looking for wiring info and it refers to putting feeders for each run. thanks
[#welcome] to the forum. Your post are delayed while you are in moderation. It keeps Borat and his sister out of the forum.
The more specific you can make your title (and this one is fine) and the more information you can give us, the better answers you will get.
Don’t know anyone in the forum named ‘IT’ nor how they define a the length of a run.
DCC, if that is what you are building, is more demanding than DC. Rail joiners, especially after weathering, and painting and wear and tear can be unreliable conductors of electricity.
I’m not sure where this rule of thumb came from, but a feeder every 6’ and every piece of track having a solder connection to the next rail or a feeder. As one of our gurus said recently, you can’t have too many feeders but you can have too few.
Too few can make circuit breakers unreliable, lead to poor running on the layout.
Turnouts are another variable. Some require insulated joiners. That means the rail beyond the turnout needs a feeder. It gets more complicated that that in that power in the turnout may depend on contact of the point to stock rails. There are some that advocate 6 wires to every turnout.
that’s for the reply, but still don’t understand what is meant by a “run”. Is a run simple the entire track? is it turnout to turnout?
We need more context to answer your question. Can you provide more details about what you are asking about?
Well, I’m certainly no DCC guy, nor do I use more than two wires from my power source to the entire layout.
However, I’d guess a “run” to be simply a length of bus wire (nothing to do with Greyhound) to a section of one’s layout. A “run” doesn’t specify a distance, so it would likely be whatever length is needed for your particular track plan.
It’s pretty simple, I think: when you wire a house, you “run” wires to the various rooms, just as you run wires to the various parts of your layout. In-turn, the “feeders” run power to the rails. No need to over-complicate things here.
Wayne
Maybe he’s referring to something in electricians “speek” as to a “home run” where the wire from a circuit goes directly to the main panel.
Example: A series of receptacles in a kitchen. The wire that feeds the receptacles, from the main panel to the first receptacle box, is the home run.
So, in terms of wiring a layout, using a bus with feeders, and dividing the layout into seperate power/control blocks, the bus from each block going back to the main power supply, could be considered a home run.
I dunno, just a quess?
Mike.
hang tight; i’ll find an example of what i’m referring to. thanks
ok, here’s an example of article I was looking at:
“The length of the run required is also a key factor in determining a proper bus size. Shorter runs will experience less voltage drop and can employ smaller wire. Generally, No. 12 to No. 14 wire is ideal for bus wiring in most scales. For feeders, No. 18 to No. 24 can be used. Since the feeders must be attached to the rails directly, size is a factor in smaller scales.”
So, again, what is determined as a ‘run’?
From that quote it sounds like the run is the total length of the layout from one point (beginning) to the other (end of run).
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-Kevin
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This is being made more complicated than it needs to be.
Assume that you have a point A and point B on the railroad. The run is simply the length of a wire or bundle of wires to get from point A to point B.
This is something one would write about if discussing DCC, so we will go with that.
A run is length of the bus that follows your track underneath the layout. That could be a tiny dioramma or it could Howard Zane’s 2800 square foot layout. The bus can also have a branch, called a sub bus that would feed a yard.
1/3 down the page is a chart based on scale and distance
https://dccwiki.com/Wire_Sizes_and_Spacing
As I hinted at earlier, voltage can drop off with the further it travels down the bus. Hence larger gauge wire is needed. Solid wire especially 12 ga is cumbersome to bend. For track feeders, you want solid wire and if it is a short run to the bus, 22 or 20 ga is adequate.
rda:
To my way of thinking:
You could have your power supply centred on a wall. Two wires going to the left for 25’ would be a run. Two wires going to the right for 40’ would be a different run. Two more wires going six feet to the right and then 19’ down a peninsula would be a third run.
As noted there are recommended practices for various lengths of run. Circuit breaker for each run!
If I am wrong, someone will gladly correct me.
Dave
As others have pointed out, the “run” is the distance from the power supply to the farthest track. Your power supply can be in the middle, with equal “runs” in each direction, or it can be on one end or the other, making the “run” longer, and wire size adjustments may have to be made, as the article you refferenced points out.
Mike.
A run is considered when it’s your turn to get the mail
It’s just too darn cold out in Minnesota
When it’s my turn to get mail I run out and run back quick
I hate when it’s my turn to get the mail
TF
OR, when someone needs to make a: “B double e double r un, beerrun” as sung by Todd Snider:
Mike.
Thanks Mike for keeping me in check
I don’t think I’ll need a beer run till Friday
Wednesday would be nice but I got to wxxk the rest of the week[(-D]
TF
Run = Distance (or length)
Run of trackage, run of bus wires, run of sub-bus…
In the context you cited, they’re worried that, depending on the type of wire used as a bus, you’ll experience X voltage loss the further it must travel down that wire. For 14 gauge wall wire in home construction, you’d not have to worry for at least 20 feet, and even then it would be minimal.
The power comes from my DCC power source to this terminal strip. From there, there are six runs that go down this 18’ bench like fingers.
Two go down each side to power the mainline tracks, one powers the yard and the other powers the turntable.
I just attach the last track feeder to the end of the buss wire, then I don’t have to have a discussion on what to do with the end of the buss wire.
It is overkill on the wiring but I had 600’ of 12g wire so why not.[(-D]
AWG 14 home (rated for 15 amp) wire surely is strung way more than 20 feet in most homes. What would be a reasonable maximum run of 14 AWG if used on a model RR DCC bus?
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For Model Railroad bus and Speaker Wire, I consider #10 the minimum wire size.
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-Kevin
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