime in… I can take it! [:'(]

Jim

4

I plan to use 22 AWG solid wire for my power drops from the rails to the 12 AWG stranded power bus. I plan to solder the drops to the power bus. I’m conservative and I want to make sure I have a solid connection without any future problems.

I’ve read mixed reviews about suitcase connectors. My impression is that if you use the 3M brand connectors and apply them correctly, that most people don’t have any problems with these. Depending on the wire gauges that you use, you may need to have two layers of suit case connectors to go from 22 AWG to 12 AWG wire.

Are marretts the same as wire nuts? If not, please describe. I’ve never seen the term before.

Bob

5

Bob

Marretts are the same as wire nuts. Marrett happens to be the name of one manufacturer of the nuts (perhaps the original - I’m not sure).

One word of caution - there used to be a type of wire connector that looked like a Marrett but instead of twisting the wires the connector used a brass ring with a set screw to clamp the wires together with a cap then screwed on over the ring. These are no longer legal (at least in Canada) because they can work loose over time. If you have any old style connectors like these it would be wise to pitch them.

Dave

6

I solder all the wire connections. I’ve used suitcase connectors before and after two or three years they always created problems and I would end up soldering the connections anyway.

7

Hi Bob,

this is what I meant with marrett: http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/wire-connectors/wire-connectors/electrical/ecatalog/N-8i5 . As you can see there is quite a variety available depending on the number and size of the conductors you wish to connect.

Frank

8

Hi jeffrey-wimberly,

you confirmed my suspicion that this type of connector due to the small surface area that makes the actual connection could create issues. I also agree that soldering is probably the best type of connection possible, just very time consuming.

Frank

9

What gets me is everyone is always harping about saving money !

YET!

They spend money on these connectors (which are not FREE)!!!

When soldering feeders to the Bus is FOREVER and a Solder joint costs next to nothing!

And I don’t understand the excuse about having to crawl under the layout to solder the wires.

I put the main bus wires at the outside edge of my layout (including the yards) and just solder the feeders sitting on my roll around stool!

As the old saying goes - work SMARTER not HARDER !

BOB H - Clarion, PA

10

I solder wires when I want them to be FOREVER. That would generally be at the rail connection. Under the layout, I’m a big fan of crimp connectors (uninsulated) and barrier strips (commonly called terminal strips). Not a wire nut or suitcase connector anywhere. Which is kinda strange, cause I’ve been an electrician for 35 years. The thing is wire nuts and the like are not really very good at disassembly. And I have this anxiety that thats what I’ll have to do. And sometimes it is.

Oh, yeah. They (wire nuts) don’t look very elegant, either. They do their job, though. How many thousand have I installed?

Ed

11

I agree with cmproducts, in that working from the front (facia) is the way to go. I had a bunch of termal bars (Multi terminal blocks) from the dc setup. I run a buss from blocks to blocks, then soder feeder to the rail and an eye to the block end, if I want to changeor move track i just unscrew the terminals and remove or replace them.

I did use wire nuts on a large swing up as it has eight turnouts on it, using multi tester wire for the buss as its very flexable.

suit case may be ok inside the house but have repaired many failures when used on heavy equipment and trailers,

enjoy keeping the cost down and to be user friendly, ease of trouble shooting, I dont work under the layout other then retrieving stuff LOL Take care…John

12

So far I have used suitcase connectors to connect the feeders to the bus with no problems.

For the rest of the wiring I solder spade connectors to the wires at the work bench and connect them togther under the layout using terminal strips. This may take a little extra work but it beats soldering under the layout, at least it does for me.

Happy Railroading

Bob

13

Frank,

Thanks for the link. I’ve bookmarked it for future reference. I don’t have a problem working under my layout benchwork since the track level is 56" off the floor. I just need to wear a lond sleeve shirt and eye protection for protection from hot solder. I plan to insulate the soldered joints with liquid insulation that you can get at Lowes or Home Depot.

Bob

14

Bob H, jwar41

Thank you! You have made my day.

I thought I was a voice crying in the wilderness, “Bring all your electricals out to the fascia line.” Now I find others picking up my mantra. You don’t know how good that makes me feel.

I use two kinds of connections, obviously influenced by my aircraft maintenance background. Rail power, and devices with soldering lugs, get soldered joints. Everything else is connected to a threaded connector, which is then torqued down. Intermediate connections are all made at stud-and-nut terminal blocks, with every terminal clearly labeled. My other wire connecting tool is a socket wrench.

I am adamantly opposed to anything which nicks the wire, then makes contact at the nick. This includes suitcase connectors and the ‘push-in’ terminal strips that have notched blades for termini. An aircraft electrician would be risking his certificate if he used them for anything.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)

15

I have used suitcase connectors. I use 3M brand with double blade and I use their tool. I find them easy to install and they work well. I don’t have long term results yet. The problems I have read about seem to involve using other brands and/or channel locks/pliers for crimping. They are a little pricey for each connector and the tool, so if you’re a deft hand at soldering you may want to go that route.

I also run the bus along the front of the layout and sit in my roll around desk chair to make the connections.

Enjoy

Paul

16

My current layout is the first one I have soldered everything on, and it is the first one I have never had an electrical problem on. Nuff said.

Brent[C):-)]

17

My model railroad is a group of HO scale NMRA standard (sorta) modules. I use terminal strips at each to connect the #14 bus wires to the Cinch Jones connectors. When I run the bus wires, I will strip a 1.5" section where I am planning a track feed and wrap it around a pan head “stinger” screw screwed into the underside of the module.

When track is installed, I solder #18 feeders to the track, and strip the end under the layout and wrap it around the screw. I then tighten the screw enough to secure the connection. Track drops near the ends are attached to the terminal strips.

The advantage of this method is that it is very easy to remove and replace a section of track or plug connection when they get damaged. It is also easy to reverse those feeders that were installed wrong, creating a short circuit (experience talking[banghead]). I have never had a connection under the module go bad, but I have had to resolder feeders to the track.

John, an electrician and electronics tech

18

Chuck & Others

Being a member of a model railroad Club for the past 25 years - I learned early on that the layouts had to run when the paying public came through the doors!

We used 3M Scotch Lock connectors on our Lionel Display layout for years. Then slowly the problems started showing up and the trains would run slow in some blocks.

All I had to do was reach under the layout and SHAKE the wires a little and the Scotch Locks would move a bit and the trains would SPEED back up!

We used #12 wire drops from the Gargraves track and were attached every section (just as any HO Layout should be done).

The Bus wires were also #12 wire - but the runs were short as we ran BLOCK DC !

But the main thing was all I had to do to fix the problem was SHAKE the WIRES !

We are rebuilding the Lionel Layout now and ALL WIRING is being SOLDERED !

BOB H - Clarion, PA

19

My feeders are soldered at the rails, but the buss is daisey chained from terminal strip to terminal strip on hinged boards that swing down at the front of each section of layout. My layout is built in 8 foot sections that are bolted together.

I never crawl under my layout to do electrical work.

20

Well here are a few thoughts from another life long modeler and electrician.

Frank, wire nuts, marretts (no body, even in the industry, calls them that in this part of this country - and my personal favorite is the Buchanan “B-cap”), are designed to connect wires that are otherwise well supported, that is mounted in junction boxes, supported only a few inches away by a connector or built in strain relief where it enters the box, etc - as you already know.

Tapping a DCC bus suspended under a layout (or along the front edge as suggested by some) is a different sort of situation. I see the problems with using any “twist on connector” for those splices. And I see long term problems for suitcase connectors as well - shake the wires!

Similar to Chuck and others, I use terminal strips. Either of the compression design into which you insert the wire in a lug, or I install crimp “sta-con” spade ends. I use strained wire.

DISCLAIMER - I am a DC modeler, no large gauge bus tapped by smaller conductors. I do not need multiple drops per “track section” (block to many of you), because all rail joints in each section are soldered or jumpered.

As others have mentioned, I avoid doing wiring under the layout. I install feed drops from track, build connection and relay panels on the bench, prewire cables to switch motors/ground throws, all so that all that is needed “under” the layout is a limited number of final connections at terminal strips.

My backgound as an electrician includes lots of machine tool control design and installation - back in the days of relays and early PLC’s. NEVER in a control system invironment would we have considered a “wire nut” to be acceptable - sta-cons and terminal strips. I’m talking about the controls for machines that - build autos, pump sewage, make paper boxes, mix paint, run the steel mill, bottle beer, and much more - if it holds up in those invironments, it will hold up in my train room.

So I vote for terminal strips of a