what does MRing need?

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
21

Agreed, but I don’t know how we can get that back? At least not on a large scale like when I was in that business.

In the 70’s there were over dozen train stores/hobby shops in the Baltimore Metro, today, two/three, maybe 5 if you count some of the ones in the “farther out suburbs”.

In fact, in this region, and I’m talking from Phily to Richmond, more of the successful shops are in truely rural areas, or very small towns, and not in the population centers.

Maybe this reflects who is a model railroader, where live, and where they will travel?

Sheldon

22

That is an interesting perspective, and I can’t disagree, but I don’t ha

23

Well, here is my list:

-Less expensive decoders. I can’t understand why the cost of simple decoders (motor control and headlight) has not come down

-Acrylic paint for model railroaders

-Good DIY decal systems

-DCC system with smartphone control capability “out of the box”

Simon

24

Simon, this is no way a criticism of your list, those are all very logical needs.

But just to show how diverse the hobby has become:

I don’t use DCC so I don’t need decoders, but I thought they had become pretty affordable?

I don’t use acrylic paint in my airbrush, and after one bad experiance with it I’m not in a hurry to try again. Happy with Scalecoat.

I’m a freelance modeler so decals are important to me, but based on what I have paid to have them made, I’m in no hurry to buy equipment make my own.

Even if I used DCC (which I have used a lot on other peoples layouts), I would not want a smartphone to ever control my trains. I would have to buy the smart phone…

And that is one of the challenges today, the hobby becomes ever more diverse with the march of time and technology, all the while those not already interested in railroading see less of it in real life.

Sheldon

25

I think that this says it all and says it well.

So, I will regurgitate Crandell’s main points.

It&

26

As a younger modeler with a “limited” income I can speak from experience when I say that model railroading is just too expensive sometimes. For example, here is how I started out when I got into “real” railroading. I wanted to get a decent dcc system. NCE powercab for example. $170 at a retailers sale. Dcc and sound equipped locomotive, let’s say an Atlas model, $200 on sale. Rolling stock? 5 accurail cars for $100. Then I need track. A basic oval with a passing siding is $60(atlas brand). Add in your wiring, benchwork and any incidental costs, and presto! You are north of 600$! Could you go cheaper? Absolutly! But this is the path I wanted to take. I wanted dcc, I wanted sound, I wanted a quality locomotive without paying for super duper details. So this is what I ended up with. Cost is my biggest limiting factor in the hobby, not space. Some railroaders complain that they don’t have enough space, which is a real problem, I’m not saying they don’t have a valid complaint. Yet here I am wishing I had the money to fill the space I do have. My two cents, take it as you will.

Also, I have met so so so many modelers that talk down to me just because I don’t have a basement sized layout, these older men’s attitudes are a real problem. Glance around the forum, look at some people’s reply’s, and you’ll see what I mean. Not to say the whole forum stinks, there are some real awesome people out there To be sure.

27

Well said, JDawg. [Y]

Rich

28

Thanks Rich

29

Folks, just so you know, this forum is “social media”. Seriously. Social media isn’t just Facebook and Twitter, it includes online forums like this one.

SeeYou190,
“Well made” and “affordable” are contradictory terms. [swg] In this hobby, like many others, you get what you pay for.

Lastspikemike,
Seriously? “…(E)xcessive obsession with detail and accuracy…”? This forum is all rainbows and unicorns compared to other model railroad forums I’ve seen. This has to be one of the least obsessed with detail and accuracy model railroad hobbby forums on the internet. The only one I’ve heard of that’s close is the old A.W.N.U.T.S. (Always Whimsical Not Usually To Scale) G-gauge group, but the modeling they did was (is?) first class even if it was bonkers.

As far as this group being intimidating, frankly any newbie to any group will feel that emotion. I recently joined an online forum that has nothing to do with this hobby, and I lurked for months before I made my first post because I didn’t want to step on any potential landmines against group culture.

dehusman,
The problem of doing pre-1900 stuff is physics and knowledge. Running 2-2-0’s hauling “stagecoaches on railwheels” at slow speeds isn’t much fun. Trying to operate before knuckle couplers isn’t great either. Trying to find accurate color information, loco/car information, etc. is close to impossible for some roads. I’m not saying it can’t be done (that recent Civil War layout in MR a while back was quite good), but it’s going to be a niche market (like Narrow Gauge modeling) for the forseeable future.

rrebell,
The best book I’ve ever seen on designing and building a model railroad is "How to Build Model Railroad Benchwork

30

Paul, do you mean like all the stuff that has not been made yet even with preorders?

Like a non brass B&O P7, B&O streamlined passenger cars built from heavyweights, a Challenger that is not a UP prototype, one, just one, modern 10 wheeler like a B&O B18, and on, and on.

I get it, I really do. But I’m 63 and my modeling is based on what I can by today, not what might be here next year or the year after.

Lucky for me I now have most of what I want after 50 years of “gathering”.

New layout starts soon.

Sheldon

31

An alternative to the much missed huge offering of turnouts from Shinohara.

32

I’ll be at right angles from most anybody else here.

What I’ve wanted ‘all these years’ is more functional realism in ‘relatively attainable’ technologies: steam-locomotive valve gear that works, control of diesel and steam that can be like the prototype rather than ‘turn knob to go faster’ – and realistic motion of ‘all the things other than the trains’ in the model world. That includes model crews that act like people, not just little figurines stuck here and there… watch the John Pechulis videos with Mike Bednar and friends to see the idea. There are a number of famous layouts that have a history, moving features, vignettes … and as with cartoons, they need not be in photorealistic, nietenzahlende precision to do that quite attractively. Much of the ‘renaissance’ the New York Times recently predicted for model ‘railroading’ was in crafting stories, and peripheral details, for the worlds in which trains incidentally move. It will be interesting to see what comes out of that.

Wise and caring mentoring has to be done via social media now – I think the last generations of people running storefronts with it are going down the westbound slope faster all the time. Who the next ‘generation’ of wise heads will be is, I think, an interesting question: our helping to inspire them to develop the ‘right stuff’ is critical.

33

Walthers is working on it. I think they were completely blind sided when Shinohara closed up.

Sheldon

34

JDawg,
As my mom used to say, it sounds like you have champagne taste and beer income. [:D]

This hobby is not too expensive. What you want to do in this hobby may be too expensive for your hobby budget, but that’s on you not the hobby. In yon olden days, guys would literally make freight cars out of cardboard and use staples for grabirons.

In your example, you could have easily bought old boxcars for $5 each. Decent used engines are routinely selling for $50 and DCC is not required for hobby participation nor is sound (right, Sheldon? [swg]). But if you want brand new expensive engines with DCC/Sound, brand new cars, etc., then yeah, it’s gonna cost you.

Managing one’s expectations is just as important as managing one’s budget.

As for anyone looking down on you, where has this happened, specifically? This is one of the most easy-going hobby forums around. I’ve been here since 2002 (and actually way before that), and while I don’t read every thread, I cannot recall any posts like that in the last 19 years. More often than not, what we get here are anti-rivet counter screeds from the “It’s my railroad and I’ll do what I want!” group.

Sheldon,
How many of those things you mention were manufactured before pre-orders? Answer: none.

The only chance of any of these things being made in non-brass form is via pre-orders. There’s just no way any of them are going into regular production to be available whenever you feel like buying one.

Why doesn’t the B&O historical society pay some manufacturer to make some B&O prototypes? We NH fans did, and that’s why we have NH stainless steel passenger cars in coach, parlor, diner and (coming soon) combine styles.

Overmod,
The BLI all-brass New Haven I-5 4-6-4 has working valve gear. When you put it in forward, the valve li

35

Since most model railroaders probably come from those who developed an appreciation of full-sized trains, what’s “needed” most in model railroading are enough “recruits” to carry things on.

But… the big railroads may be lacking in this regard. They’re just not as interesting today as they used to be, and with mergers, there’s not a whole lot of variety. The operations that there are, are drab. The engines pretty much look the same on everything.

And they’re certainly no longer friendly to non-railroaders who take an interest in them, in the ways they once were. It must be difficult to “get close enough” to see what’s going on, before someone chases you away.

I wouldn’t want to be working on the big engines today, and friends from work, also retired, feel the same way. The qualities that used to make the job a good one, are gone or are on the way out.

I reckon the only companies that are good to work for today are the short lines and regionals, even for lower pay. Perhaps some passenger/commuter here and there…

36

Paul,

I agree, I’m just pointing out that preorders have not been some sort of magic bullet that has made every desired product available.

I missed buying a couple of pieces of Athearn RTR a decade ago, nothing real special, but they fit my roster and would save me a paint job or two. I have yet to see them anywhere on the secondary market…

I get the preorder thing much more than do 5 guys all making Big Boys - that is amplified by the fact that I have no interest in a Big Boy… or a lot of the other “popular and famous” locomotives.

I could be wrong, but it seems to me there was much more product available 10 or 15 years ago than there is today?

Again, my wish list is pretty small, and I have the 140 locos I need to run the layout, and a hundred or more kits yet to build to complete the 1,000 car roster.

JDawg,

It took me 25 years to get to where I could build the 1,000 sq ft layout. Now at 50 years in I’m starting on the 1,500 sq ft layout.

I don’t think anyone is looking down on you. Don’t take the choices other make for themselves as a criticism of you or what you are doing.

You want DCC and sound, ok. I’m building a 1,500 sq ft layout without DCC and sound. Why? because I’m not impressed with onboard sound, and I want big time operations, long trains, with signaling and CTC - so that’s where I’m willing to put the money.

Sheldon

37

34 years old, a dad of two kids (13 years old and a 4 month old) and a sales engineer…

I would point out free time is nowhere what it was. Cell phones are not only a distraction, but it means work doesn’t stop at 5pm either. There are “free” nights I end up working where I know my dad wasn’t back in the day. I would also say traveling is easier than what it was(pre covid) which put a strain on families.

There are always articles (even in the 70’s) about where the new blood is coming from, the hobby is dying… etc. Well looks like it is still around. Fact is, you can only do so much.

For improvements to the experience.
better throttles. I think the protothrottle is too intense, but hitting buttons on the throttle like a remote control (prodigy express DCC)… is like watching tv.
signals and operating in general can be improved and made simpler.
We get too hung up on radius, track spacing, ho/n scale… I can see how a new person would just be lost.
in theory, it shouldn’t be a big lift to make a layout like the Heart of Georgia using Kato Unitrack with DCC.
prefer to the 30 minutes or 3 hour article by Lance Mindheim. Spot on. Sums up almost every time I get to play with train.

38

well, the costs of electronics generally come down on the long run. The R&D is basically paid off… I don’t think the technology of a basic decoder has changed that much. It should be below inflation. I would have expected a net decrease, in fact.

Simon

39

$15 for a decoder is not expencive. #2 There are lots of these, what you want. #3 What you want, there are a few out there, I personaly prefer dry transfers #4 Bachmann has been pushing this for years, works well too but I don’t like using my smart phone for this, prefer a throttle so selling my Bachmann one.

40

The hobby can be done on the cheap and I have bought most of my stuff that way even though I could afford to pay retail, why would I, that is not how I got to be where I am. If you ask me DCC and sound in an HO by Bachmann for $60 is pretty cheap, brand new form a B&M to boot. Most of my turnouts were brand new Shinohara code 70 for $12 again at a B&M, etc. etc. Ebay got me lots of stuff for real cheap like a Wathers RTR turntable for